A Jewish Holiday Worth Borrowing

[Mr.Spock]

As soon as Spock gets cornered he comes back to "this shows you hate jews" argument

im only making an observation. how does one gets cornered when facing lies is something beyond me.

 

[Mr.Spock]

finally i found it:

CLAIM (18)
Non-Jews are Not Human Baba Mezia 114a-114b. Only Jews are human ("Only ye are designated men").

RESPONSE (1)
Rabbi Shimon Bar Yochai alone makes the statement that non-Jews are not considered in the laws of impurity - therefore a priest can touch a non-Jewish corpse without being defiled. It nowhere states that non-Jews are not human, or that only Jews are human.
Avraham Hampel

RESPONSE (2)
Okay, here we have piece of misinformation number 1; a slick one, because anyone who read this line would surely be outraged. But this has nothing to do with designating anyone as "men."

What is going on here is a method of analysis known as a "hekesh," or in English a "linkage." The verse from the Bible says, "And I made my sheep (those who follow my commandments) into sheep, my flock into Man." From there, the Sages understand similar usages of the term "Man" to mean the nation which follows the commandments - the Jewish People. The Tosafos in Sanhedrin 59a, points out many times when Gentiles are indeed referred to as "Man?"
[Edited response.] <5ptttd$335$4@news.nyu.edu> mat6263@is.nyu.edu (Michael A. Torczyner)

RESPONSE (3)
This is a mistranslation of the term "adam". Also, the Talmud just has a Rabbi quoting Ezekiel XXXIV, 31 in this place. Nothing is being said about non-Jews not being human or only Jews being human.
From Usenet message
behrends@student.uni-kl.de (Reimer Behrends)

RESPONSE (4)
Apparently a deliberate mistranslation. The passage deals with the technical rules of corpse-impurity which, according to the author of this text, apply to Jews and not to gentiles. In this connection Ezekiel 34:31 is cited: "And ye My sheep [referring to Israel], the sheep of My pasture, are _men [Hebrew: "adam"]_, and I am your God, saith the Lord God." From a careful midrashic reading of this Biblical verse, Rabbi Simeon ben Yohai deduced "Only "ye" [i.e., Israel, not other nations] are designated "adam," in the sense that only Jewish corpses and graves generate impurity according to Numbers 19:14: "This is the law: when a _man ['adam']_ dieth in a tent, every one that cometh into the tent...shall be unclean seven days..." The passage is legal and exegetical, not theological. If anything, it seems to put Jews on a lower footing than non-Jews. Typically, the words "but beasts" were added on by whoever put this list together. They do not appear in the original.
From Usenet message:

RESPONSE (5)
In Numbers 19:14 the Written Torah states that "If [a] man [person] dies inside a tent ...." and the passage goes on to describe the laws of ritual impurity caused by the corpse.

The sages considered whether this law applied to all men or only to Jews. It might have been thought that the word 'man' or 'person' would indicate a reference to both Jews and non-Jews. However the Oral tradition made it clear that when the Torah uses the word 'man' or 'person' in connection with legal restrictions the reference is usually to Jews and not to non-Jews who are not bound by Torah law.

The Talmudic passage states in connection with this matter: "'... My sheep ... you are men' (Ez. 34:31); you [Jews] are called 'adam' [men], and the idol worshippers are not called 'adam' [men]".

Commentators explain that the use of the word 'men' [adam] in this passage is similar to the use of the word 'person' in modern national law codes. When such a law code uses the term 'person' the reference is not universal but is restricted to those persons who are bound by that national law code.

Similarly in the case at hand the laws of ritual impurity apply only to Jews and not to non-Jews. The passage should thus be understood as follows:

"It is a general rule of interpretation in the Torah that for the purpose of legal enactments the term 'person' refers to Jews, who are bound by the law, and does not refer to non-Jews who are not bound by the law". It is interesting to note that the proof text is taken from Ezekiel Chapter 34 in which Israel is compared to sheep.

