'testa' coil? I presume you mean 'Tesla' coil?
Now stop wasting bandwidth and go get an education.
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Capacitor to store lightning?
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'testa' coil? I presume you mean 'Tesla' coil?
Now stop wasting bandwidth and go get an education.
Come Back Benny!!!!!
Don't let them steal your thread.
Don't let them steal your thread.
chaos1956, who does not understand that a Tesla coil is an RF transformer with high number of turns in the secondary or about inductance limiting brief pulse currents, Horsebox and a few others seem like an adequate replacement for Benny's nonsense.
So, chaos1956, who does not understand that a Tesla coil is an RF transformer with high number of turns in the secondary or about inductance limiting brief pulse currents, Horsebox and a few others seem like an adequate replacement for Benny's nonsense.
Huzzah!
But if you are listening Benny, please come back as well.
Huzzah!
But if you are listening Benny, please come back as well.
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Every time we get an entertaining loony, the scientists chase them off
As I am one of those "scientists" I will make restitution for my crime:Every time we get an entertaining loony, the scientists chase them off
Namely I want all to know that atoms do not exist. All matter can be divided into as tiny pieces as you like, if you have "sharper knives" (better division tools). The proof of this is straight forward if you know how surface tension increases as the radius decreases. People only think that for example a copper atom exists but the fact is that at the size of the postulated atom, the surface tension is enormous. None of man's current tools can overcome that surface tension binding force and make two pieces of copper, each half the size of a so called copper atom.
Some will argue that a copper atom does exist as high energy particle beams can split the so-called copper atom into other particles, but all that proves is that the old alchemists were right. - One type of matter can be transformed into another with high energy input.
When man learns how to more genteelly over come the surface tension, then half atomic sized pieces of copper will be possible to create. It is sort of like man does not yet have the right "detergent" to reduce the surface tension to make smaller pieces of copper than the so-call atomic size limit.
I have made great progress in development of an effective detergent, but I can not yet go into details as my patent on the process is not yet granted. I expect to make a fortune and be greatly honored, mainly because with my smaller pieces of copper, the connecting wires in printed circuits can be smaller and all modern electronic devices can be smaller and lighter in weight. Also when they are discarded, there will be less environmental pollution.
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Billy, that's nowhere near as good as Benny.
Good try, but in comparison with Benny it comes.......
Well, lets say that if if was a horse race with seven horses, and one of the horses was suffering with bubonic plague, you would be seventh.
Sorry.
This site just doesn't know a good thing when it sees it.
Good try, but in comparison with Benny it comes.......
Well, lets say that if if was a horse race with seven horses, and one of the horses was suffering with bubonic plague, you would be seventh.
Sorry.
This site just doesn't know a good thing when it sees it.
I know, but I don't have time to post nonsense in many separate posts and find it hard to contradict myself in every third post - I suffer from the "consistency" hang up.
I didn't say it was easy.
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It ain't easy being cheesy.
series
As Pete says, the thing to do is trying to tap it before it discharges. Find a way to hoist a wire to about 10 miles, and you could tab some energy.
The power of a lightning bolt is indeed enormous, but the energy is rather moderate, only a few kilowatt-hours. This is because the duration is so short, only a few micro-seconds. It seems to be longer, but that is due to two things: The flash persists on our retina for a considerable fraction of a second. Each lightning bolt is actually a series of very short discharges.
As Pete says, the thing to do is trying to tap it before it discharges. Find a way to hoist a wire to about 10 miles, and you could tab some energy.
The power of a lightning bolt is indeed enormous, but the energy is rather moderate, only a few kilowatt-hours. This is because the duration is so short, only a few micro-seconds. It seems to be longer, but that is due to two things: The flash persists on our retina for a considerable fraction of a second. Each lightning bolt is actually a series of very short discharges.
Sorry, Captain, but it's not my thread. It was begun by someone who wanted to know whether it was possible to store "lightning". Unfortunately, he didn't know how to ask the question properly.
I (and others) provided some information, over a period of a few months, but I left because the people who were offering serious information weren't being taken seriously any more.
I'm still working on my project and am delighted to see some progress in areas that I care about, such as on-the-road charging stations for electric vehicles.
Benny
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I have some little-known information to share. Erupting volcanos can produce lightning.
This is significant for two reasons.
