Sam I cannot watch the youtube link. I'm not in america.
However you can't tell me to watch a video and tell me thats what's happening in afghanistan. I don't need to see the video. I've been to afghanistan. Have you?
Are all soldiers like the Nazis?
- Thread starter S.A.M.
- Start date
Sam I cannot watch the youtube link. I'm not in america.
However you can't tell me to watch a video and tell me thats what's happening in afghanistan. I don't need to see the video. I've been to afghanistan. Have you?
Apparently its by dehumanising the other. If you don't see your victims as human beings its easy to think of them as blips on a screen or paper targets that have to be wiped out.
I've never been to Auschwitz either, do I need to go there to decide if its wrong to gas people?
The things you do in Afghanistan, would you do the same in the US to Americans?
Since you cannot see youtube
http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/926-64/Archive-Films
More
Unfortunately I have no way to share the news segments we see here from local sources
If you can see these clips click on any one and then move to other clips by pressing the arrow at the top
Well, no. Some object. Some shoot over the heads of their 'enemies'. Some shoot themselves in the foot. Some are not put in the same position as the Nazis - they are only told to shoot armed enemy soldiers in uniform. Etc.
I doubt most Nazis did this. Some followed orders as they had been trained to since they were young - pre WW2 Germany was a very rigid, controlling patriarchal society. Some were probably afraid to not do what they were told. Some did some of the things I mentioned in relation to question one. There were probably a good number who felt bad and tried to assuage their feelings with ideology. Many Nazi soldiers were simply out in the field fighting official combatants of other countries. Not all of them were killing jews with as few bullets as possible and the like. In fact they often fought with what passes for military honor - not shooting medics, allowing wounded enemy to go back to their groups, medically treating enemy wounded, accepting surrenders without killing and so on. Allied soldiers had a very different experience fighting the Japanese who valued their own lives and those of their enemies in quite a different fashion.
Of course not all German soldiers were Nazis.
Mrs.Lucysnow
Valued Senior Member
So then why is it so rare Sam? Why don't more soldiers 'go nuts'?
You have a seriously puerile understanding of soldiers, military life, their training and their behaviour on and off the active duty.
Same reason why most human traffickers or most slavers didn't or don't. Most criminals and serial killers are also not nuts.
Possibly. I don't pretend to have any understanding of people who think they deserve accolades for volunteering to kill perfect strangers.
Even if they do it mainly for the perks.
I'm guessing if your door was broken down at dawn and your family machine gunned by foreign troops you would likely share my mystification behind their motivations.
You're trolling me into this, when you know that if it wasn't for the allied forces the nazis could be in india right now bombing your civillians. I don't think they'd be so willing to make changes either. Unless it meant killing more for less.
If you want to compare allied forces to the taliban that'd be good (EDIT)and interesting. If you want to compare the allied forces to nazis you'd find 3 reasons making them not like the nazis for every one reason you find them to be the same.
I would only feel recoil if an american was trying to kill other americans.
What did the Naziz do that the US hasn't? Is it a question of scale?
IIRC, the nazis decided waterboarding was too inhumane and they did not use nuclear bombs, flechettes and DIME or white phosphorus.
I deliberately used the word Nazi because it is somehow implied that German soldiers were "different". My point is, they were just like any other soldiers.
Comparing the Taliban to US troops makes no sense. They are not invading and occupying far off countries. They are simply children of war continuing the cycle of abuse in their own limited society.
If they were invading European countries, kicking down doors and spraying them with bullets to export their ideology, then it would be a relevant comparison.
IIRC, the nazis decided waterboarding was too inhumane and they did not use nuclear bombs, flechettes and DIME or white phosphorus.
I deliberately used the word Nazi because it is somehow implied that German soldiers were "different". My point is, they were just like any other soldiers.
Comparing the Taliban to US troops makes no sense. They are not invading and occupying far off countries. They are simply children of war continuing the cycle of abuse in their own limited society.
If they were invading European countries, kicking down doors and spraying them with bullets to export their ideology, then it would be a relevant comparison.
Mrs.Lucysnow
Valued Senior Member
Oh so all soldiers are criminals
Let us know when you are done with the vitriol so we can have a serious conversation. I don't know if you notice but 99% of the posters disagree with the mouth foaming accusations.No Sam you simply do not understand. You are naive on the subject so you speak rubbish.