Another interpretation given by commentators is that when the context is negative (as in a discussion of ritual impurity caused by a corpse or the commission of a sin) the word 'man' is used to refer to Jews only (in this
way not bringing shame on the name 'Israel'), but when the context is positive then the word includes all of mankind.

With this understanding the Talmudic passage should be understood as follows:

"It is a general rule of interpretation in the Torah that in a negative context such as that of ritual impurity the word 'man' refers to Jews only, and not to non-Jews".

This sentence appears three times in the Talmud; the reference in Baba Mezia 114a is tangential and therefore the subject is not developed at any length. An honest reader would follow the cross-references to the other locations and note that in Kerithoth 6b the Talmud points out that the application of this principle of interpretation is questionable in any event.

Yevamot 61a is the third place in which this rule of interpretation is mentioned and in this location the commentators on the page also point out that this rule of interpretation has very limited use. They specifically cross reference to the Talmudic statements in Avoda Zara 3a and Sanhedrin 59a which compare non-Jews who engage in Torah study to the High Priest.
Michael Gruda (mgruda@netvision.net.il)

http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Cyprus/8815/exp.html

 

[S.A.M.]

So you are saying when the Talmud says:

Said he [Rabbah] to him: Art thou not a priest:2 why then dost thou stand in a cemetery?3 — He replied: Has the Master not studied the laws of purity?4 For it has been taught: R. Simeon b. Yohai said: The graves of Gentiles do not defile, for it is written, And ye my flock, the flock of my pastures, are men;5 only ye are designated 'men'.

They don't literally mean men?

 

[Mr.Spock]

So you are saying when the Talmud says:



They don't literally mean men?

im saying what you quoted isnt even written in the talmud and because you are so stupid and your muslim brothers filled your head with lies about judaisim for so long you will beileve anything.

 

[S.A.M.]

Its a direct quote from a Talmud learning site.
http://www.come-and-hear.com/talmud/index.html

 

[Mr.Spock]

Its a direct quote from a Talmud learning site.
http://www.come-and-hear.com/talmud/index.html

and jews also eat christian babies

that site was probably produced by jew haters such as yourself or muslims(theres a difference?).

Much of anti-Semitism appears to have its origins in the supposed belief that Jews must intrinsically hate Christianity and humanity in general. Of course, this is not true, but it does not stop the production of vast amounts of anti-Semitic propaganda to this effect. This belief is often combined with the idea that Jews are somehow not human, but must have access to various subterfuges or even magic to give, at least, the appearance of being human and thus be able to "infiltrate" and "corrupt" normal society. Indeed, many societies have blamed "the Jews" for all their problems. It follows from these beliefs that Jews must therefore be exterminated in order for society to function normally, and sadly, this has been tried on more than one occasion. The types of fears and misconceptions at work in these cases are among the most ancient and primordial in existence. Perhaps if those that blamed "the Jews" for their problems had the same devotion to education, learning and personal advancement that Jews typically do, they wouldn't have whatever problems they are blaming Jews for.

This is a project to provide responses to the anti-Semites who post alleged quotes from the Talmud and other anti-Jewish propaganda in a way intended to promote hatred of Jews. These "Talmud quotes" and other material are either entire fabrications, mistranslations or out of context. This is a sample of the first small completed section. If you have any comments I would be happy to hear them. I would like to thank all the people who have contributed answers. Each contribution includes the author's name or initials. I would also like to thank Frances for starting this site and for ongoing support. There are also several other documents that I am working on. Most of the "Talmud quotes" come from the Russian anti-Semite Rev. I. B. Pranaitis, who had a criminal record and was "Master of Theology and Professor of the Hebrew Language at the Imperial Ecclesiastical Academy of the Roman Catholic Church" in Old St. Petersburg, Russia. He wrote this material around the turn of the century in a booklet in Latin with the English title of "The Talmud Unmasked". He was a self-identified Talmudic "scholar" who testified at the B. Mendel Beilis "Blood Libel" case and was laughed out of court when asked some very basic questions on the Talmud which he couldn't answer. Nevertheless, his legacy survives and it is about time there was a response to it. So here is the first part.

