Why?

Nope, you gotta' check your state laws, fully auto weapons are legal in many places throught the United States.
Click to expand...

I seriously doubt that. Instead of me going through 50 states and attempting to discover this for myself, why don't you list a state or two where fully automatic weapons are legal? I am of the opinion that full auto weapons ban is a federal law, not a state law. That's why the ATF get's involved in these cases. If any state would allow fully-auto weapons it would be Texas. And Koresh was breaking laws by owning them.

yes he could do that but he would get shot in america
Click to expand...

Depending on the neighborhood. If he was in a bad neighborhood, then the door is most likely locked but in the average neighborhood, he would probably just get his ass kicked or verbally berated. And, I would like to add that it looked as though he was about to get his ass kicked when he did it in Canada. At the least, he was about to get berated. But, when some weirdo opens your door and your first instinct is to kick his, but then you notice that he has a camera crew behind him, you might just hesitate long enough to get that exact shot that was in the film.
 
Guns, of course we need guns how else are we going to shoot all the liberals. How often do people die around here the same as any where else just once. I want to say that those come from Heinlein but I am not sure. The principle behind gun ownership is just one more control on the government and an insurance against foreign conquest. We have not surrendered our rights to the federal government that means that they are still ours. You are allowed to carry a weapon unconcealed in Texas except in certain areas like schools and areas that primarily serve alcohol or have signs forbidding it.
 
I support the government requiring people to have a license to own weapons but I oppose the government requiring people to register their weapons. I do not want the number and type of weapons that I own to appear on any data base. I assure you that there will be no accidental shootings at my house and we have several weapons each. The reasons for pistols is for personal protection when one is not at one home there are some interesting people who live in very rough neighborhoods. I choose not to surrender territory to criminals. I am and will attempt to continue to be free to travel any where that I feel inclined to travel. I am not a Timothy McVeigh terrorist I am just extremely opinionated.
 
i loved the movie and I thought that Marilyn Manson was probably the most well-spoken intervew-es on that movie. A lot of conservatives were pissed by it; which may indicate its effectiveness. I just think as a society we need to exercise common-f'in sense. For instance; busting a gang member in highschool carrying a semi-automatic and dealing drugs is a good thing; handcuffing a five year old for playing cops&robbers in the gym is stupid. Using drug dogs to search a school for drugs, good idea in moderation; sticking your gun barrel in a teen's face and then sicking a dog on him is assinine and quite frankly going to result in landing a Darwin Award. Guns okay, Stupid people with Guns very very very bad.
 
To put it in perspective:

Germany- 381; pop 82,424,609

4.622 x 10 ^ -6

France- 255; pop 60242213

4.233 x 10 ^ -6

Canada- 165; pop 32507874

5.075 x 10 ^ -6

United Kingdom- 68; 60,270,708

1.128 x 10 ^ -6

Australia- 65; pop 19,913,144

3.264 x 10 ^ -6

Japan- 39; pop 127,333,002

0.306 x 10 ^ -6

United States- 11,127; pop 293,027,571

37.973 x 10 ^ -6

Why do you think there is such a difference in these numbers?
Click to expand...

The second ammendment? The NRA?

Or is this number just a little bit above the norm and should not be of concern?
Click to expand...

It's apparently about 10 times the others you posted. It would take a lot more analysis to know if that's concerning or not.

What make the U.S. so different in this regard?
Click to expand...

Proliferation of a gun culture?
 
I just love statistics. Here are some fun top 10 lists:
(Statistics given in deaths per million people)

How about we take a look at handgun deaths per capita?

Dominican Republic - 16.63
Colombia- 12.43
Belize - 11.25
Brazil - 9.35
Luxembourg -6.60
Estonia - 4.96
Venezuela - 4.09
United States - 3.67
Panama - 3.03
Georgia - 2.83

Or assault by a blunt object?

Lithuania - 30.61
Cayman Islands - 23.84
Estonia - 21.29
Bahamas, The - 16.80
Brazil - 11.27
Belize - 11.25
Cuba - 7.63
Colombia - 7.29
Puerto Rico - 4.63
Venezuela - 4.50

Of course if you’d like to die by getting run over, here’s where to go:

Latvia - 59.60
Lithuania - 57.61
Bahamas, The - 47.06
Puerto Rico - 41.94
Hungary - 41.11
Poland - 39.61
Slovakia - 37.20
Estonia - 29.81
Panama - 29.72
Japan - 20.83

And one of my favorites, falling down the stairs.

Lithuania - 31.45
Latvia - 18.73
Luxembourg - 17.61
Finland - 17.33
Malta - 14.98
Estonia - 13.48
Hungary - 13.23
Norway - 13.19
Germany - 11.42
Slovenia - 11.36


The one statistic I couldn’t find is how many people die of starvation due to Michael Moore stuffing his fat fucking maw every moment he’s not opening it to spew his hypocritical bullshit.

Clearly we should be discussing a ban on blunt objects in Lithuania and cars in Latvia, which cause 30.61, 59.60 deaths per million respectively, rather than the measly 3.67 deaths per million by handgun in the USA. I sure as heck don’t want to get shot but I’d rather get shot in the US than move to Finland where I am almost 5 times more likely to break my neck because I fell down the goddamn stairs.

Source: http://www.nationmaster.com/cat/mortality

~Raithere
 
The one statistic I couldn’t find is how many people die of starvation due to Michael Moore stuffing his fat fucking maw every moment he’s not opening it to spew his hypocritical bullshit.
Click to expand...
.5 in every 3.145

Statistics be damned- lies look nice in fancy tables and diagrams.
One village, half the plebs make 100 dollars. The other half makes zero.
The average income per pleb in said village would statistically be 50 dollars- which is nonsense.
 
gendanken said:
.5 in every 3.145

Statistics be damned- lies look nice in fancy tables and diagrams.
One village, half the plebs make 100 dollars. The other half makes zero.
The average income per pleb in said village would statistically be 50 dollars- which is nonsense.
Click to expand...
That's why in statistics we also have things like the median, range, and standard deviation.

