Are they all the same god?

S

spacemansteve

Not enough brain space
Registered Senior Member
Allah, Jehovah and God, are they not the same thing?

In my quest to further my knownledge on a broad base topics it has occured to me that Judaism was the fundamental religion that the majority of monotheistic religions are now based on. From Judaism we found Christianity and Islam. From this we can correctly assume that the God that is praised in each of those religions to be the same.

So why the fighting? is it about the correct way to worship this god? is it about politics? Is it about both?

Opinions please people.
 
In Islam we believe it is the same God, the difference being that Muslims accept both Moses and Jesus as prophets equal to Mohammed, but the Jews accept neither Jesus nor Mohammed and the Christians do not accept Mohammed.
 
samcdkey said:
In Islam we believe it is the same God, the difference being that Muslims accept both Moses and Jesus as prophets equal to Mohammed, but the Jews accept neither Jesus nor Mohammed and the Christians do not accept Mohammed.
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Sorry man. I had a slight chuckle on that one. No offence but when I read your explanation I thought that because of these differences the world is a battlefield.
 
Sam: Interesting, but why is it that in recent times, we find that Islamic books being sold that quote from the Koran and support violant Jihad against non Islamics, even if they accept their faiths?

We all know Christianity's bloody past, but its ability to adapt to modern society is quite different to that of Islam. Also with Judaisms bloody present they seem to have adapted differently to modern times but it does make a few current issues clear.
 
^Because Mohommad encourages violence against the "non-believers" throughout the entire Quran. Very few verses seem to support peaceful agreements or anything like that. Mohommad even goes as far as to say that fighting is a good thing for you, even though you may like it or think its good.
 
spacemansteve said:
Sam: Interesting, but why is it that in recent times, we find that Islamic books being sold that quote from the Koran and support violant Jihad against non Islamics, even if they accept their faiths?
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Could you show me some links?

Its related more to the targeting of Islam by the media following 9/11 than anything else. You must have noticed that the support for fundamentalists has increased with the increase in media coverage of the violent nature of Islam as perceived by those who quote Quranic verses out of context. I find it ironic that the media attacks Muslims for supporting the fundamentalists and in the same breath, lumps them all together as violent due to their religion AND blames them for not doing anything about it. A lose-lose situation.


We all know Christianity's bloody past, but its ability to adapt to modern society is quite different to that of Islam. Also with Judaisms bloody present they seem to have adapted differently to modern times but it does make a few current issues clear.
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You are focusing on the ME which is the most visible part of Islam. But the ME comprises roughly 15-20% of Muslims; there are a lot of Muslims who adapt themselves to the modern society.
 
VitalOne said:
^Because Mohommad encourages violence against the "non-believers" throughout the entire Quran. Very few verses seem to support peaceful agreements or anything like that. Mohommad even goes as far as to say that fighting is a good thing for you, even though you may like it or think its good.
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spacemansteve:

Exhibit A
 
Sam: Thanks, i'd just like your opinions on that book? I see you as a reasonable person which is one of the reasons i'm beginning to value your opinion. And seeing as i've just found out your a muslim, when it comes to the Islamic religion, i value your opinion a fair bit more than others :)
 
I just have a few questions for yourself... Please DO NOT TAKE OFFENCE! :)

1. Do you as a muslim subscribe to the comments made in those books?
2. Are such quotes in said books a misrepresentation of what is truly written?
3. Should such books be banned (seeing as there are alot of Anti hate laws around today)?
 
spacemansteve said:
Sam: Thanks, i'd just like your opinions on that book? I see you as a reasonable person which is one of the reasons i'm beginning to value your opinion. And seeing as i've just found out your a muslim, when it comes to the Islamic religion, i value your opinion a fair bit more than others :)
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I have to read it first; I don't know what they mean by Jihad.

In Islam jihad does not have the same meaning as that in the West.

wikipedia:

Jihad, sometimes spelled Jahad, Jehad Jihaad or Djehad, (Arabic: ????? ?ih?d) is an Islamic term, from the Arabic root ?hd ("to exert utmost effort, to strive, struggle"), which connotes a wide range of meanings: anything from an inward spiritual struggle to attain perfect faith to a political or military struggle to further the Islamic cause. Individuals involved in the political or military forms of jihad are often labeled with the neologism "jihadist".

The term "jihad" is often rendered in western languages and non-Islamic cultures as "holy war", but this "physical" struggle, which encompasses religon, only makes up part of the broader meaning of the concept of jihad. The denotation is of a struggle, challenge, difficulty, or (frequently) opposed effort, made either in accomplishment or as resistance. A person who engages in any form of jihad can be called a mujahid (in plural: mujahadin) (Arabic: striver, struggler), a term even more often applied to groups who practice armed struggle in the name of Islam. Such a person might engage in fighting as a military struggle for religious reasons, or for example, struggle to memorize the Qur'an.
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So when they say Islamic Jihad what do they mean?