The Reverend Justinas Bonaventura Pranaitis or Pronaitis[1] (July 27, 1861 - January 28, 1917[2]) was a Lithuanian Catholic priest, Russian "Master of Theology and Professor of the Hebrew Language at the Imperial Ecclesiastical Academy of the Roman Catholic Church" in Saint Petersburg, Russia, and, later, priest in Tashkent[2] who published an anti-Semitic tract called Christianus in Talmude Iudaeorum in Latin in 1892 under the imprimatur of the Archbishop Metropolitan of Mogilev, which was translated into English as The Talmud Unmasked; The Secret Rabbinical Teachings Concerning Christians, by American anti-Semites around 1939.[3]

The book continues to be sold by mainstream sources and cited by anti-Semites, who revere Pranaitis as a "Talmud Scholar" and authority; "The Rev. Pranaitis was the greatest of the students of the Talmud. His complete command of the Hebrew language qualified him to analyze the Talmud as few men in history." [3]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Justinas_Pranaitis

of course moronic ignorant people such as yourself-who never bothered to check the truth-beileve this BS. along with all the other islamic propaganda BS.

 

[S.A.M.]

and jews also eat christian babies

that site was probably produced by jew haters such as yourself or muslims(theres a difference?).

.

This is a jew hater?

The Babylonian Talmud
edited by Rabbi Dr. Isidore Epstein
of Jews’ College, London
More than fifteen years in the making, more than 5 1/2 million words, this monumental task of scholarship called on the best brains in Judaism and won the approval of the world's top rabbis. Yet few Christians today even know it exists, and you will probably not find it in your local public library. The Come and Hear™ hypertext version, currently on line at this web site, represents approximately 1431 folios (produced as accurately as possible). We hope this presentation will provide the necessary context for understanding ancient and modern rabbinical teachings. We hope the larger context will also enable you to evaluate how fairly various commentators interpret the text.

Passages censored in previous editions of the Talmud were restored, and the translators amplified the text with extensive footnotes that form a running commentary. The publication was completed as a 35-volume set in 1952, and republished in 18 volumes in 1961. Each tractate was accompanied by a glossary, a table of abbreviations, an index of Biblical references, and a general subject index. In 1952, Soncino published a comprehensive Index volume collating the indices from all tractates, and included an index to the statements of each of the Sages. The Jew's College/Soncino English translation of the Babylonian Talmud has remained the gold standard of English Talmuds for six decades.

http://www.come-and-hear.com/talmud/index.html

 

[Kadark]

The quote which started this whole debate is indisputably authentic. If it satisfies Spock to simply deny its existence, then so be it; however, if you were to look within the Talmud, that verse would be there, crystal clear. There are numerous websites dedicated to the Talmud, including ones which are operated by renowned Jews, all of which display that verse (and ones similar to it). Of course, I'm not the type of person who will pick specific out-of-context, isolated verses to try and make a religious point.

 

[Mr.Spock]

This is a jew hater?



http://www.come-and-hear.com/talmud/index.html

probably his real name is brian, or Jeffery or any other british name

 

[Mr.Spock]

The quote which started this whole debate is indisputably authentic. If it satisfies Spock to simply deny its existence, then so be it; however, if you were to look within the Talmud, that verse would be there, crystal clear. There are numerous websites dedicated to the Talmud, including ones which are operated by renowned Jews, all of which display that verse (and ones similar to it). Of course, I'm not the type of person who will pick specific out-of-context, isolated verses to try and make a religious point.

the man who believes in the protocol sais

how about registering to a jewish site and ask them?

 

[S.A.M.]

probably his real name is brian, or Jeffery or any other british name

Umm no?