1. There's a volcano on Hawaii that erupts continuously, thus solving the problem of where to find the lightning.
2. Hawaii, because of its' remote location, has higher energy costs than other places in the U.S.
Here's a YouTube clip (1 minute, 5 seconds) of a Hawaiian volcano erupting with lightning that can be seen lighting up the clouds.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y3aqFCT87_E
My company will look into the development of a Hawaii-based system for collecting, storing, and the utilization of volcano-based lightning sources, probably after the system has been perfected somewhere in the continental US.
Benny, an admirer of Mr. Franklin
This is significant for two reasons.
1. There's a volcano on Hawaii that erupts continuously, thus solving the problem of where to find the lightning.
2. Hawaii, because of its' remote location, has higher energy costs than other places in the U.S.
Here's a YouTube clip (1 minute, 5 seconds) of a Hawaiian volcano erupting with lightning that can be seen lighting up the clouds.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y3aqFCT87_E
My company will look into the development of a Hawaii-based system for collecting, storing, and the utilization of volcano-based lightning sources, probably after the system has been perfected somewhere in the continental US.
Benny, an admirer of Mr. Franklin
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Hi, all. Here's a quick update on my project.
There seem to be two very different approaches to the long-standing problem of extracting useful electricity from lightning, depending mostly on whether you're a theoretical scientist or a practical businessman.
In theory, one can use a brute-force approach to the problem. Spend the nearly unlimited amount of money that your government offers for alternative energy projects and buy an extremely large number of HV capacitors, by that I mean that their voltage ratings will be at least 100 KV. Links to the manufacturers of some of these capacitors have been published earlier in this thread. After you've bought the caps, spend even more money on some land and a building or two where you can pay an electrician to wire them up in a massive bank, with a few thousand current paths, plus a building for your office, with the appropriate electrical separation from your HV collection and processing equipment.
Each and every current path in your energy storage system will have a few thousand HV capacitors, all wired in series. If you take this approach, and your electrician is competent enough, you will be able to collect all the energy that reaches your collection point, AKA lightning rod, which the US Patent Office calls an air terminal, but who cares about patents when you have the U.S. Government "helping" you in your project, right?
If, on the other hand, you're a practical businessman, and you have a limited supply of funds to spend on this project, and you would dearly like to see a return on your own personal capital, as well as a regular source of income in the future for yourself, so that you can support your family and pay for the expenses of your business, including an office staff and investors, then first, get a patent on something that's never been done before.
I want to say here, for the benefit of those who haven't read this thread in the past, that I have an idea for an invention, one that isn't covered by any patent that I can see so far, and I've read the text of every patent in the numbered class and subclass that I think my patent will go into.
With a patent in my name, the company I will set up, after the patent has been issued, will begin charging the company's HV caps with some or all of the voltage of a lightning strike. I'm being deliberately vague here because any patent submission must be an unpublished idea or the US Government won't issue the patent in the first place.
The electrical equipment will be a capital expense for the company. Most of it will be reusable, too. The HV caps can be charged during an electrical storm, discharged sometime afterwards, and then charged again when another electrical storm comes.
The discharging process is a relativelyl simple matter. The circuitry is covered in any one of a number of electrical textbooks. Technicians will discharge the HV caps one at a time, in a manner that will regulate the discharging voltage and the current to a high degree.
Some of the stored energy from the lightning bolt(s) will be used to power the normal electrical needs of my company office and the rest is likely to be directed into the presumably profitable endothermic chemical reaction called water electrolysis. A low-voltage DC electric current will be sent through a supply of purified water, converting it into hydrogen and oxygen, which will be collected, stored, and sold separately to two different sets of paying customers, thus producing the revenue that my investors will demand, and keeping my company profitable and my family fed, clothed, and housed for a long time.
The bonus for the country, if the government issues the patent and approves all the commercial aspects of the company, is that any lightning bolt that hits and is processed by my electrical equipment won't be hitting (and damaging) people, homes, personal property, commercial property, or government property, and it won't be starting any wildfires that destroy forested areas and burn the animals that live there.
There seem to be two very different approaches to the long-standing problem of extracting useful electricity from lightning, depending mostly on whether you're a theoretical scientist or a practical businessman.