In the link it says:
The Office of Film and Literature Classification termed the book "historical and general" and said it contained no call to action: "There were no specific violent acts or threats of jihad referred to."
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So I cannot tell what it contains.

The "non-Muslims" quoted in the Quran are contextual, i.e. at particular times during war, when Mohammed was undecided whether to fight the Jews/Christians (as they are People of the Book), the verses were revealed to him as a decision to fight. He fought with them in order to establish a secular community. They are not an allowance for indiscriminate violence and Muslims who read the Quran know this.

(see the link I inserted in Psychotic episode's thread on infidels for a bit of historical background)
 
spacemansteve said:
Allah, Jehovah and God, are they not the same thing?

In my quest to further my knownledge on a broad base topics it has occured to me that Judaism was the fundamental religion that the majority of monotheistic religions are now based on. From Judaism we found Christianity and Islam. From this we can correctly assume that the God that is praised in each of those religions to be the same.

So why the fighting? is it about the correct way to worship this god? is it about politics? Is it about both?

Opinions please people.
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It does not matter who claims to believe in God. What matters is who is following the will of God and who is telling a lie about God.

If they all believe in the same God then they cannot be all following His will because they have very different views on what His will is. There lies the reason for disagreement and contention.

Who is following the will of God? That is the question.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days
 
spacemansteve said:
I just have a few questions for yourself... Please DO NOT TAKE OFFENCE! :)
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I won't; I have been trained by the best offenders on this forum :)

1. Do you as a muslim subscribe to the comments made in those books?
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I have not read the book so I cannot comment on this.

This however is my view of jihad

http://www.iiie.net/Brochures/Brochure-18.html

2. Are such quotes in said books a misrepresentation of what is truly written?
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Yes see link above

3. Should such books be banned (seeing as there are alot of Anti hate laws around today)?
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I am against a ban of any kind, I would rather such things are out in the open and under discussion. And if there is a ban, what about books against Islam? Do they not spread Islamophobia? In that case where do we stop?

We have no right to decide what people can write or read.

But we can hope for open discussions to remove misapprehensions.
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Adstar said:
It does not matter who claims to believe in God. What matters is who is following the will of God and who is telling a lie about God.

If they all believe in the same God then they cannot be all following His will because they have very different views on what His will is. There lies the reason for disagreement and contention.

Who is following the will of God? That is the question.
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Are you only 33% certain that you are following the right path? This sounds like you have doubts as to your previous 100%.

This is Gulliver's Travels in real time. Starting a war over a philosophy about which end of a boiled egg to open. The absurdity of your words gentlemen leave me in awe. Please continue.
 
Starting a war over a philosophy about which end of a boiled egg to open. The absurdity of your words gentlemen leave me in awe. Please continue.
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You should open the base! Anyone who says differently will get a Jihad on their ass. ALLAH AKBAR!
 
spacemansteve said:
Allah, Jehovah and God, are they not the same thing?

In my quest to further my knownledge on a broad base topics it has occured to me that Judaism was the fundamental religion that the majority of monotheistic religions are now based on. From Judaism we found Christianity and Islam. From this we can correctly assume that the God that is praised in each of those religions to be the same.

So why the fighting? is it about the correct way to worship this god? is it about politics? Is it about both?

Opinions please people.
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Yes, supposedly they all worship the same god, for all three come from Abraham. No, they disagree with who was blessed because according to the bible, Abraham blessed Jacob ---> Jews while according to the Koran, he blessed Esau ----> Muslims.

And im pretty sure you know about Jesus.
 
Provita said:
Yes, supposedly they all worship the same god, for all three come from Abraham. No, they disagree with who was blessed because according to the bible, Abraham blessed Jacob ---> Jews while according to the Koran, he blessed Esau ----> Muslims.

And im pretty sure you know about Jesus.
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Actually this is not true.

The Quran teaches that the Jews are Elohim's Chosen People

Children of Israel! call to mind the favour which I bestowed upon you, and that I preferred you to all others. (Surah 2:47 repeated in 2:122)

Remember Moses said to his people: "O my people! Call in remembrance the favour of Allah unto you, when He produced prophets among you, made you kings, and gave you what He had not given to any other among the peoples.(Surah 5:21)

We did deliver aforetime the Children of Israel from humiliating Punishment, Inflicted by Pharaoh, for he was arrogant (even) among inordinate transgressors. And We chose them aforetime above the nations, knowingly, (Surah 44:30-32)

We did aforetime grant to the Children of Israel the Book the Power of Command, and Prophethood; We gave them, for Sustenance, things good and pure; and We favoured them above the nations. (Surah 45:16)

Moses is mentioned in the Quran in 176 verses, while Mohammed is mentioned in only 4.
 
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