Dr. Isidore Epstein, an Orthodox rabbi and rabbinical scholar in England, was the longtime principal of Jews' College, London. Dr. Epstein is best known for his English translation of the Babylonian Talmud (Soncino Press, London, 34 volumes, also available on CD-ROM and other books about Judaism, such as The Faith of Judaism: An Interpretation for Our Times (1960).

http://www.jewishstore.com/Books/Products.asp?ProdID=SoncinTalmud

 

[Mr.Spock]

Umm no?


http://www.jewishstore.com/Books/Products.asp?ProdID=SoncinTalmud

:roflmao:

you actually argue with me on that?

boy you dont have any brain cells at all do you?

cant face the fact you beileve in a lie SAM ?

 

[Kadark]

the man who believes in the protocol sais

how about registering to a jewish site and ask them?

Sort of like how you register to Muslim websites and ask the educated members there about Islam before you post your baseless, hateful bullshit here.

 

[S.A.M.]

:roflmao:

you actually argue with me on that?

boy you dont have any brain cells at all do you?

cant face the fact you beileve in a lie SAM ?

That a highly acclaimed Orthodox rabbi who has published an edition of the English translation of the Talmud, sold online in Jewish stores is an anti-semite?

 

[Mr.Spock]

Sort of like how you register to Muslim websites and ask the educated members there about Islam before you post your baseless, hateful bullshit here.

i did actually.

 

[Mr.Spock]

That a highly acclaimed Orthodox rabbi who has published an edition of the English translation of the Talmud, sold online in Jewish stores is an anti-semite?

then if he is a rabbi he quoted wrong:

כת בבא מציעא פרק ט

דף קיד, ב גמרא מנין לערום שלא יתרום דכתיב (דברים כג) ולא יראה בך ערות דבר אמר ליה לאו כהן הוא מר מאי טעמא קאי מר בבית הקברות א"ל לא מתני מר טהרות דתניא ר"ש בן יוחי אומר קבריהן של <עובדי כוכבים> {גוים} אין מטמאין שנאמר (יחזקאל לד) ואתן צאני צאן מרעיתי אדם אתם אתם קרויין אדם ואין <עובדי כוכבים> {גוים} קרויין אדם אמר ליה בארבעה לא מצינא בשיתא מצינא א"ל ואמאי אמר ליה דחיקא לי מילתא דבריה ועייליה לגן עדן אמר ליה פשוט גלימך ספי שקול מהני טרפי ספא שקל כי הוה נפיק שמע דקאמר מאן קא אכיל לעלמיה כרבה בר אבוה נפץ שדנהו אפילו הכי אתייה לגלימיה סחט גלימא ריחא זבניה בתריסר אלפי דינרי פלגינהו לחתנוותיה ת"ר (דברים כד) ואם איש עני הוא לא תשכב בעבוטו הא עשיר שכיב מאי קאמר אמר רב ששת הכי קאמר ואם איש עני הוא לא תשכב ועבוטו אצלך הא עשיר שכיב ועבוטו אצלך ת"ר המלוה את חבירו אינו רשאי למשכנו ואינו חייב להחזיר לו ועובר בכל השמות הללו מאי קאמר אמר רב ששת הכי קאמר המלוה את חבירו אינו רשאי למשכנו ואם משכנו חייב להחזיר לו ועובר בכל השמות הללו אסיפא רבא אמר הכי קאמר המלוה את חבירו אינו רשאי למשכנו ואם משכנו חייב להחזיר לו במה דברים אמורים שמשכנו שלא בשעת הלואתו אבל משכנו בשעת הלואתו אינו חייב להחזיר לו ועובר בכל השמות הללו ארישא תני רב שיזבי קמיה דרבא (שמות כב) עד בא השמש תשיבנו לו זו כסות לילה (דברים כד) השב תשיב לו את העבוט כבוא השמש זו כסות יום אמר ליה דיממא בליליא למה לי ודליליא ביממא למה לי אמר ליה איסמייה אמר ליה לא הכי קאמר עד בא השמש תשיבנו לו זו כסות יום שניתנה לחבול בלילה השב תשיב לו את העבוט כבוא השמש זו כסות לילה שניתנה לחבול ביום אמר ר' יוחנן משכנו ומת שומטו מעל גבי בניו מיתיבי אמר ר' מאיר וכי מאחר שממשכנין למה מחזירין למה מחזירין רחמנא אמר אהדר אלא מאחר שמחזירין



which is related to:

