Abortion in Islam

S.A.M.

uniquely dreadful
Valued Senior Member
Islam views abortion very differently from contraception, since the former entails the violation of a human life. The question that naturally arises is whether the term "human life" includes the life of the fetus in the womb. According to Islamic jurisprudence it does. Islam accords the fetus the status of "incomplete zimma". Zimma is the legal regard that allows rights and duties, and that of the fetus is incomplete in the sense that it has rights but owes no duties. Some of these rights of the fetus are:

(a) If a husband dies while his wife is pregnant, the law of inheritance recognizes the fetus as an inheritor if borne alive. Other inheritors would receive their shares in accordance with the prescribed juridical proportions, but only after the share of the unborn is set aside to await its birth.

(b) If a fetus is miscarried at any stage of pregnancy and shows signs of life such as a cough or movement and then it dies, such fetus has the right to inherit anything it was legally entitled to inherit from anyone who died after the beginning of the pregnancy. After this fetus dies, what it has inherited is inherited in turns by its legal heirs.

(c) If a woman commits a crime punishable by death and is proven pregnant, then the execution of the punishment shall be postponed until she gives birth and nurses her baby until it is weaned. This applies irrespective of the duration of the pregnancy, however early, denoting the right of the fetus to life from its beginning. It applies even if the pregnancy was illegitimate, which shows that the fetus conceived out of wedlock also has the right to life. All sects and juridical schools unanimously uphold this ruling.

There is also a money penalty for abortion even if it was inadvertent. This is called the "ghorra". If aggression or willful action causes abortion, suitable punishment by the court is also imposed.

The question of the beginning of life has been discussed since early times, since the admissibility of abortion hinged around the existence of life (some old jurists permitted abortion before four months, others before seven weeks, of pregnancy, on the assumption that life had not started in the pregnancy.) Some ten centuries ago, a notable scholar called Al-Ghazali rightly described a phase of imperceptible life, before the phase that the mother could feel in the form of fetal quickening. Recent juridical congresses reviewed the subject taking into account the applications of modern technology, and concluded that the stage of an individual's life that can be called its beginning should satisfy ALL the following criteria: (1) it should be a clear and well-defined event; (2) it should exhibit the cardinal feature of life: growth; (3) if this growth is not interrupted, it will naturally lead up to the subsequent stages of life as we know them; (4) it contains the genetic pattern that is characteristic of the human race at large, and also of a unique specific individual; and (5) it is not preceded by any other phase which combines the first four. Obviously, these postulates refer to fertilization.

Abortion, however, is permitted if the continuation of pregnancy poses a threat on the mother. The Shari'a considers the mother to be the root and the fetus to be the offshoot; the latter to be sacrificed if this is necessary to save the former. There are some arguments also in favor of expanding the admissibility of abortion to cover drastic cases of congenital anomalies and fetal illness incompatible with feasible life if performed before pregnancy is four months.

http://www.themodernreligion.com/misc/sex/s_repro.htm

I also found this very interesting:

The general recommendation is for the Islamic nation to procreate and grow in numbers, but quality and not sheer numbers was well emphasized by Mohammad. One of his very prophetic sayings was: "There will come the day when other nations will fall upon you like hungry eaters upon a bowl of food." When asked whether this would be due to lack of numbers he said "No. On that day you will be so many, but (quality wise) like the froth on the surface of the torrent."
 
Does every Muslim feel the same way about abortion and women's rights, etc?

Baron Max

No, not every Muslim feels the same way about Islam, either.

Which is why there are so many schools of thought in the religion.

However, it is acceptable to follow any or all or any combination of them.
 
No, not every Muslim feels the same way about Islam, either.

Then your long, involved post means virtually nothing.

Which is why there are so many schools of thought in the religion. However, it is acceptable to follow any or all or any combination of them.

So if some Muslims want to blow up and kill other Muslims, then it's okay if they say it's okay?

Baron Max
 
Then your long, involved post means virtually nothing.

Actually my long, involved post is the consensus of thought on the rights of the fetus and the position of the majority of Muslims on abortion and contraception.