Well that's not the way it works sam. I guess if I were secretly hiding some insurgent in my backyard then I shouldn't be surprised should I? Going by your reasoning soldiers should have allowed the Nazi's to take over all of Europe and Japan could have taken over all Asia, in which case you would just be someone's cleaning lady if you were allowed to live. Because if they were 'moral' they would never go into foreign lands to oust a threat. Maybe that's your grievance! Maybe you are upset that the Nazi's didn't get to finish their job!!
You haven't really built a proper argument against military activity. What you are upset about is specific, Afghanistan and Iraq but instead of dealing with those issues directly you make a foolish statement and then go about bouncing off walls claiming you can't be caught.
Mohammed was a warlord and therefore a nazi. Mohammed created a war like religion as all occidental religions are so they encourage nazi like behaviour. He lead battles, he offered to convert enemies as opposed to murdering or subjugation. Mohammed was a nazi!
Is that getting across? I mean I could make the same kind of spurious statements.
Um -
Nuclear bombs: they probably would have if they'd ever got theirs built.
Flechettes: yes they did.
White phosphorous: again yes.
DIME: they were working on something with a similar principle but never got a completed model into the field.
I am actually upset about the INC using CRPF to torture local Jharkand civilians. But since everyone kept coming back to the US, I went along with it. Tell me Lucy, if the Chinese troops were doing what the NATO allies are, would you be praising their military culture?
Okay so they were exactly like any other soldiers.
Where did the Germans use flechettes and white phosphorus?
Okay so they were exactly like any other soldiers.
Where did the Germans use flechettes and white phosphorus?
Mrs.Lucysnow
Valued Senior Member
Don't be shy Sam respond to my post. If you make allegations you should be able to respond to allegations.
If the Chinese were doing it then we wouldn't have to. What you are objecting to doesn't characterize all of military personnel or activity.
Its like claiming all of islam is extreme because of a few extremists. Of course we can all play that game.
These are not "allegations" they are facts. If the Taliban decided to spread Islam the way the US has decided to spread democracy, would you be praising their
If the American President decided that anyone not with the program in the US was an insurgent and used the same methods on Americans would you be praising this?
Where to start.
Attempted genocide on a non hostile force.
Invaded non hostile countries
sparked a world war. only once as nazis
these are just the basics. please forgive me for being short, as i am short on time.
So did your local news say that the taliban wasn't responsible for invading america and american airspace and killing thousands in a matter of hours?
Where?
Location or...?
WP has been a component of hand grenades and incendiary bombs since WWI.
So German usage would have been, say London, Liverpool, Coventry etc etc.
Flechettes have been in use (as "flechettes"*) since WWI also, as air-dropped weapons (individually!) and later, especially in WW2 as cluster-type anti-personnel air-dropped weapons. IIRC German usage was mainly on the Russian front.
* Flechette, of course, means "little arrow" and similar weapons (although not specifically named as such) have been used by nearly every combatant nation since the invention of gunpowder, fired from smooth-bore cannons.
Mrs.Lucysnow
Valued Senior Member
I also stated facts. Mohammed was a warlord and therefore a nazi. If the Taliban attempted to spread Islam they would come across what they are faced with now except in that case we wouldn't hesitate to Nuke them into paradise
Can I see some evidence of white phosphorus /flechette use by Germans?
So you would not be praising their soldiers? And gushing at their culture?
So if all Muslims volunteered and trained and enlisted in a military organisation which then started invading and occupying for the purpose of imposing their ideology, you would not consider them as lunatics and violent murderers?
So you would not be praising their soldiers? And gushing at their culture?
So if all Muslims volunteered and trained and enlisted in a military organisation which then started invading and occupying for the purpose of imposing their ideology, you would not consider them as lunatics and violent murderers?
Mrs.Lucysnow
Valued Senior Member
Well I admire how they fought off the Russians. They are a tough hardy lot but not really stable when it comes to 'ideology'. I mean all one need do is 'buy' the loyalty of the local warlord.
Now mohammed he was a bad ass nazi. You couldn't buy him off!
Then you'd be okay with other people using this same method to impose their ideologies? Soldiers, occupation, WMDs?
Mrs.Lucysnow
Valued Senior Member
What we are doing Sam is
A. defending ourselves from a country that liberally allowed extremists to flourish and spread to western borders.
B. We are defending those who would rather not have extremists impose their ideology.
We will do this until there are no more bombings in the US, Europe and Pakistan.
The West will not tolerate any Islamist threat.