יחזקאל פרק לד
א וַיְהִי דְבַר-יְהוָה, אֵלַי לֵאמֹר. ב בֶּן-אָדָם, הִנָּבֵא עַל-רוֹעֵי יִשְׂרָאֵל; הִנָּבֵא וְאָמַרְתָּ אֲלֵיהֶם לָרֹעִים כֹּה אָמַר אֲדֹנָי יְהוִה, הוֹי רֹעֵי-יִשְׂרָאֵל אֲשֶׁר הָיוּ רֹעִים אוֹתָם--הֲלוֹא הַצֹּאן, יִרְעוּ הָרֹעִים. ג אֶת-הַחֵלֶב תֹּאכֵלוּ וְאֶת-הַצֶּמֶר תִּלְבָּשׁוּ, הַבְּרִיאָה תִּזְבָּחוּ; הַצֹּאן, לֹא תִרְעוּ. ד אֶת-הַנַּחְלוֹת לֹא חִזַּקְתֶּם וְאֶת-הַחוֹלָה לֹא-רִפֵּאתֶם, וְלַנִּשְׁבֶּרֶת לֹא חֲבַשְׁתֶּם, וְאֶת-הַנִּדַּחַת לֹא הֲשֵׁבֹתֶם, וְאֶת-הָאֹבֶדֶת לֹא בִקַּשְׁתֶּם; וּבְחָזְקָה רְדִיתֶם אֹתָם, וּבְפָרֶךְ. ה וַתְּפוּצֶינָה, מִבְּלִי רֹעֶה; וַתִּהְיֶינָה לְאָכְלָה לְכָל-חַיַּת הַשָּׂדֶה, וַתְּפוּצֶינָה. ו יִשְׁגּוּ צֹאנִי בְּכָל-הֶהָרִים, וְעַל כָּל-גִּבְעָה רָמָה; וְעַל כָּל-פְּנֵי הָאָרֶץ נָפֹצוּ צֹאנִי, וְאֵין דּוֹרֵשׁ וְאֵין מְבַקֵּשׁ. ז לָכֵן רֹעִים, שִׁמְעוּ אֶת-דְּבַר יְהוָה. ח חַי-אָנִי נְאֻם אֲדֹנָי יְהוִה, אִם-לֹא יַעַן הֱיוֹת-צֹאנִי לָבַז וַתִּהְיֶינָה צֹאנִי לְאָכְלָה לְכָל-חַיַּת הַשָּׂדֶה מֵאֵין רֹעֶה, וְלֹא-דָרְשׁוּ רֹעַי, אֶת-צֹאנִי; וַיִּרְעוּ הָרֹעִים אוֹתָם, וְאֶת-צֹאנִי לֹא רָעוּ. ט לָכֵן, הָרֹעִים--שִׁמְעוּ, דְּבַר-יְהוָה. י כֹּה-אָמַר אֲדֹנָי יְהוִה, הִנְנִי אֶל-הָרֹעִים וְדָרַשְׁתִּי אֶת-צֹאנִי מִיָּדָם וְהִשְׁבַּתִּים מֵרְעוֹת צֹאן, וְלֹא-יִרְעוּ עוֹד הָרֹעִים, אוֹתָם; וְהִצַּלְתִּי צֹאנִי מִפִּיהֶם, וְלֹא-תִהְיֶיןָ לָהֶם לְאָכְלָה. {ס}

