Why wont you show yourself God?

[looking_forward]

I remember wondering this when I was a child still trying to overcome my indoctrination into Christainity. Around the time I started to question my faith, I really searched hard to find a reason to believe. I had been to sunday school and church and tried to accept everything with an open mind until I was about 16 and I started to question my religion. I really wanted to believe in God; I wanted to fit in with everyone else. I felt guilty when I expressed doubt, and I was reprimanded for wanting proof of God's existence. I remember begging God to please show himself to me so that I could follow him with a full heart and believe rather than just follow based on waht others tell me. I would pray and say "God, please make your presence undeniably known to me like you did to your apostles and other followers. If I do not get a sign from you soon, I will forsake you." I would wait a couple days, tehn give God a second chance. I started to realize how stupid this was after the 5th time or so and I finally concluded with great conviction that God does not exist. After researching the topic more via this site, scientific research, and claims made by both atheists and theists, I have further consolifdated my belief that God is imaginary and that I wasted much of my life looking for him.
Why would God (if he existed) have let me abandon him, a person who truly and earnestly wanted to find him? Does he not love me and want me to see his truth and light? Why did he not give me some evidence? He must have known that the validity of the Bible is questionable at best and that some people will be skeptical, would he not give these peopel extra attention?
Why won't God reveal himself to anyone? Why did he only reveal himself to people 2000 years ago and then take a break, thus creating much doubt concerning the validity of these accounts.
I can only conclude that God does not exist. Does anyone have another idea??

 

[looking_forward]

well, there have been 9 views yet no replies. Cant think of an answer/excuse? Did I stump you theists?

 

[kazakhan]

Does anyone have another idea??

Maybe god doesn't like you

 

[Adstar]

I remember wondering this when I was a child still trying to overcome my indoctrination into Christainity. Around the time I started to question my faith, I really searched hard to find a reason to believe. I had been to sunday school and church and tried to accept everything with an open mind until I was about 16 and I started to question my religion. I really wanted to believe in God; I wanted to fit in with everyone else. I felt guilty when I expressed doubt, and I was reprimanded for wanting proof of God's existence. I remember begging God to please show himself to me so that I could follow him with a full heart and believe rather than just follow based on waht others tell me. I would pray and say "God, please make your presence undeniably known to me like you did to your apostles and other followers. If I do not get a sign from you soon, I will forsake you."

So you decided to put God to the test. "God jump through my hoop like a good dog and if you don't do it is will kick you out" What did you think God would conform to your threat?

Matthew 12
39 But He answered and said to them, “An evil and adulterous generation seeks after a sign, and no sign will be given to it except the sign of the prophet Jonah.

You fell down big time when you demanded a sign. The Sign given was the sign of Jonah, for as Jonah spend 3 days in the whale so did Jesus spend 3 days in the earth and was reasurected. You don't believe this loving sign but seek another sign? Then you do not seek Love but seek a magician.

I would wait a couple days, tehn give God a second chance.

Give God a second chance?? How arrogant of the created to think in such a way toward the Creator. Who are you to speak in such a way.

I started to realize how stupid this was after the 5th time or so and I finally concluded with great conviction that God does not exist.

Yes your method was wrong and your conclusion was likewise wrong.

After researching the topic more via this site, scientific research, and claims made by both atheists and theists, I have further consolifdated my belief that God is imaginary and that I wasted much of my life looking for him.

Those who hate the truth are wasting their time seeking it. The truth is in their face but they hate the truth and therefore see lies as truth.

Why would God (if he existed) have let me abandon him, a person who truly and earnestly wanted to find him?

You didn't want to find Him you wanted to find a "god", one of your own liking. God allows mankind to abandon Him every day. That’s free will in action.

Does he not love me and want me to see his truth and light?

Its not the case of His lack of love for you its the case of your lack of love for Him. Remember He did not abandon you. You abandoned Him.

Why did he not give me some evidence?

You mean "Why did He not give me the kind of evidence i demanded from Him?" Why because the kind of evidence you demanded from Him is not the kind of evidence He uses to attract people who embrace love.

