ask me a question about islam

[fadeaway humper]

Do Muslims really believe that half the Earth's population is comprised by invisible, mischievous goblins called djinn?

If the answer is affirmative, how can Muslims expect to be taken seriously by rational human beings?

 

[Knife]

Always, the Qur'an is always relevant.



Now you are playing with words. Do you mean stiking on/at the head in a battle of swords or the murder of men that are not fighting the Muslims. If you mean the second that no. It cannot be used to justify beheading.



I never claimed that so this info is irrelevant to me.



The quote is "correct" but what I advised you is, if you want to really know the truth and not simply confirm your prejudice by finding pre-kooked, cut and paste quotations from sites committed agains Islam, what I advice you is to go to Muslim scholar sources and learn from them how they handle that material. If you wanted to know how the Pakistani thought and handled in their wars with the Indians you should not ask the Indians about it while they still believe they are at war with the Pakistani.



I was reffering to how you try and "learn" about the subject.



I do. And that great man -may allah be please with him- does too.



Not as much as you might think.



Their throats were not slit.

May you find peace and may it find you.

bruce, wa 3layk as-salaam. careful there buddy, losing your cool a little. path has full rights to his opinion.

path, more than one person has already admitted that it is there in the Quran. what more do you want? and yes, there are people out there who are taking it literally, which is really bad; confucias (sp?) once said "learning without thinking is useless, thinking without learning is dangerous." this is a problem and a big one. but this problem exists way before islam; twisting meanings, deceiving people with words and false pretences. no one, of any religion, race can deny that it hasnt happened to them. ghengis khan confused honour with genocide. the spanish inquisition confused missions with torture. the british confused colonialism with bringing the rest of the world up to speed. nazis confused vanity with ethnic cleansing. and yes, muslims are confusing jihad with terrorism.

there are very few religions that do not contain very similar statements that if taken out of context could be abused. even the shaolin monks were taught martial arts and critical strike points on the body.

peace.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

path has full rights to his opinion.

you don't say.

 

[Knife]

Do Muslims really believe that half the Earth's population is comprised by invisible, mischievous goblins called djinn?

If the answer is affirmative, how can Muslims expect to be taken seriously by rational human beings?

please read carefully, choice of words plays a big part here.

muslims do believe in jinn. it is not known what percentage of earth they cover, nor is it known their poplulation. and they are not described as mischievous goblins. they are merely another creation by God.

let us assume you follow any one of the major religions. then you must believe in similar to one of the following: islam/christianity/judaism: then you must believe in angels/satan/etc. if you are bhuddist: then you beleive on reincarnation. if you are a shintoist: the nyou believe in the spiritual power of nature. and so on. so why is irrational to believe in jinn.

how can any followers of these be expected to be taken seriously by your rationale?

just because you dont see something doesnt mean it doesnt exist. people thought that in the depths of sea, no creatures existed. as age moves on and we are able to go deeper, we are observing not only life but elaborate creatures.

if you told the majority of the world one hundred years ago that someone would land on the moon, they would tell you that you were irrational. was it gallileo or newton, who was thought to be irrational claiming that the world was round....or was that columbus....regardless, it was in the Quran 1400 years ago.

now assuming, that your are not one these major religions, then I think you are asking the wrong questions and seeking the wrong answers.

peace.

 

[fadeaway humper]

now assuming, that your are not one these major religions, then I think you are asking the wrong questions and seeking the wrong answers.

peace.

Thank you very much for your kind answer. May you clarify what you would consider to be "wrong questions" and "wrong answers" in this context?

 

[Preacher_X]

(1)

the Quran is the literal Word of Allah, all mighty. it is not man made and has not been changed. Muhammed (saw) was an illeterate and could not read or write. the Quran was revealed to him(saw) over 23 years by the Angel Jibreal (Gabriel). Jibreal recited the Quran and Muhammed (saw) memorised it and then said it to his followers who memorised it also and wrote it down.

the Quran was revealed 1400 years ago and has not been altered since. it has 114 chapters (called Surahs in Arabic) and 6,666 verses in total. the longest chapter (Surah) is Surah Baqara which is 286 verses and the shortes is Surah Kowthar which is only 3 verses (about a line long).

(2)

the Quran is the literal word of God and is what Islam is based on. the Quran is 100% accurate and unaltered. Muslims also use the Hadeeths (the sayings of the Prophets). there are tens of thousands of these but the most accurate ones are all in a book called Bukhari. the hadeeth are much more detailed and also describe what many of the Verses of the Quran mean.

(3)

the Bible and the Torah (and also a few other books) are also holy books in Islam but were changed by man. either by rich men who though the Bibles teaching was harmful to their evil ways or people who altered Bible and then changed it to make money. becasue of this, the previous books are not followed anymore and the Quran is the final.