So if some Muslims want to blow up and kill other Muslims, then it's okay if they say it's okay?

Baron Max
That is not abortion.
 
Actually my long, involved post is the consensus of thought on the rights of the fetus and the position of the majority of Muslims on abortion and contraception.

Which really don't mean shit, does it? When others, who call themselves Muslims, don't agree with it, how can anyone call it a consensus?

Sam, it's no different to the many other religions of the world ....people decide to do and think whatever they want. "Muslim" is no more of a cohesive religion than any other religion in the world.

How soon do you suppose that Islam will become a divided religion like Christianity has done? I mean, the world of Islam is about 200 years behind the western world, so ....isn't it about time for the major chisms?

Baron Max
 
Which really don't mean shit, does it? When others, who call themselves Muslims, don't agree with it, how can anyone call it a consensus?

Sam, it's no different to the many other religions of the world ....people decide to do and think whatever they want. "Muslim" is no more of a cohesive religion than any other religion in the world.

How soon do you suppose that Islam will become a divided religion like Christianity has done? I mean, the world of Islam is about 200 years behind the western world, so ....isn't it about time for the major chisms?

Baron Max

What exactly do you think Muslims would disagree with in the post above?

As for the schism, Islam has survived the Persians, the Turkics, the Mongols, communism and Westernisation without a schism.:shrug:
 
What exactly do you think Muslims would disagree with in the post above?

Huh? You were the one that said some Muslims wouldn't agree with it. Are you saying now that all Muslims do agree with it?

As for the schism, Islam has survived the Persians, the Turkics, the Mongols, communism and Westernisation without a schism.:shrug:

So, ....all Muslims think and believe exactly the same? There is no differences in the Muslim faith? And they all agree with Osama that they should kill all westerners and conquer the world for Islam?

Baron Max
 
Huh? You were the one that said some Muslims wouldn't agree with it. Are you saying now that all Muslims do agree with it?

I said most Muslims agree with it, but I am curious to know what you think Muslims would disagree with

So, ....all Muslims think and believe exactly the same? There is no differences in the Muslim faith? And they all agree with Osama that they should kill all westerners and conquer the world for Islam?

I think you are confused between politics and faith.
 
Mohammed died in 632 AD
The major schism over his successor started almost immediately.
That is why we hear of Sunni and Shia Muslims.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Succession_to_Muhammad

He means in the religion, not in the politics.

Shias and Sunnis are all under the Islamic school and pray together in Mecca. The Al-Azhar University (which is the predominant Islamic univeristy) reconises the Shias as a part of Islam. Sunnis recognise Shias as Muslims and vice-versa.
 
I said most Muslims agree with it, but I am curious to know what you think Muslims would disagree with.

How in hell would I know??!! And it only took a few Christians to split from the old Catholic church and form ...well, a whole bunch of different ones sprang up, didn't they?

I think you are confused between politics and faith.

Only in psycho-babble discussions are politics and faith distinct. One can't separate the two in reality. You should know that, Sam, ...of all people, you should know that.

But, Sam, you don't seem to grasp what this thread is all about. You posted a long, involved post ...which you now agree is not accepted by all muslims. And so .....why bother posting it at all???

Baron Max
 
How in hell would I know??!! And it only took a few Christians to split from the old Catholic church and form ...well, a whole bunch of different ones sprang up, didn't they?



Only in psycho-babble discussions are politics and faith distinct. One can't separate the two in reality. You should know that, Sam, ...of all people, you should know that.

But, Sam, you don't seem to grasp what this thread is all about. You posted a long, involved post ...which you now agree is not accepted by all muslims. And so .....why bother posting it at all???

Baron Max

You seem unable to find a point that a Muslim would disagree with; IMO, most Muslims agree that beyond 4 months is inhumane unless the mother's life is in danger. Some Muslims may prefer the time point to be much earlier, like 40 days. Muslims who are brought up with Christian ideologies may consider abortion repugnant.