In theory, one can use a brute-force approach to the problem. Spend the nearly unlimited amount of money that your government offers for alternative energy projects and buy an extremely large number of HV capacitors, by that I mean that their voltage ratings will be at least 100 KV. Links to the manufacturers of some of these capacitors have been published earlier in this thread. After you've bought the caps, spend even more money on some land and a building or two where you can pay an electrician to wire them up in a massive bank, with a few thousand current paths, plus a building for your office, with the appropriate electrical separation from your HV collection and processing equipment.
Each and every current path in your energy storage system will have a few thousand HV capacitors, all wired in series. If you take this approach, and your electrician is competent enough, you will be able to collect all the energy that reaches your collection point, AKA lightning rod, which the US Patent Office calls an air terminal, but who cares about patents when you have the U.S. Government "helping" you in your project, right?
If, on the other hand, you're a practical businessman, and you have a limited supply of funds to spend on this project, and you would dearly like to see a return on your own personal capital, as well as a regular source of income in the future for yourself, so that you can support your family and pay for the expenses of your business, including an office staff and investors, then first, get a patent on something that's never been done before.
I want to say here, for the benefit of those who haven't read this thread in the past, that I have an idea for an invention, one that isn't covered by any patent that I can see so far, and I've read the text of every patent in the numbered class and subclass that I think my patent will go into.
With a patent in my name, the company I will set up, after the patent has been issued, will begin charging the company's HV caps with some or all of the voltage of a lightning strike. I'm being deliberately vague here because any patent submission must be an unpublished idea or the US Government won't issue the patent in the first place.
The electrical equipment will be a capital expense for the company. Most of it will be reusable, too. The HV caps can be charged during an electrical storm, discharged sometime afterwards, and then charged again when another electrical storm comes.
The discharging process is a relativelyl simple matter. The circuitry is covered in any one of a number of electrical textbooks. Technicians will discharge the HV caps one at a time, in a manner that will regulate the discharging voltage and the current to a high degree.
Some of the stored energy from the lightning bolt(s) will be used to power the normal electrical needs of my company office and the rest is likely to be directed into the presumably profitable endothermic chemical reaction called water electrolysis. A low-voltage DC electric current will be sent through a supply of purified water, converting it into hydrogen and oxygen, which will be collected, stored, and sold separately to two different sets of paying customers, thus producing the revenue that my investors will demand, and keeping my company profitable and my family fed, clothed, and housed for a long time.
The bonus for the country, if the government issues the patent and approves all the commercial aspects of the company, is that any lightning bolt that hits and is processed by my electrical equipment won't be hitting (and damaging) people, homes, personal property, commercial property, or government property, and it won't be starting any wildfires that destroy forested areas and burn the animals that live there.
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Give a man the right to change his mind. When this thread was active, there was a lot of criticism, some of it misdirected at me personally and some of it published by people who couldn't believe that it was possible to collect any of the energy from lightning.
They're probably still wondering whether a dam on the Colorado River could ever produce any electricity.
They're probably still wondering whether a dam on the Colorado River could ever produce any electricity.
Here's a technical examination of the brute-force approach that I don't think could ever get anyone a U.S. Patent.
Using the nearly unlimited amount of money that you theoreticians love to play with, buy a few million HV caps. Each one should have a voltage rating of at least 100 KV. Caps with even higher voltage ratings were highlighted with links earlier in this thread.
Then have them delivered to the government-approved site where you and your engineers will be building the government-approved capacitor bank. Connect each of them with high-current connectors, and arranged in rows of series caps with each row connected to a current divider that has thousands of current paths.
Let's talk numbers for a minute. The maximum current rating for a normal, negatively-charged lightning bolt is about 100 KAmps, so let's put together a current divider that has, say, 1,000 branches. Simple arithmetic says that each branch will only have to handle 100 amps. The arithmetic is simple as long as you can deal with numbers that have lots of zeros in them. So far, so good.
Now let's talk about voltage. The maximum voltage for a normal negatively-charged lightning bolt is about 500 MVolts. Let's say hat every current branch has the capacity to store 600 MVolts because it has 3,000 series caps in it, and that each cap is rated at 200 KAmps. Earlier in this thread, I posted a link to a manufacturer of caps with this exact voltage rating. This arrangement is similar to the resistor-based voltage dividers that we all learned about in our first-year electrical classes.