(4)

the Quran was not written by man and Allah challenged all of humainty to produce one chapter to rival the Quran (in Arabic) if they are doubtful of the Quran (and the shortest chapter is only a line long). the Quran is too beautiful, rythmic and poetic to be man made and even the translations do not match the original beauty of the Quran.

and people did try, many people. Islam was originally detesed by the Arabs and everybody worked to get rid of it by having wars with Muslims, trying to kill the Prophet (saw) etc. and the poets and scholars at the time tried to meet this challange as did many others, Christians, Jews, the west (to try and bring the destruction of the Ottomon Empire (and Islamic empire) everybody tried to do this for HUNDREDS and HUNDREDS of years, in the end the enemies of Islam gave up and moved on to another way to destroy Islam - to change the way Muslims think and to divide them. and indeed, they disbeliers since the 19th centruy havbe finally succeded in this and the Islamic world is in the mess it is now.

Hope is not lost though, the situation of the Muslims and the state of the world and the people in general was all prophicesed and detailed to us 1400 years ago. all of the hundreds of Prophices the Quran makes have started to rapidly come true since the victory of the disbelivers (19th century onwards). almost all of the hundreds of specific signs and prophicies have come true indicating the victory is very near for the Muslims. the current era we are living in is called the "Dajal" era and the Dajal socail movement, govermant and society have all arrived and very soon the actual Dajal (the person) will arive.

any enough of that, hope i answered your Question.

peace//

 

[Knife]

Thank you very much for your kind answer. May you clarify what you would consider to be "wrong questions" and "wrong answers" in this context?

usually, one who does not believe in a Supreme Being who created the universe and earth...etc. etc. it is hard to convey the meanig and feeling of blind faith.

let me try to continue this from a different angle.

the parent/child relationship. if a parent told a child not to touch fire because it burns, then the child proceeds to touch it anyway and gets burned. the child has learned a lesson in two ways. one, it learned the parents verbal advise was correct: fire burns. second, it learned from experiance/evidence that: fire burns. now the child believes, blindly with out a shadow of a doubt, that fire burns.

the next day the child is told knives are sharp. the same things happens. and the child learns a lesson through two ways.

now on the third day, the child is told guns are dangerous. based on past experiance that the parent is right, the child now has blind faith that the parent is wise and follows instructions. i am sure we have all seen cartoons and were told as children that it is all "make believe". and yes, some kids do jump off buildings thinking they are superman.

the questions that must be posed is, why did the child have blind faith? my answer is, based on the evidence presented to him. therefore, if presented with evidence from a reputable source, why doubt other information from the same source. you naturally start believing blindly. but that does not mean you cant question things and reflect on them.

i hope that clears some things up.

peace.

 

[everneo]

I suggest you read about that battle. If you had done that, you would have now that te Muslims broke the more numerous Quraish (if memory serves) five or six times. And then some of the Muslims eager for the spoils did not obey the command of the prophet -peace be upon him- and left their posts exposing the rear of the army. The Muslims let themselves down by not being obedient to the words of the Prophet -peace be upon him. God layed victory in their hands but out of His Wisdom and to teach them a lesson denied it to them. The lesson: "Obey the prophet -peace be upon him.

Yeah, i remember reading that battle, Uhud.
Lot of lessons, indeed. Like,

Run after the spoils - loose the prophet ;
the messenger might be dead - but his God is alive (Anas ibn Nazr) ;
Blood feuds of Ummayad and Hasimite clans - mutilation of Hamza's body and chewing of his liver ;
The man who saved Islam that day - La fattah ilah Ali, La saif ilah Zulfiqar (There is no hero like Ali, No sword is like his sword).

..and goes on ; some interesting, some disgusting. The lesson was, Allah would not be as assuring as in Badr if Allah is taken for granted. Md. was almost dead that day. Peace be upon him.

No. You imagine they do. You want or are pressed to belive that. Not one of them does.

Not my imagination, their imagination of Allah's blessing for their deeds.

 

[path]

bruce, wa 3layk as-salaam. careful there buddy, losing your cool a little. path has full rights to his opinion.

path, more than one person has already admitted that it is there in the Quran. what more do you want?

Nothing more my original intention in mentioning that was simply in response to the article that surrenderer posted which stated that it wasn't mentioned in the quran.

and yes, there are people out there who are taking it literally, which is really bad; confucias (sp?) once said "learning without thinking is useless, thinking without learning is dangerous." this is a problem and a big one. but this problem exists way before islam; twisting meanings, deceiving people with words and false pretences. no one, of any religion, race can deny that it hasnt happened to them. ghengis khan confused honour with genocide. the spanish inquisition confused missions with torture. the british confused colonialism with bringing the rest of the world up to speed. nazis confused vanity with ethnic cleansing. and yes, muslims are confusing jihad with terrorism.