He must have known that the validity of the Bible is questionable at best and that some people will be skeptical, would he not give these peopel extra attention?

The Love of the truth is in the Bible and all who Love it see it and embrace it. Those who call the bible invalid are only seeking to justify their rejection of the truth because they prefer evil and want to be justified in their evil.

Why won't God reveal himself to anyone?

He has revealed himself to me, and many others.

Why did he only reveal himself to people 2000 years ago and then take a break, thus creating much doubt concerning the validity of these accounts.
I can only conclude that God does not exist.

Yes and the majority in those times rejected His revelation also and killed Him. So they’re where many people who where like minded to you in those times. So the point is not about revelation, it never has been. It is about people decision to either embrace that revelation or hate that revelation. It’s all about people’s desires and how they align themselves with the desire Of God.

Does anyone have another idea??

Yes many do and we shall have eternity with the One you have rejected.

John 20
29 Jesus said to him, “Thomas, because you have seen Me, you have believed. Blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.”


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

 

[Adstar]

well, there have been 9 views yet no replies. Cant think of an answer/excuse? Did I stump you theists?

Ha Ha Ha. What a smug self centred pig you are, Who would want to spend eternity with you?


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

 

[original]

I would say that the worst part about religion is the people who are filled with conviction and refute reason for their own beliefs. Take, for example, the people at the Westboro Baptist Church in Topeka, Kansas (USA). They mock the parents of dead soldiers and celebrate diseases like AIDS. If you want to see what they have done, their website is: www.thesignsofthetimes.net - just a warning... you might get upset.

Anyway, I personally think all organized religions that claim to be prophetic are false. While the universe is incredibly intricate in design, if God exists, it is not accurately described in any book we have.

 

[lightgigantic]

I would pray and say "God, please make your presence undeniably known to me like you did to your apostles and other followers. If I do not get a sign from you soon, I will forsake you."

Would the apostles pray like this do you think?
In other words god is not a cheap thing

I would wait a couple days, tehn give God a second chance. I started to realize how stupid this was after the 5th time or so and I finally concluded with great conviction that God does not exist.

If the process is wrong (God show me like you did the apostles) then obviously the result willnot be attained - just like if I have the idea to paint in water colours on ice cubes i will be frustrated

Why would God (if he existed) have let me abandon him, a person who truly and earnestly wanted to find him?

Because your process of approaching him was neither true (it was not advocated by the apostles) nor earnest (is god your personal genie?)

Does he not love me and want me to see his truth and light? Why did he not give me some evidence?

Simple-you took the wrong process -"God come to be in 2 weeks or forget it"

He must have known that the validity of the Bible is questionable at best and that some people will be skeptical, would he not give these peopel extra attention?

Therefore there are range of spiritual practices to suit one's conditioned nature

Why won't God reveal himself to anyone?

Our misfortune is only this - we have no sincere attraction to god

Why did he only reveal himself to people 2000 years ago and then take a break, thus creating much doubt concerning the validity of these accounts.

Maybe there were insincere practioners -just like you trying to get heavy with god "hey you did it for the apostles do it for me too" - there is the question of qalification - Do youthink you are as qualified as the apostles? If not why do you expect god to interact with you on the same level (and to set the record straight where isthere evidence thatthe apostles had god on beck and call for whenever they felt a bit doubtful?)

I can only conclude that God does not exist. Does anyone have another idea??

You were looking in the wrong places

 

[Plunkies]

I love these two religious fools instantly making EXCUSES for an OMNIPOTENT being who supposedly WANTS YOU TO BELIEVE IN HIM.

Matthew 7:7 Jesus lies.....

"Ask, and it will be given you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you. For every one who asks receives, and he who seeks finds, and to him who knocks it will be opened. Or what man of you, if his son asks him for bread, will give him a stone? Or if he asks for a fish, will give him a serpent? If you then, who are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father who is in heaven give good things to those who ask him!"

