Xianity declining worldwide

[heart]

MW,

Originally posted by Medicine*Woman
M*W: Generally, I don't use anger in my life. I stay free from it. I don't hate anyone, not even xians. I dislike them for their stupidity. I also want to show them that they are wrong in their hatred for Islam. That's like the pot calling the kettle black. Why would I NOT want to frighten them? Look what their history has shown! Approaching it strategically is not what I want to do. I am not a manipulator. I tell it as it is. xians need to be punished for the past 2000 years' of blood-letting, bigotry, and pedophiles in the name of Jesus. It's time xians atoned for what their forefathers did in the Crusades, witch-hunts, Inquisition, and all the rest of the horrors of xianity. Their fierce misogyny killed 9 million innocent women in the name of Jesus during the Inquisition alone. Why should I forgive them for this atrocity? A lot of the women they burned at the stake were midwives and healers like myself. No, I'm not using this forum as a vehicle to relieve my anger. My anger will be relieved when there are no more xians. Why is it NOT okay to abhor evil?

At one time I was angry at christians because of the whole concept of hell and how some promoted it.
Also, angry because I had felt brainwashed for believing it. I had gone through the "motions" of being (faking) a christian...then later- accepting it hook line and sinker. Well, maybe not 100% as there were many doubts I had. To make a long story short.. I realized that my anger couldn't be directed toward christians ... Bottom line is what message did my anger send..what good did it do, and was it really justified?

To place blame on them for something other christians had done in the past isn't fair. They aren't the ones who actually committed the crimes, and I know some christians who would disagree with the unfair slayings. We can hate those tragedies that occurred, but carrying around anger and wanting revenge for something that was out of their control is only fuel to keep this anger alive.

I see in your posts, that you want so badly for others to be free from what you feel is a harmful myth (which I agree is). You want to prevent them from having to spend a part of their life being duped. I think your heart is in the right place...but, don't lose sight of christians being individuals. Remember, you once stood where they stand.

I still have a hard time when I experience talking to other christians who are "fire and brimstone" messengers. It goes all through me.. and yes, at times I want to lash out verbally because of it. It's almost all I can do to not lose my temper. Although I'm not without guilt of that, I have come a long way. It's easy to stereotype, but that can take away from the true picture of the individual. If I had continued to dismiss christians entirely, I'd of missed out on some good friendships.

Please don't misunderstand my post and think that I'm bashing you, because I'm not. I'm just another person who has maybe experienced some of what you are going through. If I'm off the mark, then please accept my apologies.

 

[Nehushta]

Originally posted by Medicine*Woman
M*W: I know you are right. "Humanity is outgrowing Christianity." Why don't they see it happening around them? Why are they so blind? It's not that I hate them, it's just that I can't make them see the error of their ways. Believing they have a savior that died for their sins is an abomination. It's blasphemy. It's apostasy.

It's spiritual laziness. Unfortunately, you'll always have a certain percentage of the population that is spiritually lazy. Christianity is comfortable for them. If they really wanted to know the Truth, they would have figured out by now how to go about searching for it. But as long as they continue to pray for the Truth in the name of their avatar, they'll only get the particular brand of "truth" that their avatar peddles. Deep down, they know this. The fact that they continue to pray in his name is proof that that's the only brand of "truth" they are interested in. They are like children, and your attempt to get them to try on a different, more mature brand of spirituality is like trying to convince a teenager to wear a different brand of shoes than what all of his peers are wearing. They won't even consider it until they've grown up a bit.

 

[VitalOne]

Originally posted by Medicine*Woman
M*W: Generally, I don't use anger in my life. I stay free from it. I don't hate anyone, not even xians. I dislike them for their stupidity. I also want to show them that they are wrong in their hatred for Islam. That's like the pot calling the kettle black. Why would I NOT want to frighten them? Look what their history has shown! Approaching it strategically is not what I want to do. I am not a manipulator. I tell it as it is. xians need to be punished for the past 2000 years' of blood-letting, bigotry, and pedophiles in the name of Jesus. It's time xians atoned for what their forefathers did in the Crusades, witch-hunts, Inquisition, and all the rest of the horrors of xianity. Their fierce misogyny killed 9 million innocent women in the name of Jesus during the Inquisition alone. Why should I forgive them for this atrocity? A lot of the women they burned at the stake were midwives and healers like myself. No, I'm not using this forum as a vehicle to relieve my anger. My anger will be relieved when there are no more xians. Why is it NOT okay to abhor evil?