Very well said I agree with you 100%. My main point (even though I know it often comes across as bashing islam) is that religious dogma of any kind is a very slippery slope that tends to separate the infidels from the chosen people. Once you do that then the infidels become less than human to the belivers (the jews were less than human to the nazis for example). After that, despite the best of intention on the part of some of the believers, it is all down hill.

there are very few religions that do not contain very similar statements that if taken out of context could be abused. even the shaolin monks were taught martial arts and critical strike points on the body.

Again I agree I left christianity because of similar reasons.

 

[fadeaway humper]

i hope that clears some things up.

Well yes, you believe "blindly" because you have "evidence". I guess that we just have different conceptions of what "evidence" is, that's all. At any rate, I wish to high heaven that all "blind believers" were as reasonable as you. It would be no problem then.

peace.

Backatya!

 

[OliverJ]

What would you do is Al Q had a safehouse in your area or neighborhood -- you preach the proper Islamac teachings....... so my question is....... and yes it is in regards to your faith....... what would your faith tell you to do ? What would you do?

 

[Knife]

Well yes, you believe "blindly" because you have "evidence". I guess that we just have different conceptions of what "evidence" is, that's all. At any rate, I wish to high heaven that all "blind believers" were as reasonable as you. It would be no problem then.

a statement made by a person who truly intends to understand, learn and tolerate. and i wish there were more as open minded as you.

you are absolutely right. we must have different conceptions of evidence.

great discussion!

peace.

 

[Knife]

What would you do is Al Q had a safehouse in your area or neighborhood -- you preach the proper Islamac teachings....... so my question is....... and yes it is in regards to your faith....... what would your faith tell you to do ? What would you do?

they are criminals by all definitions. it would be an obligation to inform the authorities of their presence and they should be tried to the full extent of the law. and this is based on my beliefs.

there are other ways to fight causes than through violence.

peace.

 

[Knife]

Very well said I agree with you 100%. My main point (even though I know it often comes across as bashing islam) is that religious dogma of any kind is a very slippery slope that tends to separate the infidels from the chosen people. Once you do that then the infidels become less than human to the belivers (the jews were less than human to the nazis for example). After that, despite the best of intention on the part of some of the believers, it is all down hill.

the dogma does make things confusing. the way i see it, the only seperation made between "infedels" and the "chosen people", as you put it, should be made by God and really only effects a human relationship with God. it certainly doesnt affect me what your belief is. i still eat the same way, sleep the same way. mankind does not posses this right to make such a seperation, and he who does is acting like God (which is hereacy (sp?)).

to us mortals, muslim/non-muslim should be no different than if someone said black/white, african/asian.

another great discussion! thanks!

peace.

 

[surenderer]

Nothing more my original intention in mentioning that was simply in response to the article that surrenderer posted which stated that it wasn't mentioned in the quran.



Very well said I agree with you 100%. My main point (even though I know it often comes across as bashing islam) is that religious dogma of any kind is a very slippery slope that tends to separate the infidels from the chosen people. Once you do that then the infidels become less than human to the belivers (the jews were less than human to the nazis for example). After that, despite the best of intention on the part of some of the believers, it is all down hill.






Again I agree I left christianity because of similar reasons.

Path,
My apologies if i wasnt specific enough what i was trying to say was that nowhere in the Koran is their anything telling Muslims to behead infidels. (i meant specific instructions not things ordered during certain wars)I could explain the surahs which talk about that but that has already been discussed on this thread so i will apologize for the confusion my statement created.....peace to you

 

[fadeaway humper]

to us mortals, muslim/non-muslim should be no different than if someone said black/white, african/asian.
peace.

Damn, I have to tell you that you are the only muslim (because you are muslim, right?) that I have ever encountered in the Internet who is capable of making an statement even remotely like that. Are you sure that you are not from a parallel universe?

Anyway, since you are on a roll, here´s another "islamic" thingy that bothers me:
some time ago, I informed myself about the "satanic verses", just to see what all the fuss was about. My impression of the whole issue can be thus summarized: this Mohammed fellow comes up with convenient "revelations" whenever it suits his goals, and then disposes of them when they have served their purpose. Is it just me? Nobody else gets the impression that this embarrasing episode is clear proof of an all-to-human political endeavour with no godly connection? How do muslims deal with this particular issue?

No offense meant, Knife, really. I have the feeling that this is a very touchy subject with muslims, but I'm really intrigued and you seem like the only muslim capable of ever give a sincere answer without blowing a fuse.

 

[surenderer]

Damn, I have to tell you that you are the only muslim (because you are muslim, right?) that I have ever encountered in the Internet who is capable of making an statement even remotely like that. Are you sure that you are not from a parallel universe?