יא כִּי כֹּה אָמַר, אֲדֹנָי יְהוִה: הִנְנִי-אָנִי, וְדָרַשְׁתִּי אֶת-צֹאנִי וּבִקַּרְתִּים. יב כְּבַקָּרַת רֹעֶה עֶדְרוֹ בְּיוֹם-הֱיוֹתוֹ בְתוֹךְ-צֹאנוֹ, נִפְרָשׁוֹת--כֵּן, אֲבַקֵּר אֶת-צֹאנִי; וְהִצַּלְתִּי אֶתְהֶם, מִכָּל-הַמְּקוֹמֹת אֲשֶׁר נָפֹצוּ שָׁם, בְּיוֹם עָנָן, וַעֲרָפֶל. יג וְהוֹצֵאתִים מִן-הָעַמִּים, וְקִבַּצְתִּים מִן-הָאֲרָצוֹת, וַהֲבִיאוֹתִים, אֶל-אַדְמָתָם; וּרְעִיתִים, אֶל-הָרֵי יִשְׂרָאֵל, בָּאֲפִיקִים, וּבְכֹל מוֹשְׁבֵי הָאָרֶץ. יד בְּמִרְעֶה-טּוֹב אֶרְעֶה אֹתָם, וּבְהָרֵי מְרוֹם-יִשְׂרָאֵל יִהְיֶה נְוֵהֶם; שָׁם תִּרְבַּצְנָה בְּנָוֶה טּוֹב, וּמִרְעֶה שָׁמֵן תִּרְעֶינָה אֶל-הָרֵי יִשְׂרָאֵל. טו אֲנִי אֶרְעֶה צֹאנִי וַאֲנִי אַרְבִּיצֵם, נְאֻם אֲדֹנָי יְהוִה. טז אֶת-הָאֹבֶדֶת אֲבַקֵּשׁ, וְאֶת-הַנִּדַּחַת אָשִׁיב, וְלַנִּשְׁבֶּרֶת אֶחֱבֹשׁ, וְאֶת-הַחוֹלָה אֲחַזֵּק; וְאֶת-הַשְּׁמֵנָה וְאֶת-הַחֲזָקָה אַשְׁמִיד, אֶרְעֶנָּה בְמִשְׁפָּט. יז וְאַתֵּנָה צֹאנִי, כֹּה אָמַר אֲדֹנָי יְהוִה: הִנְנִי שֹׁפֵט בֵּין-שֶׂה לָשֶׂה, לָאֵילִים וְלָעַתּוּדִים. יח הַמְעַט מִכֶּם, הַמִּרְעֶה הַטּוֹב תִּרְעוּ, וְיֶתֶר מִרְעֵיכֶם, תִּרְמְסוּ בְּרַגְלֵיכֶם; וּמִשְׁקַע-מַיִם תִּשְׁתּוּ--וְאֵת הַנּוֹתָרִים, בְּרַגְלֵיכֶם תִּרְפֹּשׂוּן. יט וְצֹאנִי--מִרְמַס רַגְלֵיכֶם תִּרְעֶינָה, וּמִרְפַּשׂ רַגְלֵיכֶם תִּשְׁתֶּינָה. {פ}