Yes, frigtening them would certainly prove that you're a kind, uncruel person. Saying xians need to be punished is just the same as xians saying you need to be punished. Why should they be responsible for what their forefathers did? If your grandfather killed someone, would you want me to kill you? Why should they be held responsible for the actions of someone else? Just because they were born into a certain family?

You have to get over the FACT that it wasn't them who killed those 9 million people. Why should they suffer because of the actions of their great great relatives? Just because they were born into a Christian family? All you're doing is redirecting your anger because you know that there's NOTHING you can do about what happened in the past but redirect your anger against the modern day Christians. Two wrongs don't make a right, they make two wrongs.

 

[Medicine*Woman]

Originally posted by heart
MW,

At one time I was angry at christians because of the whole concept of hell and how some promoted it. Also, angry because I had felt brainwashed for believing it. I had gone through the "motions" of being (faking) a christian...then later- accepting it hook line and sinker. Well, maybe not 100% as there were many doubts I had. To make a long story short.. I realized that my anger couldn't be directed toward christians ... Bottom line is what message did my anger send..what good did it do, and was it really justified?

To place blame on them for something other christians had done in the past isn't fair. They aren't the ones who actually committed the crimes, and I know some christians who would disagree with the unfair slayings. We can hate those tragedies that occurred, but carrying around anger and wanting revenge for something that was out of their control is only fuel to keep this anger alive.

I see in your posts, that you want so badly for others to be free from what you feel is a harmful myth (which I agree is). You want to prevent them from having to spend a part of their life being duped. I think your heart is in the right place...but, don't lose sight of christians being individuals. Remember, you once stood where they stand.

I still have a hard time when I experience talking to other christians who are "fire and brimstone" messengers. It goes all through me.. and yes, at times I want to lash out verbally because of it. It's almost all I can do to not lose my temper. Although I'm not without guilt of that, I have come a long way. It's easy to stereotype, but that can take away from the true picture of the individual. If I had continued to dismiss christians entirely, I'd of missed out on some good friendships.

Please don't misunderstand my post and think that I'm bashing you, because I'm not. I'm just another person who has maybe experienced some of what you are going through. If I'm off the mark, then please accept my apologies.
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M*W: I can see that you went through the same thing as I did. What frustrates me most of all is when I quote and explain scripture in a more spiritual way, they come back with the usual "Jesus died for me" response. They won't even listen to me, and that's probably why I got "louder." I realize they are closed-minded to any explanation other than the one they've been programmed to believe. Even the most intelligent xians, like Jenyar and okinrus for example, cannot even begin to understand anything but what he's been taught! If the more intelligent ones refuse to listen, there's no hope for the average ones. For every anti-xian like me out there trying to re-educate them, there's millions of them keeping each other in their cult mentality. The time has come to introduce these xians to the 21st century. They're still living in the Dark Ages!

You did not offend me with your post. I appreciate your comments. I believe the time is right, and some xian scholars are speaking out against the old ways. There was a program on Monday night called "Jesus, Mary and da Vinci." It was about Jesus and M. Magdalene being married with children. I've been saying this for a long time, now the xian churches are starting to speak of it. I think we'll find out in our lifetimes that Jesus didn't die on the cross like they believe. The whole point I want to make is that salvation is not necessary. The fact that you are here on Earth, alive and breathing, is proof of "salvation." If you weren't here, alive and breathing, then you wouldn't have been "saved" for another go-round on Earth. I think this would only apply to the most heinous, evil people we could imagine (like Hitler, etc.).

Of course, its just another way to look at the purpose of our lives. The Bible has been butchered through the ages, so the NT cannot be in any form of accuracy. There shouldn't even be a NT nor should there be anyone called a "Christian." It's a false legacy and the believers of this mythology are doomed. Of course, I could just say "it's not my problem," but I'm not a wait-and-see kind of person. While they pray and worship a savior, they are not accepting accountability for their own soul--the One Spirit of God that dwells within them. There heart may be in the right place, but their soul is lost.

 

[okinrus]

You did not offend me with your post. I appreciate your comments. I believe the time is right, and some xian scholars are speaking out against the old ways. There was a program on Monday night called "Jesus, Mary and da Vinci." It was about Jesus and M. Magdalene being married with children. I've been saying this for a long time, now the xian churches are starting to speak of it.

I will repeat the argument used as I remember it. Someone found some half-forged document that could be x-many years and said that a "fish" married someone. This same "fish" was supposed to stand for Jesus or say they say. Just a little flawed? Fish are only a sign for discipleship or christianity in general. The show goes on to say that the gnostic gospels show Jesus kissing Mary Magdalene somewhere. Do you want to know why? Because the gnostic leaders such as Marcus were known womenizers. Iraenaeus even said that they cast spells on the women and appointed women as priest. In order to appeal to women they would resort to this kind of stuft.