Anyway, since you are on a roll, here´s another "islamic" thingy that bothers me:
some time ago, I informed myself about the "satanic verses", just to see what all the fuss was about. My impression of the whole issue can be thus summarized: this Mohammed fellow comes up with convenient "revelations" whenever it suits his goals, and then disposes of them when they have served their purpose. Is it just me? Nobody else gets the impression that this embarrasing episode is clear proof of an all-to-human political endeavour with no godly connection? How do muslims deal with this particular issue?

No offense meant, Knife, really. I have the feeling that this is a very touchy subject with muslims, but I'm really intrigued and you seem like the only muslim capable of ever give a sincere answer without blowing a fuse.

Fadeaway,
I will let knife answer your question since it was directed towards him butI want to let you know that Knife is what one would cause a "true muslim"(i am muslim also) not unlike most of the muslims on the planet. Sometimes muslims get a bad "rap" because of what a few do but dialoge(sp?) like this is what helps maintain a postive relationship between people of different cultures and/or religions......peace to you

 

[Knife]

Damn, I have to tell you that you are the only muslim (because you are muslim, right?) that I have ever encountered in the Internet who is capable of making an statement even remotely like that. Are you sure that you are not from a parallel universe?

Anyway, since you are on a roll, here´s another "islamic" thingy that bothers me:
some time ago, I informed myself about the "satanic verses", just to see what all the fuss was about. My impression of the whole issue can be thus summarized: this Mohammed fellow comes up with convenient "revelations" whenever it suits his goals, and then disposes of them when they have served their purpose. Is it just me? Nobody else gets the impression that this embarrasing episode is clear proof of an all-to-human political endeavour with no godly connection? How do muslims deal with this particular issue?

No offense meant, Knife, really. I have the feeling that this is a very touchy subject with muslims, but I'm really intrigued and you seem like the only muslim capable of ever give a sincere answer without blowing a fuse.

again, my opinion, is that book is fiction with some basis on a theroy established many years by some guy (i cant remember his name). it is rejected widely among the muslim community due to personal attackes on the prophet himself, his wife, etc. look at it as the muslim version of the movie "the last temtation of christ" or even the new fictional novel "the davinci code".

now, i am not saying that there are no points in the book that arent interesting and raise good points and questions. i dont believe that any writing is 100% useless.

to claim that the Quran is completely man made is unreasoable to anyone who has read it. to claim that some parts are divine and others are man additions would be much more reasonable and harder to disprove. from a totally objective point of view some one could say that "Mohammed did indeed recieve divine revalations, but then added his own agenda". but this would not also make sense since the divine revalation wouldnt be sent to someone with personal agendas.

getting to the book. the all-to-human political endeavor with no godly connection. are you refering to the author salman rushdi, in which case all the reaction of the muslim world was waaaaayyy out of proportion. the fact that some irani clerics "allowed the shedding of his blood" is pathetic. what effect does this mans opinion have on others, nothing! if someone reads it and chooses to believe it, then that is between him and God. many muslims clerics do not want other muslims to read such texts because it will raise questions about faith and lead people astray. that in itself is not the problem, the problem is that it might raise questions against them the clerics and their interpretations will be questioned thus revealing other agendas. politricks plays an important part here.

on the other hand, of you are refering to Mohammed as the "ploitical endeavor with no Godly connection", then i have to say that doesnt make sense based on the contents of the Quran, the history of Mohammed, and the many opinions of non muslims.

i dont consider it an emarrasing episode for anyone. it is literature. salman rushdie has the right to voice his opinion. personally, i think he could have done less offensively. but then again, if he wrote it that way, he would nt have had the publicity he did.

peace.

 

[fadeaway humper]

Fadeaway,
I will let knife answer your question since it was directed towards him butI want to let you know that Knife is what one would cause a "true muslim"(i am muslim also) not unlike most of the muslims on the planet. Sometimes muslims get a bad "rap" because of what a few do but dialoge(sp?) like this is what helps maintain a postive relationship between people of different cultures and/or religions......peace to you

Oh my god, there's two of you! TWO! What is this world coming to?

Seriously, I'm really really glad that muslims like you guys are starting to come to the light, because the scene in every muslim forum I've visited is enough to make one want to hide under a rock forever.

In fact, I'll go as far as saying that you can count me as a "true muslim" like you guys (only without the whole belief in Allah thing and such, but that's minor, right?). Just kidding

 

[cosmictraveler]

Why is it that your own people are killing their own kind? They are all believers in your book but yet there are some who destroy other believers just because they are .......what? Thats what is puzzling me. I can't understand killing your own kind when they have done nothing , as yet, to anyone. Saddam did the same thing as the new government is now trying to abolish. It would seem that , if they are not greedy, those insurgents would stop their bloodshed against their own kind just to see what will happen. I mean they have nothing to lose for the time being.