Christ: He's Back Matraiya, Ram Bomjan Palden Dorje

Duh.
But lack of any credible evidence in an afterlife is what my lack of belief is based on, and your belief (presumably) is based on a very old and fictional book.
 
Its not clear what are the metaphysical aspects intrinsic to secularism that you are alluding to

nb - if you ar enot alluding to such things perhaps you can expand your statements and tell us what you are alluding to
The following suffices.

Metaphysics (from Greek: μετά (meta) = "after", φύσις (phúsis) = "nature") is the branch of philosophy concerned with explaining the nature of the world. It is the study of being or reality.[1] It addresses questions such as: What is the nature of reality? Is there a God? What is man's place in the universe?

A central branch of metaphysics is ontology, the investigation into what categories of things are in the world and what relations these things bear to one another. The metaphysician also attempts to clarify the notions by which people understand the world, including existence, objecthood, property, space, time, causality, and possibility.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metaphysics
Aside from ascribing existence to them, theology and the supernatural even fall under secular concerns. We just have a differing opinion about what constitutes them.

~Raithere
 
Duh.
But lack of any credible evidence in an afterlife is what my lack of belief is based on, and your belief (presumably) is based on a very old and fictional book.

Raises the question (the epistemological questiion too I might add) what you require for something to be declared true knowledge - as for scripture being fictional I doubt if you have or will do a comprehensive study of scripture and situate yourself by their instructions (which is usually the prerequisite that scriptures entail for coming to the platform of knowledge beyond mere faith) - so I am not sure how authoratative your statements are if you are trying to pass them off as something more than mere opinions
 
The following suffices.

Aside from ascribing existence to them, theology and the supernatural even fall under secular concerns. We just have a differing opinion about what constitutes them.

~Raithere

You're still not coming clear with what exactly are the metaphysical aspects of secularism and how such things are not intrinsically pertinent to religion (particularly since your definition mentioned determining the nature of god and the world)
 
You're still not coming clear with what exactly are the metaphysical aspects of secularism and how such things are not intrinsically pertinent to religion (particularly since your definition mentioned determining the nature of god and the world)

You're still asking rambling diversionary questions about the most trivial things. I don't think I've read a post from you with any substance for weeks now. Out of ideas?
 
I am just trying to clarify what raithere is saying

Actually I haven't been online so much in the last few weeks - but that aside if you have anything to say outside of character assassination please be my guest
 
I am just trying to clarify what raithere is saying

Actually I haven't been online so much in the last few weeks - but that aside if you have anything to say outside of character assassination please be my guest
I thought it would be nice if you stopped talking like obfuscation was a genetic birthright of yours.
 
As long as you don't hurt yourself while you having fun - but if you have anything related to the thread feel free to offer something
 
You're still not coming clear with what exactly are the metaphysical aspects of secularism and how such things are not intrinsically pertinent to religion (particularly since your definition mentioned determining the nature of god and the world)
I made no assertions about religion thus far, don't put words in my mouth. The comment I was responding to was this:

what to speak of secularism which is completely bereft of any metaphysical components

With which I disagree. I provided reference that metaphysics is not merely about the "supernatural" but about being, reality, existence, and meaning. Do I really need to point out that secular perspectives have as much to say, if not more, about these topics as religion? In fact I would go as far to say that secular treatments of these subjects are even more profound, as religion tends to simply place its conjecture off in the netherworld of imagined alternative realities and bury it in endless metaphor.

The reason for my response is your accusation is rather typical of the religious perspective of secular world-views; painting them as anemic, hollow, and somehow lacking the richness of human experience. I find this both amusing and irritating and entirely contrary to my own experience which tends to find theistic explanation trite and superficial when explored from within.

~Raithere
 
I made no assertions about religion thus far, don't put words in my mouth. The comment I was responding to was this:



With which I disagree. I provided reference that metaphysics is not merely about the "supernatural" but about being, reality, existence, and meaning. Do I really need to point out that secular perspectives have as much to say, if not more, about these topics as religion? In fact I would go as far to say that secular treatments of these subjects are even more profound, as religion tends to simply place its conjecture off in the netherworld of imagined alternative realities and bury it in endless metaphor.

The reason for my response is your accusation is rather typical of the religious perspective of secular world-views; painting them as anemic, hollow, and somehow lacking the richness of human experience. I find this both amusing and irritating and entirely contrary to my own experience which tends to find theistic explanation trite and superficial when explored from within.

~Raithere

I think we are both on different railway lines - You think I am misinterpretting what you are saying and from reading this last post I draw a mutual impression towards your reading of my statement

Originally I said

Its not so much about the process of gaining affiliation with something - its about the nature of what you are gaining affiliation with - like for instance identifying with a secular institution doesn't really affect anything since death visits everyone equally - however if one actually gains affiliation with god then that is a transcendental achievement - its not so much about cliques and societies - its about manifesting the qualities of purity, which is distinct from religious principles cultivated in the pursuit of economic development, self aggrandisement, sense gratification etc etc, what to speak of secularism which is completely bereft of any metaphysical components

to which you replied

You must be confusing metaphysics with the supernatural.

