Zimmerman: A New Chapter

[Russ_Watters]

To the other, you'll notice we're not lynching him.

Well that definitely worked-out better for him, but arguably not better for the country. Maliciously prosecuting an innocent man because the public hates him is also the sort of thing that racists used to do to blacks before the '60s. Now it goes the other way and is considered acceptable. That's a regression in race relations - a pendulum swinging in the opposite direction.

Colloquially, many people still call O.J. Simpson a murderer, even though it would be grossly unfair to apply that standard to George Zimmerman. I'm sure even Russ can agree with that, and maybe even do us the kindness of explaining the difference.

There are some differences, some of which may even-out with time:
-OJ lost a "wrongful death" civil suit. It is basically a repeat of the criminal trial, but with a lower burden of proof. I expect Martin's family to bring such a suit against Zimmerman. We'll just have to wait and see how that goes.
-OJ made quite a lot of statements implying guilt following the trial, including a book, absurdly described as a "hypothetical confession".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/O._J._Simpson_murder_case#Civil_trial
-Evidence in the Simpson case thinly pointed to murder, but evidence in the Martin case solidly pointed toward self defense.

But O.J. was acquitted because it looked like he was framed, and we still call him a murderer.

There's something about that I'm still missing, though. And I feel like it's kind of obvious.

No he wasn't. He was acquitted because the evidence was thin and the police and prosecution botched the case. The ill-fitting bloody glove, for example, was a bad mistake and raised doubt. From the wiki:

In post-trial interviews with the jurors, a few said that they believed Simpson probably did commit the murders,[49] but that the prosecution failed to prove their case. Three jurors published a book called Madam Foreman, in which they described how police errors, not race, led to their verdict, and that they considered prosecutor Darden to be a token black assigned to the case by the prosecutor's office.

 

[Russ_Watters]

If memory serves me correctly, Russ believed that GZ acted in self defense, and was therefore justified in killing Trayvon Martin. (from what I recall of the GZ thread, here)

Yes, but of course my beliefs don't really matter here. It's the jury finding that matters. It just happens that my beliefs match the jury decision while the beliefs of most in that thread and this one do not.

 

[Russ_Watters]

He murdered Trayvon.

Not according to the only people who's opinion on the subject really matters.

 

[Bells]

So his ex wife and now his girlfriend are lying? What about his former fiance who had a restraining order against him long before Trayvon Martin's death and long before he was even married? What about the police officer he once assaulted?

His ex wife had also accused him of pulling a gun on her and her father recently.

This seems to be a recurring theme with Zimmerman.

You commented on the public lynching him. Unless of course you believe that this was all planned to get him from so many years ago?

 

[billvon]

Maliciously prosecuting an innocent man because the public hates him is also the sort of thing that racists used to do to blacks before the '60s.

Were you angry that they persecuted OJ Simpson so horribly as well?

 

[billvon]

You're right, I erred - I was thinking about that incident a few months ago, when people here - including, I think, Tiassa - said he'd been arrested when he wasn't. But he must have been arrested in 2012 in order to stand trial.

And in 2005 for assault on a police officer. And of course his recent arrest.

I know, it's hard to keep them all straight sometimes.

 

[Russ_Watters]

So his ex wife and now his girlfriend are lying?

I don't know, but what I do know is that his ex-wife and girlfriend are not accusing him of Martin's murder.

You commented on the public lynching him. Unless of course you believe that this was all planned to get him from so many years ago?

No I didn't, but in any case, based on that quote, I'm not sure you know what a lynching is.

 

[Russ_Watters]

And in 2005 for assault on a police officer.

Forgot about that one too...

And of course his recent arrest.

Are we counting that one twice?

 

[Bells]

I don't know, but what I do know is that his ex-wife and girlfriend are not accusing him of Martin's murder.

No I didn't, but in any case, based on that quote, I'm not sure you know what a lynching is.

This thread isn't about Martin but about Zimmerman again threatening the women he is involved with.

And trust me, I know what a lynching is.

 

[Russ_Watters]

This thread isn't about Martin but about Zimmerman again threatening the women he is involved with.

This thread is about people assuming this recent incident is evidence that Zimmerman murdered Martin. We wouldn't be discussing a random, minor domestic violence case otherwise.

 

[Russ_Watters]

Were you angry that they persecuted OJ Simpson so horribly as well?

That doesn't compute: As well as what? The prosecution didn't do a good job with Zimmerman's case, but it didn't really matter since the evidence pointed clearly to self defense. Their biggest mistake was going forward with the prosecution at all!

 

[quinnsong]

This thread is about people assuming this recent incident is evidence that Zimmerman murdered Martin. We wouldn't be discussing a random, minor domestic violence case otherwise.

He has a history of volatility towards others so calling it random is in error.

 

[Russ_Watters]

He has a history of volatility towards others so calling it random is in error.

You misunderstand: my point was that if his name weren't Zimmerman, we wouldn't be discussing this. Other incidents like this or worse happen dozens of times a day, but we're not discussing any of them - most don't even make the news.

 

[wegs]

You misunderstand: my point was that if his name weren't Zimmerman, we wouldn't be discussing this. Other incidents like this or worse happen dozens of times a day, but we're not discussing any of them - most don't even make the news.

Comparable to this story, though?
No, not every day is a guy wrongfully acquitted of murder, and then is back in the news TWICE for two separate occasions whereby he is threatening bodily harm against two women, is arrested again, and is now out on bond for one of those incidents. There aren't dozens of stories like this in the news, every day.

 

[pjdude1219]

This thread is about people assuming this recent incident is evidence that Zimmerman murdered Martin. We wouldn't be discussing a random, minor domestic violence case otherwise.

I don't know where your from but where I'm from pulling a gun on someone is not a minor case of anything

 

[dumbest man on earth]

Comparable to this story, though?
No, not every day is a guy wrongfully acquitted of murder, and then is back in the news TWICE for two separate occasions whereby he is threatening bodily harm against two women, is arrested again, and is now out on bond for one of those incidents. There aren't dozens of stories like this in the news, every day.

Wegs, 60 words in that Post. The 13th word, "wrongfully", gives me pause! How can a guy be "wrongfully" acquitted?

 

[wegs]

Wegs, 60 words in that Post. The 13th word, "wrongfully", gives me pause! How can a guy be "wrongfully" acquitted?

haha, 'wrongly' ...sorry! :facepalm:

 

[billvon]

That doesn't compute: As well as what?

" Maliciously prosecuting an innocent man because the public hates him is also the sort of thing that racists used to do to blacks before the '60s. "

Are you also angry that OJ, an innocent man, was prosecuted just because the public hates him?

Their biggest mistake was going forward with the prosecution at all!

Likewise, are you annoyed that the OJ prosecution went forward, thus persecuting an innocent man?

 

[Russ_Watters]

Comparable to this story, though?
No, not every day is a guy wrongfully acquitted of murder, and then is back in the news TWICE for two separate occasions whereby he is threatening bodily harm against two women, is arrested again, and is now out on bond for one of those incidents. There aren't dozens of stories like this in the news, every day.

Clearly. Again, that's exactly my point: we are discussing this because of his famous acquittal for murder, not because of the mundane, everyday occurrence of domestic incidents.

 

[Russ_Watters]

I don't know where your from but where I'm from pulling a gun on someone is not a minor case of anything

Compared to what usually makes the news and becomes important enough to discuss in a science forum, it absolutely is.