However, in general, all Muslims would prefer contraception to abortion, since contraception is permitted and abortion, to some degree or other, involves making a choice about another life.
 
You seem unable to find a point that a Muslim would disagree with;

And you somehow think that I should know what all Muslims believe????? And thanks to you, I hate Muslims, so why would I even give a shit what they think?

IMO, most Muslims agree that....

And just how many Muslims do you actually know, Sam? Do you, for example, know "most Muslims" in the world? And you feel that you can speak for "most muslims"?

However, in general, all Muslims would prefer...

And you know all Muslims and how they think and what they believe?

Sam, you're doing nothing more or less than someone who might say, "In general, all Muslims approve of Muslim terrorism in the world."

Making statements of fact, that have no basis in fact is a foolish thing to do.

Baron Max
 
You can't separate the two, Sam, no matter how hard you want to.

Baron Max

Apparently you can.

Although politically there have always been problems between the Shia and Sunni, the religious position between them has been asserted as recently as 1959, by the prestigious Al-Azhar university, when it was felt that politics may be used to create religious differences and a division in Islam. They therefore issued the following statement.
1)Islam does not require a Muslim to follow a particular Madh'hab (school of thought). Rather, we say: every Muslim has the right to follow one of the schools of thought which has been correctly narrated and its verdicts have been compiled in its books. And, everyone who is following such Madhahib [schools of thought] can transfer to another school, and there shall be no crime on him for doing so.

2) The Ja'fari school of thought, which is also known as "al-Shia al-Imamiyyah al-Ithna Ashariyyah" (i.e., The Twelver Imami Shi'ites) is a school of thought that is religiously correct to follow in worship as are other Sunni schools of thought.

thus supporting the Islamic belief in diversity of religious opinion.

Similarly, following a spate of bombings in Jordan, the King of Jordan issued a statement distinguishing terrorists from Muslims.
The Amman message is a statement which was issued on 9 November 2004 (27th of Ramadan 1425 AH) by King Abdullah II bin Al-Hussein of Jordan, calling for tolerance and unity in the Muslim world.[1] Subsequently, a three-point ruling was issued by 200 Islamic scholars from over 50 countries, focusing on issues of: defining who a Muslim is; excommunication from Islam (takfir), and; principles related to delivering religious edicts (fatāwa).[2]

Such actions keep the religion together while focusing on the acts of individual Muslims as against the religion, rather than as part of a heretic belief.
 
He means in the religion, not in the politics.

Shias and Sunnis are all under the Islamic school and pray together in Mecca. The Al-Azhar University (which is the predominant Islamic univeristy) reconises the Shias as a part of Islam. Sunnis recognise Shias as Muslims and vice-versa.

Can you find me a reference from any reputable source, which says that the difference between the Sunnis and the Shias is not a major schism?
 
What would you consider a reputable source? The Al-Azhar university is the premier religious university in the Islamic world, and they recognise both Shia and Sunni schools of thought.
 
And you somehow think that I should know what all Muslims believe????? And thanks to you, I hate Muslims, so why would I even give a shit what they think?

BM
Thanks to SAM you hate Muslims?
I know she can be a bit annoying at times :p, but isn't that a slight over-reaction?
 
Sam, you're doing nothing more or less than someone who might say, "In general, all Muslims approve of Muslim terrorism in the world."

Making statements of fact, that have no basis in fact is a foolish thing to do.

Baron Max

That is incorrect.
Muhammad Sayid Tantawy, the current Imam of Al-Azhar, has declared that the perpetrators of the 9/11 attacks and suicide bombers are "heretics" who are not following the true path of Islam. In a recent conference in Indonesia, he asked all "true believers" to deny speakers of extremist and heretical forms of Islam places to speak in the mosque, thus preventing the spread of violent ideologies. Ali Gomaa', the Egyptian Grand Mufti who is associated with Al Azhar, has also declared that insurgents who kidnap and kill civilians in Iraq are the ones which Islam has authorized to thwart and eradicate since they wreak havoc on Earth

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Azhar_University
 
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