כ לָכֵן, כֹּה אָמַר אֲדֹנָי יְהוִה--אֲלֵיהֶם: הִנְנִי-אָנִי--וְשָׁפַטְתִּי בֵּין-שֶׂה בִרְיָה, וּבֵין שֶׂה רָזָה. כא יַעַן, בְּצַד וּבְכָתֵף תֶּהְדֹּפוּ, וּבְקַרְנֵיכֶם תְּנַגְּחוּ, כָּל-הַנַּחְלוֹת--עַד אֲשֶׁר הֲפִיצוֹתֶם אוֹתָנָה, אֶל-הַחוּצָה. כב וְהוֹשַׁעְתִּי לְצֹאנִי, וְלֹא-תִהְיֶינָה עוֹד לָבַז; וְשָׁפַטְתִּי, בֵּין שֶׂה לָשֶׂה. כג וַהֲקִמֹתִי עֲלֵיהֶם רֹעֶה אֶחָד, וְרָעָה אֶתְהֶן--אֵת, עַבְדִּי דָוִיד; הוּא יִרְעֶה אֹתָם, וְהוּא-יִהְיֶה לָהֶן לְרֹעֶה. כד וַאֲנִי יְהוָה, אֶהְיֶה לָהֶם לֵאלֹהִים, וְעַבְדִּי דָוִד, נָשִׂיא בְתוֹכָם: אֲנִי יְהוָה, דִּבַּרְתִּי. כה וְכָרַתִּי לָהֶם בְּרִית שָׁלוֹם, וְהִשְׁבַּתִּי חַיָּה-רָעָה מִן-הָאָרֶץ; וְיָשְׁבוּ בַמִּדְבָּר לָבֶטַח, וְיָשְׁנוּ בַּיְּעָרִים. כו וְנָתַתִּי אוֹתָם וּסְבִיבוֹת גִּבְעָתִי, בְּרָכָה; וְהוֹרַדְתִּי הַגֶּשֶׁם בְּעִתּוֹ, גִּשְׁמֵי בְרָכָה יִהְיוּ. כז וְנָתַן עֵץ הַשָּׂדֶה אֶת-פִּרְיוֹ, וְהָאָרֶץ תִּתֵּן יְבוּלָהּ, וְהָיוּ עַל-אַדְמָתָם, לָבֶטַח; וְיָדְעוּ כִּי-אֲנִי יְהוָה, בְּשִׁבְרִי אֶת-מֹטוֹת עֻלָּם, וְהִצַּלְתִּים, מִיַּד הָעֹבְדִים בָּהֶם. כח וְלֹא-יִהְיוּ עוֹד בַּז לַגּוֹיִם, וְחַיַּת הָאָרֶץ לֹא תֹאכְלֵם; וְיָשְׁבוּ לָבֶטַח, וְאֵין מַחֲרִיד. כט וַהֲקִמֹתִי לָהֶם מַטָּע, לְשֵׁם; וְלֹא-יִהְיוּ עוֹד אֲסֻפֵי רָעָב, בָּאָרֶץ, וְלֹא-יִשְׂאוּ עוֹד, כְּלִמַּת הַגּוֹיִם. ל וְיָדְעוּ, כִּי אֲנִי יְהוָה אֱלֹהֵיהֶם--אִתָּם; וְהֵמָּה, עַמִּי בֵּית יִשְׂרָאֵל--נְאֻם, אֲדֹנָי יְהוִה. לא וְאַתֵּן צֹאנִי צֹאן מַרְעִיתִי, אָדָם אַתֶּם: אֲנִי, אֱלֹהֵיכֶם--נְאֻם, אֲדֹנָי יְהוִה. {פ}

and doesnt actually says anything close to:

If a man dies, according to Talmudic law, then standing on or near his gravesite is considered a defilement. This does not apply to graves of gentiles as they are not considered men.

 

[Kadark]

We can't read Hebrew, Spock. You don't win an argument by debating in a different language.

 

[Mr.Spock]

We can't read Hebrew, Spock. You don't win an argument by debating in a different language.

so maybe you shouldnt argue with me what it says and what its not?

its says nothing of gentiles being not men.

 

[Kadark]

so maybe you shouldnt argue with me what it says and what its not?

its says nothing of gentiles being not men.

As Sam said:

"highly acclaimed Orthodox rabbi who has published an edition of the English translation of the Talmud"

I don't know Hebrew, so considering my circumstances, it's fair to say that a Jew with such impressive credentials is likely my best source for understanding the Talmud. You're here saying he quoted the text incorrectly.

I ask you, is your résumé as impressive as his? Do tell.

 

[S.A.M.]

Even the term Gentiles, used for non-Jews, refers to pagan sex worshippers and demon worshippers and is itself a derogatory term.

1 Thessalonians 4:5 (King James Version)
King James Version (KJV)
5Not in the lust of concupiscence, even as the Gentiles which know not God:

1 Corinthians 10:20 (King James Version)
King James Version (KJV)
20But I say, that the things which the Gentiles sacrifice, they sacrifice to devils, and not to God: and I would not that ye should have fellowship with devils.