 

[heart]

What frustrates me most of all is when I quote and explain scripture in a more spiritual way, they come back with the usual "Jesus died for me" response. They won't even listen to me, and that's probably why I got "louder."

I understand, and yes, it does get frustrating when you're trying to make a point and it seems that the other party passes it off like a bad leftover. On the other hand I'm sure it's frustrating for them as well. LOL

Even the most intelligent xians, like Jenyar and okinrus for example, cannot even begin to understand anything but what he's been taught! If the more intelligent ones refuse to listen, there's no hope for the average ones. For every anti-xian like me out there trying to re-educate them, there's millions of them keeping each other in their cult mentality. The time has come to introduce these xians to the 21st century. They're still living in the Dark Ages!

I can think of an intelligent mod here who broke away from christianity- that being Cris. There are some preachers who have broke away.. all kinds of folks. All you can do MW is share your findings...discuss and learn from others as well as them learning from you. I know it can get frustrating at times, but don't let that get you down.

There was a program on Monday night called "Jesus, Mary and da Vinci." It was about Jesus and M. Magdalene being married with children. I've been saying this for a long time, now the xian churches are starting to speak of it. I think we'll find out in our lifetimes that Jesus didn't die on the cross like they believe.

I've heard that before, but hadn't done any research on it. You never know, it might be in our lifetime that we learn this is true, some people would be freaked out to say the least. Although, it might be hard to trace as they haven't been able to verify that Jesus existed.

If you weren't here, alive and breathing, then you wouldn't have been "saved" for another go-round on Earth. I think this would only apply to the most heinous, evil people we could imagine (like Hitler, etc.).

I'm not sure what you are saying here. Do you mean that those who are evil aren't reincarnated?

The Bible has been butchered through the ages, so the NT cannot be in any form of accuracy

There are the obvious contradictions in the bible in terms of numbers etc... For some reason christians will excuse those, being that they can't dispute them, but they will hold fast to the bible being inerrant.
It's funny how we can all see things differently.

Hang in there MW. Don't let frustration mess with you. At the end of the day you know what efforts you have put forth, and if you are content with that in your heart that's all that matters.

 

[Medicine*Woman]

Originally posted by heart

I can think of an intelligent mod here who broke away from christianity- that being Cris. There are some preachers who have broke away.. all kinds of folks.
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M*W: Thanks! I would like to communicate with all those people who have broken away. I'm sure we have common experiences.
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I've heard that before, but hadn't done any research on it. You never know, it might be in our lifetime that we learn this is true, some people would be freaked out to say the least. Although, it might be hard to trace as they haven't been able to verify that Jesus existed.
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M*W: There's been a lot of research done on this. M. Magdalene, a patron sainte of France, was known to have lived and died there. The legend is a prominent one in France. I've been to the area where she was to have raised Jesus's children. Rumor has it that Jesus, too, is buried there. There is dispute over the exact location. However, I find there are too many "intuitive" type clues. For example, the towns of Arques (Ark of the Covenant?; Ark as in "body"?) Carcassonne (carcas "body" of the "son"?); Et in arcadia ego? "I am also in "arcadia" OR "I am also in the Ark of God"? Tourists have been digging this area up! There are references to the "Tomb of God" (arcadia). There are just too many clues to ignore this any longer. Paintings by Teniers and Pouisson hold clues to the exact location of Jesus's body. Researchers just can't agree on where it is. Just read through a new publication (which I don't agree with) that says the Ark of the Covenant is underneath Golgotha, and allegedly Jesus's blood dripped down through a crevice in the mount and fell onto the Ark of the Covenant. There was a map of the alleged exact location. I don't believe this story, though. M. Magdalene is always depicted with a skull in paintings. John the Baptist is always depicted with his index finger pointing up. In some classical paintings of the BVM, Joseph and Jesus are mistakenly identified. They may actually be depicting M. Magdalene, Jesus and their child/ren. When I visit art museums, I always see these "other" possible depictions. They are referenced in all the research material about France. I believe Jesus escaped the xifixion and went to France with MM and the kids. I believe he lived to a ripe old age and died there leaving many children who married into the royal families of Europe. Thats where they came up with the "Divine Right of Kings" etc. There is some truth to it, I believe. The research will continue until they find Jesus's actual burial place. I have a theory that it's beneath the Cathedral of Chartres. The clues to where "X" marks the spot is at a certain time when the sun shines through the stained glass windows at midday, specifically through some grape-like fruit called "blue apples," where the sunray marks a spot on the floor by the altar
where there is believed to be a tomb. The other part of the enigmatic riddle is it says "...and there he is, dead." It's got to be Jesus! This would disprove the entirety of xianity--it already does for me--maybe the rest of the world will take notice. Jesus didn't die for anyone--he didn't die until he was old. The holy grail, I believe is MM's womb which carried on the bloodline of Jesus. Believe me, there is more truth to this theory than there is in the entire Bible!