My point is that metaphysics is not intrinsic to secularism, since secularism can function with out without metaphysical components - religion on the other hand cannot function without metaphysical components, since many an atheist on this site has pointed out the limitations of religious principles in pursuit of sense gratification, economic development etc

Maybe we can take it from here ........
 
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Contents of a cigarette
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Below is a list of few of the chemicals and their harmful effects .

Acetone
Cyanide
Aluminum
DDT/Dieldrin
Ammonia
Ethenol
Arsenic
Formaldehyde
Benzene
Hydrogen cyanide
Butane
Lead
Cadmium
Methanol
Carbon monoxide
Nicotine
Carbon dioxide
Tar
Chloroform
Vinyl Chloride

http://www.medindia.net/patients/patientinfo/tobacco_cigarette.htm

And they still sell the things because Scientists are willing to testify in Court that it can't be proven that anybody ever died only from cigerette ingestion, that is, that nobody had yet died in a perfectly controlled experiment.

Now, if your precious Science would only make one positive assertion, then maybe we could finally get rid of Smoking. But they cling to their NOTHING CAN EVER BE PROVEN songs and dances... oh, not without their Million Dollar Grants.

We should examine the current doctrines of Scientific Protocols and notice what wonderful moneymakers they are. So Labor Intensive! We should measure the amount of money it takes to go from "WE KNOW IT ALREADY" to "NOW WE HAVE SCIENTIFIC PROOF".

But the drawback there is that Science refuses to endorce any Real World particulars. Even a Zillion Real World Particulars is not enough to bring Science to a Generalization. And that is just stupid. A failure to admit the obvious. And because they are greedy. "Give us a Grant first".
 
While mystic perfections are certainly amazing there is nothing intrinsically theistic about them - such yogis are relatively common in the himalyan area and they can do many things that are amazing - its just that being an empowered representative of god requires more than mundane miracles - like even if you want to examine the miracles of jesus you can see that he was doing more than miracles, and in fact they only seemed to be used to convince the less intelligent class of his potency (like for instance his instructions are quite substantial) - there are many so called incarnations in india but it requires a bit of discrimination honed by scripture to determine whether there is more to theistic exhibition than miracles - even in traditional indian scriptures there are many examples of personalities who had tremendous yogic potency but who were completely atheistic - and it terms of contemporary times it tends to be the case that such yogi's who rise to fame by dint of their exhibitions secure a bit of name fame and adoration and then fall down

Good observation. There may be no "Theistic" elements to Supernatural Phenomena, but there is always a Spiritual Content.

Every Miracle is done with the aid of some Sponsoring Power from the Spiritual World, and not all Sponsoring Powers are Perfect Angels.

But we can generally tell the Good from the Bad as per the results.

Even then it might take some discernment. For instance, The Archangel Michael, a Big Supporter of Justice, is in charge of the Avenging Angels. When Civilizations grow so corrupt that they need to be wiped aside to make room for new beginnings, then, it is not the Demons from Hell that see over the death and destruction, but Michael's Regiments. It may look very bad at the time, but a New Civilization cannot rise up until the Old is out of the way. We could not have had 11th Century France -- the Land of a Thousand Cathedrals -- if the decadent Roman Senators had still been calling the shots.
 
Interesting that religions use miracles (observed materialistic phenomenon) to support the supernatural. Interesting that they use what little science supports their claims while denying that which conflicts with it.

Actually, when Science denies the Miraculous, they fall back on only one 'certainty' which they insist upon, and that is that "No generality can ever be absolutely proven until an infinite number of particulars all agree".

Well, given that standard for 'proof', then NOTHING can ever be proven.

Check Hume. Check Kant.

All knowledge can be trashed.

And it is the same logic with which they attack Religion.
 
Christ: He’s Back!

I’m certainly a Catholic, but I am glad that I have carefully been hedging my bets, as it seems that in these obvious End Times we are now experiencing the Coming Again of a Great Messiah, but not from where a good Catholic would at first expect, not from a Judeo/Christian Source. Apparently God learned His lesson there the last time. It appears that our Modern Messiah may come as the Matraiya Buddha. It may be that he is already here, and is now busy preparing himself for the role He will have to play.

He is a young man of Nepal, sixteen years old, and his name is variously spelled: Ram Bomjon, Ram Bamjan, Ram Bomjan. His ‘Buddhist’ name is Palden Dorje. The media has been calling him the “Buddha Boy”. So far he is famous for having had not eaten or drank for some six months while in silent meditation.

Of course, many people are skeptical when they hear of this, and the media only encourages such skepticism by reporting the story most marginally, partially and selectively – to please their modern skeptical and dismissive audiences. It is represented that Groups of Researchers are being consistently turned away. However, a more thoroughly researched account points to a great many verifications that the wider Media has been ignoring. Check this site: http://www.buddhadharma.com/Palden.html
We find that the young man was a trained ascetic from a very young age, and has the endorsements of his local Guru, a famous and high ranking regional Guru, and a Committee of Holy Men who all suppose him to be the Matraiya Buddha in the making. Now I hate to reveal this about the Religious Character, but it certainly is far from common for the Old Men of any Religion to acknowledge any ascendancy or superiority in any Young Men of their Religion. It is more common, even ordinary, for the Old Men of Religion to have great contempt for youth. So it MUST be a great and significant endorsement that so many Religious Old Men are willing to surrender their claims of self importance and to take their positions behind and underneath this lad.