In a divider with 10 identical resistors, the voltage that is measured across each resistor will be a tenth of the total. If you wire 10 identical caps in series, and then apply a DC voltage across all ten, then each cap will be charged up to a tenth of the voltage that is applied across the series. All you engineers have to do is to add some zeros to this concept. Instead of ten series caps, you have 1,000 or 3,000. Instead of each series cap having a voltage rating of 25 volts, each one in the series has a voltage rating of 250 KV, and you have a thousand branches, all wired in parallel to divide up the current.
Nothing I've said here in this message or anywhere else in this thread divulges the electrical details of my application for a U.S. Patent. I could legally tell you all in extensive electrical detail my idea. If I did that, I just couldn't legally receive a patent after that due to the strict regulations of the U.S. Patent Office. They require that any patent application must be an unpublished idea. I haven't published my idea yet, in this thread, or any other SciForums thread, or anywhere else for that matter, and I'm not about to start now.
What I've just told you is, in my opinion, a workable idea for storing every last bit of the energy in a lightning bolt. My patent submission won't mention lightning at all. It will simply be a method of charging a capacitor, but this method will allow for a variety of DC charging sources. It will also allow for some very high-voltage inputs. Any incoming voltage that exceeds the capacity of the system will simply be transferred to an electrical ground where it can't hurt the caps in the system or anything else. The details of this must remain a secret for me to have any chance of receiving a patent.
Good luck to all.
Benny, an admirer of Mr. Franklin, possibly the most talented American who never became President.
Using the nearly unlimited amount of money that you theoreticians love to play with, buy a few million HV caps. Each one should have a voltage rating of at least 100 KV. Caps with even higher voltage ratings were highlighted with links earlier in this thread.
Then have them delivered to the government-approved site where you and your engineers will be building the government-approved capacitor bank. Connect each of them with high-current connectors, and arranged in rows of series caps with each row connected to a current divider that has thousands of current paths.
Let's talk numbers for a minute. The maximum current rating for a normal, negatively-charged lightning bolt is about 100 KAmps, so let's put together a current divider that has, say, 1,000 branches. Simple arithmetic says that each branch will only have to handle 100 amps. The arithmetic is simple as long as you can deal with numbers that have lots of zeros in them. So far, so good.
Now let's talk about voltage. The maximum voltage for a normal negatively-charged lightning bolt is about 500 MVolts. Let's say hat every current branch has the capacity to store 600 MVolts because it has 3,000 series caps in it, and that each cap is rated at 200 KAmps. Earlier in this thread, I posted a link to a manufacturer of caps with this exact voltage rating. This arrangement is similar to the resistor-based voltage dividers that we all learned about in our first-year electrical classes.
In a divider with 10 identical resistors, the voltage that is measured across each resistor will be a tenth of the total. If you wire 10 identical caps in series, and then apply a DC voltage across all ten, then each cap will be charged up to a tenth of the voltage that is applied across the series. All you engineers have to do is to add some zeros to this concept. Instead of ten series caps, you have 1,000 or 3,000. Instead of each series cap having a voltage rating of 25 volts, each one in the series has a voltage rating of 250 KV, and you have a thousand branches, all wired in parallel to divide up the current.
Nothing I've said here in this message or anywhere else in this thread divulges the electrical details of my application for a U.S. Patent. I could legally tell you all in extensive electrical detail my idea. If I did that, I just couldn't legally receive a patent after that due to the strict regulations of the U.S. Patent Office. They require that any patent application must be an unpublished idea. I haven't published my idea yet, in this thread, or any other SciForums thread, or anywhere else for that matter, and I'm not about to start now.
What I've just told you is, in my opinion, a workable idea for storing every last bit of the energy in a lightning bolt. My patent submission won't mention lightning at all. It will simply be a method of charging a capacitor, but this method will allow for a variety of DC charging sources. It will also allow for some very high-voltage inputs. Any incoming voltage that exceeds the capacity of the system will simply be transferred to an electrical ground where it can't hurt the caps in the system or anything else. The details of this must remain a secret for me to have any chance of receiving a patent.
Good luck to all.
Benny, an admirer of Mr. Franklin, possibly the most talented American who never became President.
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For DC that is true, but for pulses lasting a microsecond the inductance, which is a geometric property, will dominate and be much larger for the capacitors far from the central current source than those next to it.
If there has been no change in the rules/law you can apply for patent on a publicly disclosed concept/device/ etc. provided you do so in less than one year from the date of first disclosure.
BTW welcome back. Times are tougher now and we need the amusing lifts your posts usually give.
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