I'm not sure what you are saying here. Do you mean that those who are evil aren't reincarnated?



There are the obvious contradictions in the bible in terms of numbers etc... For some reason christians will excuse those, being that they can't dispute them, but they will hold fast to the bible being inerrant.
It's funny how we can all see things differently.

Hang in there MW. Don't let frustration mess with you. At the end of the day you know what efforts you have put forth, and if you are content with that in your heart that's all that matters.

 

[Circe]

MW, there is absolutely no proof that Jesus survived the crucifixion and escaped to France.

Paintings by Teniers and Pouisson hold clues to the exact location of Jesus's body.

Who says so? And If the paintings point to the EXACT location why is it so difficult to find the body?

M. Magdalene is always depicted with a skull in paintings.

Yes, but the skull isn't necessarily a symbol of a hidden tomb

John the Baptist is always depicted with his index finger pointing up

So? Brothers Van Eyck painted an angel with his (or her, since the figure looks feminine) index finger pointing up on their Ghent Altarpiece. And da Vinci himself used the same gesture when drawing Mary and her cousin Elizabeth with their two sons. This time it's Elizabeth that's raising the finger.

 

[okinrus]

There are the obvious contradictions in the bible in terms of numbers etc... For some reason christians will excuse those, being that they can't dispute them, but they will hold fast to the bible being inerrant.
It's funny how we can all see things differently.

Most christians don't hold the bible to be inerrant but to be theologically infalliable or the original texts before scribal mistakes inerrant. For example, someone can believe that the stories of Tobit and Jonah never happened yet believe that they; being a part of Jewish folklore, teaching valid doctrin, and having an interesting storyline, are therefore inspired.

It's got to be Jesus! This would disprove the entirety of xianity--it already does for me--maybe the rest of the world will take notice. Jesus didn't die for anyone--he didn't die until he was old. The holy grail, I believe is MM's womb which carried on the bloodline of Jesus. Believe me, there is more truth to this theory than there is in the entire Bible!

Where your heart is who knows but your mind is somewhere in outerspace.

 

[Quantum Quack]

To me the bible is like a huge cryptic crossword puzzle.

Over a miilion questions that are by nature cryptic with multiple answers to every one of them and not one answer either true or false.

The only question that seems to be valid to me is whether I want to try and solve the puzzle. ( a puzzle that can't be solved)

 

[Medicine*Woman]

Originally posted by Circe
MW, there is absolutely no proof that Jesus survived the crucifixion and escaped to France.
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M*W: Maybe no proof, YET!
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Who says so? And If the paintings point to the EXACT location why is it so difficult to find the body?
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M*W: Good question, and thanks for asking. The answer is that there are many researchers who are there and waiting to excavate, but the Roman Catholic Church has gotten injunctions on each and everyone of them forbidding them to dig and have charged them with trespassing. Someone will get through I believe. The church has been "protecting" this area for years. The RCC knows the truth, and that's why they are getting the courts to step in.
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Yes, but the skull isn't necessarily a symbol of a hidden tomb
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M*W: No, the skull isn't a symbol of a hidden tomb. I didn't mean to imply that. The skull allegedly is Jesus's. Remember, these were artists' depictions of the story. It could be anyone's skull, it's just more prominently depicted with MM.
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So? Brothers Van Eyck painted an angel with his (or her, since the figure looks feminine) index finger pointing up on their Ghent Altarpiece. And da Vinci himself used the same gesture when drawing Mary and her cousin Elizabeth with their two sons. This time it's Elizabeth that's raising the finger.
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M*W: Interesting! Not surprising that Elizabeth, John's mother, would be pointing upward like he is always depicted. Just an artist's conception. There's also the theory that Jesus had a twin. Many artists have depicted two babies about the same age in paintings. The twin of Jesus is alleged to be Thomas (the twin). I don't have an opinion about this one way or the other. Poussin and Teniers' paintings have more of a geometric design resembling a map of the southern French Languedoc.

 

[okinrus]

I think the true reason why M*W hates Paul so much is that he instructed us to refrain from vain and foolish genealogies.