Additionally, the Government of Nepal, in order to well regulate their own jurisdictions, sent a committee of nine specialists to study this New Matraiya, and they also came away with a solid endorsement.

In this context, when a group of Secular Atheist Skeptics arrived, introducing themselves with a slurry of rude questions and a front of obnoxiousness, well, the people, already reassured by their own Holy Men to the satisfaction of their Religion, and already reassured by their own Government Researchers, to satisfy their modern sense of rationality, well, people saw no need for this redundant group of slandering atheists and chased them away without a second thought. The Media pretends that this only group that was rejected was the only group that ever applied. One wonders why the Media would be so reluctant to express just why the local populations were so thoroughly convinced while focusing only on the smallest group which was dissatisfied only because its hostility put them at the greatest distance from the event. Perhaps the Media thought that they could save words by reporting ignorance, as informed knowledge would take so many more columns.

Here allow me to outline some of the details that the media choose rather to set aside. Besides the miraculous fasting (and any small town could soon uncover any fraud occurring there… as it would be no easy feat to sneak food miles into the jungle day after day without detection), there have been several Christ-like miracles. In two separate instances persons who were known to be dumb gained the ability to speak after having come into Our Young Lad’s presence. Then there has been the Wonder of the Lights – as the young Lad sits in meditation in the dark of night he glows in various colors – green at 10 o’clock, yellow by eleven, and the White Light at Midnight. Indeed, that Government Group that investigated, shot a video in which they recorded lights going in and coming out of the Our Young Buddha.

It was reported lately that Our Young Man went missing, but it was subsequently reported that he had only become concerned about the growing carnival atmosphere around the tree in which he was meditating. Several snake bites and then a mysterious fire at this one location were enough to convince Our Buddha in Becoming to pick up and find a better place to finish his Six Year Meditation. You see, on May 16th 2005 he had announced that he would need to complete a six year course of Meditation. So, as yet, he has only just less then one year completed of this six year program. And, again, incidentally, we are handed one more occurrence to reinforce the Big Picture View that the Essential End Time Episode will occur in 2012.

Now, as a personal observation, yes, I think this Young Man will be the Second Coming of Christ, the Modern Messiah, the Matraiya Buddha. But He is not there yet. He has just the blend of vanity and humility that makes for Spiritual Greatness. He would not cut his hair with the rest of his Monkish Fellows while on pilgrimage (having a head of gloriously thick hair), and now He is the only one of his district to suppose Himself to NOT be of the stuff of a Buddha, but claims nothing more than Lama status, being a ‘Rinpoche’, or a Bodhisattva -- all while the Old Experts are saying “Yeah, yeah, sure sure” but nonetheless expect the highest things from this Young Man. Indeed, about 7 months into His meditation, his brother heard him saying that to capture his attention he must be addressed with the Mantra “OM NAMO BUDDHA GYANI”, which is the local patois for the Sanskrit AUM NAMO BUDDHA JNANI – it is a Mantra addressing the Enlightened Buddha. What can we infer? Well, the World now has its Caterpillar in the process of becoming the Butterfly. It took 40 days of fasting in the Wilderness to make a Messiah. It will take 6 years of fasting in the Jungle to give us a Matraiya. Now, we must consider that these things are never entirely preordained. We only need to review the disastrous end results of the Messiah’s short curtailed career to see that these things do not necessarily always work out for the best. So, for this new Young Matraiya, we should all probably pitch in at the level of the Collective Consciousness and wish, pray, and meditate for his support. Add our fasts and whatever penances we do for his benefit and progress. Perhaps this popular support at the root level will make all the difference later on when the elite classes of our Societies will deliberate on crucifying Him as well. Humanity must stand behind this Matraiya, this Messiah, this Time, or again we might lose out and then have to wait another two thousand years for our next slim opportunity.

Anyway, I would suggest we all take up a small ritualistic practice for the next six years, of several times a day repeating a few times “AUM NAMO BUDDHA JNANI” or “OM NAMO BUDDHA GYANI”. And then to wish our Young Man luck and good fortune. He may be our last and best chance. Just envision the possibility that this Young Matraiya could forge the link that joins Humanity to Divinity – the link that joins the Collective Consciousness to the Divine Consciousness. He might be the One Spark that will start the Universal Fire. Like those Knowledgeable Holy Men of Nepal, lets all swallow our pride and get behind this young man.


Nothing special about him, he's one of many. Maybe he is rare for Nepal, globally, there are likely millions like him.
 
Secondly, why would anyone want to be the Messiah? That's a horrible label to give a child, it's going to ruin this childs life in my opinion.
 
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