Who are you to judge this guy for being reasonable and intelligent growing up? He wanted to believe in god but had no reason to. He asked god for bread and was repeatedly given a stone. You say he was arrogant or using god as a genie but Jesus says ANYONE WHO ASKS RECIEVES. He wasn't asking for a billion dollars and all his enemies to die of AIDS, he just wanted a sign.

You have to make excuse after excuse for god's actions when his actions can readily be explained through a simple 3 word statement, God is imaginary. Think of any question you have about religion and that answer will make the peg instantly fall into place. Meanwhile you try to smash the square peg into the round hole by saying God doesn't do this or that, for this reason or that reason, or because you didn't believe enough, or because you're a jerk, or because you were molested as a child etc etc.


Here try this....Go sit down at a table with a pencil, put the pencil infront of you and leave it there, then pray...

"Oh Christ, I am lost. You say in Matthew 17:20 "For truly, I say to you, if you have faith as a grain of mustard seed, you will say to this mountain, 'Move from here to there,' and it will move; and nothing will be impossible to you.". Jesus I ask for no mountain to be moved, simply a pencil. My belief is not as strong as it should be and I ask you for help, just float this pencil one foot above the table and I will certainly never doubt again. I will dedicate myself to the work of the lord, just please give me a sign. Amen."

Guess what will happen to your pencil every single time? Yup, that's right, it will sit there. Now you can go on and rationalize and make excuses for how you prayed wrong or how god doesn't grant wishes despite what he said in the bible, but you're just being intellectually dishonest. The reason the pencil doesn't move is answered very simply, God is imaginary.

 

[swivel]

Plunkies, brilliant post. Loved the passage quoted, and the pencil experiment.

The funny thing about quoting a passage that refutes what a theist says... they just ignore it. The Bible is always perfectly correct when they quote anything, but if you quote the opposite (which is easy to do in a work of so many authors) you will either be told that:

1. You are not reading it correctly.
2. That part of the Bible no longer applies.

How can you reason with people when they have these magical rules? It is like playing "Bang-Bang I Shot You" as a kid. You just keep making up more advanced armor and ammo. But these are adults doing the same thing.


looking_forward, I feel your anguish. I went through the exact same process about 18 years ago. You will eventually get over the feeling of being duped. You will also most likely come to a very healthy place where you forgive the ignorance of the superstitious, and understand that it is human nature and serves (or served) a purpose.

 

[lightgigantic]

Plunkies

Who are you to judge this guy for being reasonable and intelligent growing up?

Is it reasonable to apply a process that isn't advocated by persons who establish the process (ie the apostles etc)

He wanted to believe in god but had no reason to

he wanted to believe in god by making god subservient to him

. He asked god for bread and was repeatedly given a stone. You say he was arrogant or using god as a genie but Jesus says ANYONE WHO ASKS RECIEVES.

Does that mean he is a vending machine?

He wasn't asking for a billion dollars and all his enemies to die of AIDS, he just wanted a sign.

On the contrary god is more likely to offer a billion dollars, since even atheists get rich - in other words personal interaction with the potency of god is the highest stage of spiritual perfection and not something generally exhibited for one looking for party tricks

Here try this....Go sit down at a table with a pencil, put the pencil infront of you and leave it there, then pray...

"Oh Christ, I am lost. You say in Matthew 17:20 "For truly, I say to you, if you have faith as a grain of mustard seed, you will say to this mountain, 'Move from here to there,' and it will move; and nothing will be impossible to you.". Jesus I ask for no mountain to be moved, simply a pencil. My belief is not as strong as it should be and I ask you for help, just float this pencil one foot above the table and I will certainly never doubt again. I will dedicate myself to the work of the lord, just please give me a sign. Amen."

actually there are persons who develop such tricks to fool people they are connected to god - in other words the pencil moving, even if it moved, wouldn't exhibit anything since one would still be in complete ignorance of one's relationship with god, one's relationship with the material world etc etc and a billion other existential questions

Guess what will happen to your pencil every single time? Yup, that's right, it will sit there. Now you can go on and rationalize and make excuses for how you prayed wrong or how god doesn't grant wishes despite what he said in the bible, but you're just being intellectually dishonest. The reason the pencil doesn't move is answered very simply, God is imaginary.