I don't know why it's trendy to bash statistics lately. Statistics are a great, so long as you know what you're looking at and understand what inferences you can and can't draw based on them.
 
wesmorris said:
It's apparently about 10 times the others you posted. It would take a lot more analysis to know if that's concerning or not.
Click to expand...
I'll say it again; More is being very dishonest here by only comparing homicides committed with guns, rather than the total murder rate. There are many countries that have far higher murder rates than the U.S., even though the number of shooting deaths are lower. In Mexico, for example, they have very strict gun control law, but the murder rate is still about three times as high as the U.S. - they just use different weapons to murder each other. While it's true that the murder rate with handguns is about ten times higher in the U.S. then in those other countries, the actual murder rate is only around two or three times higher. Still high obviously, but not nearly as bad as More makes it out to be.

In fact, if you had a list of the top 20 countries by murder rate, the U.S. wouldn't even make the list.
 
Nasor said:
In fact, if you had a list of the top 20 countries by murder rate, the U.S. wouldn't even make the list.
Click to expand...
As a matter of fact, 24th:

Homicide per capita (per 1000 people):

Colombia - 0.63
South Africa - 0.51
Jamaica - 0.32
Venezuela - 0.32
Russia - 0.19
Mexico - 0.13
Lithuania - 0.10
Estonia - - 0.10
Latvia - 0.10
Belarus - 0.09
Ukraine - 0.09
Papua New Guinea - 0.08
Kyrgyzstan - 0.08
Thailand - 0.07
Moldova - 0.07
Zambia - 0.07
Seychelles - 0.07
Zimbabwe - 0.07
Costa Rica - 0.06
Poland - 0.05
Georgia - 0.04
Uruguay - 0.04
Bulgaria - 0.04
United States - 0.04

~Raithere
 
Nasor said:
Moore is being very dishonest here by only comparing homicides committed with guns, rather than the total murder rate.
Click to expand...

I think moore has little choice but to be dishonest. That was what I was attemtping to infer with "more analysis would be required". However you'll note that none of the countries from the opening post appears before the US in the list of homocides per capita.

In Mexico, for example, they have very strict gun control law, but the murder rate is still about three times as high as the U.S. - they just use different weapons to murder each other.
Click to expand...

Choice of method is a matter of style eh? It still trips me out that 1 in 40,000 in the US are gonna be murdered. This song comes to mind from Sychronicity.

Written by Sting & Andy Summers

Once that you've decided on a killing
First you make a stone of your heart
And if you find that your hands are still willing
Then you can turn a murder into art

There really isn't any need for bloodshed
You just do it with a little more finesse
If you can slip a tablet into someone's coffee
Then it avoids an awful lot of mess

It's murder by numbers, one, two, three
It's as easy to learn as your ABC
Murder by numbers, one, two, three
It's as easy to learn as your ABC

Now if you have a taste for this experience
And you're flushed with your very first success
Then you must try a twosome or a threesome
And you'll find your conscience bothers you much less

Because murder is like anything you take to
It's a habit-forming need for more and more
You can bump off every member of your family
And anybody else you find a bore

Because it's murder by numbers, one, two, three
It's as easy to learn as your ABC
Murder by numbers, one, two, three
It's as easy to learn as your ABC

Now you can join the ranks of the illustrious
In history's great dark hall of fame
All our greatest killers were industrious
At least the ones that we all know by name

But you can reach the top of your profession
If you become the leader of the land
For murder is the sport of the elected
And you don't need to lift a finger of your hand

Because it's murder by numbers, one, two, three
It's as easy to learn as your ABC
Murder by numbers, one, two, three
It's as easy to learn as your A, B, C, D, E
 
wesmorris said:
I think moore has little choice but to be dishonest. That was what I was attemtping to infer with "more analysis would be required". However you'll note that none of the countries from the opening post appears before the US in the list of homocides per capita.
Click to expand...
While he isn't actually lying, he's intentionally withholding useful information in order to trick people into believing things that they probably wouldn't believe if they had all the facts. He knows that when someone sees numbers like “68 shooting deaths in England and 11,000 in the U.S.” they'll freak out and think that the U.S. is orders of magnitude more violent than England. Actually there were over a thousand murders in England last year – they just use weapons other than guns. The U.S. murder rate is about 3.5 times that of England – obviously high, but not nearly as bad as looking at the raw number of shooting would have you believe.

I think it's incredibly ironic that More blames the media for creating a 'culture of fear' that encourages people to buy guns, but in his own documentary he fails to mention such useful facts as:

-The U.S. murder rate has been declining steadily for the past decade and is now at it's lowest rate since 1966.
-Except for murder and rape, the rate of every other type of violent crime and most non-violent crime is higher in England than in the U.S.
-Ever since the 1997 handgun ban that England enacted (which More praises in the movie) the murder rate in England has been steadily increasing and is now at a 100 year high.

Doesn't it seem like that would be relevant information in a discussion of handgun violence?
 
11,000 deaths due to gunshot wounds? Doesn't that tub of goo realize that 40 times that number of Americans die every year of complications stemming from obesity? Why doesn't he try to get cops to arrest french fries the way he tried to get them to arrest the smog in LA?
 
Actually, there were only about 9,600 murders with guns last year. To get his 11,000 number Moore had to add in all the gun suicides, accidents, and self-defense shootings.
 
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top