M*W: Good question, and thanks for asking. The answer is that there are many researchers who are there and waiting to excavate, but the Roman Catholic Church has gotten injunctions on each and everyone of them forbidding them to dig and have charged them with trespassing. Someone will get through I believe. The church has been "protecting" this area for years. The RCC knows the truth, and that's why they are getting the courts to step in.

And what area is this? The story turns, a skull but whose? The Catholic Church displays the blood of Jesus if you believe the Eucharist miracles.

 

[heart]

Most christians don't hold the bible to be inerrant

Wow, most? Maybe where you are from, but to be 100% truthful with you, you're the first christian I've known to say this.

 

[okinrus]

Wow, most? Maybe where you are from, but to be 100% truthful with you, you're the first christian I've known to say this.

I think your misinterpreting what christians mean by inerrant because it depends on what you consider "error". I don't consider gramatical errors, spelling errors or minor copying errors as erronious teachings insofar as the writing isn't a grammar book.

 

[heart]

MW,

There's been a lot of research done on this. M. Magdalene, a patron sainte of France, was known to have lived and died there. The legend is a prominent one in France. I've been to the area where she was to have raised Jesus's children. Rumor has it that Jesus, too, is buried there.

This is very interesting to say the least. Do you recommend a source that I could read about this? Thank you for all the info.

 

[Medicine*Woman]

Originally posted by heart
MW,

This is very interesting to say the least. Do you recommend a source that I could read about this? Thank you for all the info.

heart, the first book I'd recommend is called, "Bloodline of the Holy Grail," by Laurence Gardner, Royal Genealogist. After that one, I'd recommend reading everything by Laurence Gardner. (I won't have to tell you that, you see that for yourself!). Everything Gardner writes refers directly or indirectly to MM, Jesus and the kids.

There are others:

"The Tomb of God" by ?Schellenberger? ?Richards? You can find these online, and you may be able to order a used book for cheap. This is also about France.

"Holy Blood, Holy Grail," by Baigent and Leigh?

Hey, I put a bibliography on here a while back that listed everything I had read about this theory. You might want to check my older postings.

I think you'll keep yourself occupied by reading Gardner alone. There is a great website Rennes-le-Chateau.com, that I recommend. It gives the history, the research, and the latest happenings in the area where they believe Jesus to be buried.

Good luck, enjoy the literature, and keep in touch! The amount of information on this subject is worth its own forum!

 

[heart]

Wow! Thank you for all the sources. Plenty to keep me busy. I'll definitely check into these soon. Perhaps we can discuss it after I've read up on this.

 

[P. M. Thorne]

JAMES R. asked: "WHAT CHRISTIANS"

This is what I would like to know!

Church attendance has declined in some places, true enough, but this is not necessarily indicative of Christianity as a whole . . . no more than church membership was ever.

Members listed on the books of religious organizations tells nothing except the number of people who have joined churches.

Any reasonable person would know this; therefore, how can anyone be convinced that Christianity is dying any more than believers could ever convince these same doubters that Christianity was living? You did not believe that either!

Those who have never accepted that all those with church membership were truly Christians, would necessarily be at a loss to know the true status of the health of Christianity now?

We cannot know one thing without having known the other.

PMT

 

[Nehushta]

Originally posted by Medicine*Woman
heart, the first book I'd recommend is called, "Bloodline of the Holy Grail," by Laurence Gardner, Royal Genealogist. After that one, I'd recommend reading everything by Laurence Gardner. (I won't have to tell you that, you see that for yourself!). Everything Gardner writes refers directly or indirectly to MM, Jesus and the kids.

Thank you for the information - I've added this book to my amazon wish list, along with several others that were recommended. It sounds fascinating!

 

[Medicine*Woman]

Originally posted by okinrus
I think the true reason why M*W hates Paul so much is that he instructed us to refrain from vain and foolish genealogies.
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M*W: Those "foolish" genealogies give us a more accurate picture of history than recorded history itself. Genealogies are living histories.
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And what area is this? The story turns, a skull but whose? The Catholic Church displays the blood of Jesus if you believe the Eucharist miracles.
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M*W: That depends on what you mean by "area?" Painters from all over the place depicted MM with a skull in the painting. It is believed to be the skull of JC. Since MM ended up in France, the bones of Jesus had to be in France as well. That's what the paintings depict.

Yes, I'm very aware that the RCC believes in the actual transubstantion of the bread and wine into Jesus's body and blood. I know the RCC claims this to be a "miracle." I just don't believe it anymore. This would be an example of mass psychodelusion. I call it cannibalism.