I guess it proves that god exhibits great wisdom who he reveals himself to - I mean just imagine how cheap it would be (and most xtians take god pretty cheaply to begin with saying its okay to keep on sinning because jesus paid the price etcetc ... but anyway) -Oh hi george what did god do for you last night - Well I said to him to give me the sign that he exists by keeping my beer cold when I was driving back from the supermarket, how about you - Oh I got him to prove himself by making my wife come to bed with no under wear, heh heh - God be praised hallejullah.

 

[battig1370]

Why won't You show yourself God?


Near the end of February of 1983 some thing very strange happened to me, I was in a state of helplessness, my cup was empty and I felt alone. With extreme anger I cried out, "OH GOD, WHERE ARE YOU!? COME DOWN AND LET WORLD KNOW THAT YOU CARE! WHERE IS YOUR LOVE!? Can you see and hear of all the things that have happened and are happening!?" Those that have a mind to process what they see and hear would think that YOU are sleeping, or do not even exist, or are on vacation, or just don't care, by letting all the suffering and destruction happen on this earth. Why all the abominations that have happened in Jesus' name that are to bloody and wicked to mention? OH GOD, why all the conflicts and division within Christianity? Countless numbers of Christian churches with their various false religious doctrines and false religious preaching using the name of Jesus as its foundation, and at the same time seeing and hearing of ALL the suffering, and also seeing the destruction of the environment from all kinds of pollutants which causes suffering to ALL livings things. And also, the weapons of mass destruction that mankind have used and will use against each other again to the point of ANNIHILATION, which is M.A.D. IF THEY ARE NOT STOPPED, HUMANITY IS FINISHED, OH GOD! LISTEN TO THE CHILDREN CRY!, OH GOD! WHY DON'T YOU DO SOMETHING?!"


In March of 1984, a great sound, like that of trumpets came to me and then a cloud with an open door was set in front of me, and from in that open door, A Voice spoke to me saying, "You are My Son, as I was the Son of My Father, and I will be with you and I come quickly" Then this cloud with the open door went away.


"I say to you, you shall not see Me until the time comes when you say, Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord." > Luke 13:35 + Matt 23:39

 

[redarmy11]

Near the end of February of 1983... I cried out, "OH GOD, WAR FAMINE, DEATH, ETC. AND I'M ALL OUT OF MILK."

In March of 1984, a great sound, trumpets, cloud with a door in it, and what-have-you.

Wow. Mad as cheese.

What took him 13 months to reply?

my cup was empty

I would've just boiled a kettle. Unless I'd run out of milk as well.

 

[Plunkies]

Is it reasonable to apply a process that isn't advocated by persons who establish the process (ie the apostles etc)

Yes. It is reasonable. I can't just make crap up and then say you can't test it this way or that way because I don't approve of it.

he wanted to believe in god by making god subservient to him

How? By asking God for something? Was Jesus lying when he said he would do anything for you? That if you asked him for anything he would go to his Father and it would be done. He's not telling God to bow down to him, he just wants more of a favor, a very easy favor from a loving, all powerful being.

Does that mean he is a vending machine?

Again you make excuses and rationalize for God himself. He wasn't asking for a ton of stuff, just ONE sign of God's existence. Jesus didn't stipulate what you can ask for, how you can pray, etc. You ask, you recieve. These are his words. If you need a fish, he gives you a fish. If you're starving Jesus doesn't say "Oh no, God gave you a fish LAST week, you're totally screwed dude".

On the contrary god is more likely to offer a billion dollars, since even atheists get rich - in other words personal interaction with the potency of god is the highest stage of spiritual perfection and not something generally exhibited for one looking for party tricks

Translation : God can only do things that don't require a God to do them.

Heh, I like how the atheists only get rich because of God. Sucks for the poor Christians doesn't it?

actually there are persons who develop such tricks to fool people they are connected to god - in other words the pencil moving, even if it moved, wouldn't exhibit anything since one would still be in complete ignorance of one's relationship with god, one's relationship with the material world etc etc and a billion other existential questions

I didn't say the pencil would answer every single question. Nor did I say that someone else should say the prayer. You're doing the prayer ALONE for YOURSELF. I assume you wouldn't trick yourself would you? And how is your relationship with God even relevant if you don't know he exists? One step at a time buddy.

I guess it proves that god exhibits great wisdom who he reveals himself to - I mean just imagine how cheap it would be (and most xtians take god pretty cheaply to begin with saying its okay to keep on sinning because jesus paid the price etcetc ... but anyway) -Oh hi george what did god do for you last night - Well I said to him to give me the sign that he exists by keeping my beer cold when I was driving back from the supermarket, how about you - Oh I got him to prove himself by making my wife come to bed with no under wear, heh heh - God be praised hallejullah.

You're arguing against the Bible at this point. So you're saying Jesus was lying? If you make an excuse for this the only other option is Jesus was a lier. Again, he didn't ask for much. Again, my prayer asks for nothing but the knowledge of God's existance. But even if I did ask for a harem of 200 women and a mansion, that wouldn't be granted by God either even though the bible says it would be. Go pray that a mountain be cast aside and that mountain won't budge. The bible says "nothing will be impossible to you" and yet impossible stuff seems awfully impossible even through the power of prayer.

And why shouldn't God reveal himself to everyone? Then we'd all be on the same page. Religious wars would stop. Morality would all be on the same level. God could intervene when someone did something bad. We could all work to making the world a good place. Instead God just seems to hide and let us all kill each other. Why does he hide? The answer is obvious....

 

[nova900]

You have the right to find your own spiritual path, or none at all. There are other faiths other than christianity.( Although many christians will say no..don't believe it). I know where you are coming from. I too left behind the nonsense of some religions that portray these ridiculous personifications of God created by either ignorant or unscrupulous people in an attempt to keep people straying from their narrow vision of God and for control of the masses purposes and although I still believe in God it's now without all the b/s and ignorance that was created by man.

God is found on an intuitional level, not books or television programs or people who copy scriptural text and preach.

 

[perplexity]

And why shouldn't God reveal himself to everyone?

You want to see God's bollocks?

If God posted here, if you saw the true opinion of God, James R would ban him, or her, as the case may be.

--- Ron.

 

[battig1370]

Ron, You are probably correct. > "If God posted here ---"

Who would even want to care for their neighbor as they care for themselves.


redarmy11, > "What took him 13 months to reply?"

Are you serious in asking this question? If you are, I will let you know.

A paranormal event is easy to ridicule for those who have no interest to understand.


May God's love abide in you, Paul

 

[KennyJC]

Why wont you show yourself God?

This is an irrelevant question for both atheists and theists.

To the atheist, why does it matter? To the theist, they can simply point out that you 'aren't looking in the right places', or that you 'can't put God to the test'.

 

[spidergoat]

I think to an atheist, it's the crux of the biscuit. If God is so omnipotent, you would think he would show himself from time to time.

 

[Theoryofrelativity]

Guess what will happen to your pencil every single time? Yup, that's right, it will sit there. Now you can go on and rationalize and make excuses for how you prayed wrong or how god doesn't grant wishes despite what he said in the bible, but you're just being intellectually dishonest. The reason the pencil doesn't move is answered very simply, God is imaginary.

Time perception for you and for God are likely to differ

thus what seems like a long time to you (eternity in fact) is just a blink in Gods eye, thus given the irrelevance of the request, and thus low on the agenda, you would have to observe the pencil for several hundred (possibly longer) yrs before it moves. Have you the time to spare?

 

[Theoryofrelativity]

I think to an atheist, it's the crux of the biscuit. If God is so omnipotent, you would think he would show himself from time to time.

did you miss it? You must've been on the loo! Imagine that!