why so much respect fr bible?

Paul's easy way to Salvation"!? Salvation had never been an issue.

Before Paul nobody had ever considered it a very Great Religious Priority to find a way for people to sin all they liked.

Remember that Paul's Religious Doctrine DESTROYED a Civilization. You cannot tell people that they can sin all they like without expecting adverse consequences.

Catholic Civilization succeeded largely because EVERYBODY was illiterate and the letters of Paul could simply be left undiscussed.

Look at the Moral Imperitives of all of the Major Religious Orders that BUILT Christian Civilization out of the chaos of the Dark Ages. They were not Paulists. They asserted RIGHTEOUSNESS.

The Catholics Today are not the same Catholics that gave us the "Thousand Year Reign of Christ on Earth". You see, after the Protestants had won their battle, after thirty years of rape and unlimitied pillage and murder, the Catholic Bishops gave in. They held the Council of Trent and adopted Protestant Theology.

But while the Catholic Bishops, those child molesters, are effective Protestants, thos Catholics of the Marian Religious Orders are not. Well... to be intellectually honest, one of the accords of the Council of Trent was that EVERY ordained Priest would have to go through 7 years of Paulist Protestant Indoctrination. So it is that most candidates to the Priesthood, no matter how pure when they start out, can't stand up to the Antichristical indoctrination and come back spouting how Saved Christians can sin all they want as long as they have Faith... just like Protestants, but unlike any Priest who had served during the 1000 Year Reign of Catholic Civilization.

Its heartbreaking to see a Franciscan Friar telling a room full of Catholic Bible Studiers that they can sin all they want. One can ask that Ordained Idiot to point out any instance where Francis, his Patron Saint, had ever told anybody they could drink, gamble and copulate (exploit the poor and murder their competition) as much as they liked, and he would look in amazement and wouldn't understand the point at all. He forgets that the Original Franciscans were not required to undergo the same indoctrination as himself.

Look at the Catholic Religious Orders and examine their specific beliefs. How very few of them are Paulists.

Remember that Martin Luther's Battle Cry during the bloody Protestant Rebellion, where it was urged that Priests and monk be killed and nuns be raped, was that the Catholic Establishment had ELIMINATED PAULIST DOCTRINE from any studied curriculum. So we KNOW that Catholics BEFORE the Reformation WERE NOT PAULISTS. Now, at least the Child Molesting Bishops ARE Paulists. The Seminaries TEACH Paulism.

But that is NOT Catholicism. That is Catholicism under duress. Those Fat Cat Bishops were threatened with revocation of their Country Club Memberships and so they decided that God WANTS PEOPLE TO SIN.

yeah, right.

Although I am a fine Catholic, I can certainly assert with the utmost confidenct that there is perhaps no lower moral being in earth or in hell than a Catholic Bishop, or a priest who has accepted a degree in the teaching of Free Sin.


Paul provided the easy way to salvation.Expecting Jesus to bear our sins and do the dirty work for us. I also do not believe that was the original intent of Christs' message. I cannot find any logic at all in believing God would incarnate he/she self into human form to act as a sacrifice back to himself so that he/she can tolerate our non perfect selves in the afterlife..wtf??:confused:
 
Leo Volont said the following:

Leo Volont said:
Indeed, Paul went so far as to preach that those who strove for Righteousness were REJECTING FAITH and trying to earn their way into Heaven, thus deserving Hell.


Here's what Paul himself says in 2 Timothy 2:22:

"Flee also youthful lusts; but pursue righteousness, faith, love, peace with those who call on the Lord out of a pure heart."

Need anything else be said about Leo's thoughts on Paul?

As someone once said: "Read Up or Shut Up"
 
That is a complicated question.

You see, paradoxically enough, Paulists have coopted to themselves the Title of "Christian".

"Christian" has come to mean a set of beliefs that the Mission of Mesianic Glory can be sacrificed, by killing the Messiah, so that everybody can sin as much as they like. "Christians" believe that it is a good thing that the Messiah was killed so that every crime and perversion could flourish.

But the Messiah himself would never subscribe to such a thing.

We need to wonder whether the Appelation "Christian" has not been coopted by the Forces of the Anti-christ.

If the appelation "Christian" had been coopted by the Antichrist, then any TRUE follower of Christ would certainly be appalled at being called a "Christian".

Perhaps any TRUE follower of Christ would rather be called.... hmmmm... I never though of it before.... but the word would be "Messianic". One who believes in a Religious, Social and Political Order that are built upon the supporting pillar of Righteousness.

Intresting...
Certainly superfluous, analytical, perspicacious but perhaps missing the obvious.


I don't know how you define yourself. Do tell !

Of course you don't know. What have you discerned from experience?
 
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The only thing I have discerned is that you refuse to declare yourself time and again and that when asked for evidence to support a claim you never provide any. Based on your performance to date I would say you are a sophist or a casuist. You might want to tell me I'm wrong by answering a straight question with a straight answer.
 
If it is not important then why do you ask?
[Note: Miles has deleted his response. He states this information is not important to him. Yet he continues pursuit. There would seem to be some sort of internal contradiction.]
 
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If it is not important then why do you ask?

You are playing your usual games again. I was polite enough to respond to your request to tell you what I had discerned about you. You set that hare running. As usual you are avoiding the isue because you do not want to answer but, at the same time give the impression that you are indulging in discourse. If that's the mentality you brought to your study of the bible, it explains everything. We can look forward to the Gospel according to Saquist, which will make all others redundant. Just get out there and tell all those millions of Chritians they are wrong but you have the truth.

Is it possible that you are the second coming and we are failing to recognize you ? Arcadians, 2.11 and Eugenics 1.23.

Show us a sign and we shall believe !
 
Why is there so much respect for the bible? it is another book and yet i have been in so many religous arguements where the other person thinks "the bible say's so" is an actual reson. it pisses me off!:mad:

i believe as all believers that the bible is a divine book revealed to jesus

is He Who sent down to thee (step by step), in truth, the Book, confirming what went before it; and He sent down the Law (of Moses) and the Gospel (of Jesus) before this, as a guide to mankind, and He sent down the criterion (of judgment be tween right and wrong). (The Noble Quran, 3:3)"

"To thee We sent the Scripture in truth, confirming the scripture that came before it, and guarding it in safety: so judge between them by what God hath revealed, and follow not their vain desires, diverging from the Truth that hath come to thee. To each among you have we prescribed a law and an open way. If God had so willed, He would have made you a single people, but (His plan is) to test you in what He hath given you: so strive as in a race in all virtues. The goal of you all is to God; it is He that will show you the truth of the matters in which ye dispute; (The Noble Quran, 5:48)"

"That which We have revealed to thee of the Book is the Truth,- confirming what was (revealed) before it: for God is assuredly- with respect to His Servants - well acquainted and Fully Observant. (The Noble Quran, 35:31)"
 
There is more truth in the books of Darwin than in any bible or koran.

If you are in need of a good laugh , may I suggest you read a transcript of the debate between Huxley and Bishop Wilberforce, aka Slippery Sam.

Then consider how many people today are still using the worn out arguments used by Sam.
They pop up with each generation. So much for progress.
 
we're saying 'the' bible, but how substantial is the difference between editions? i thought different churches had different numbers of verses in their bibles?
 
The Bible should be respected: it's an important historical account of the creation of a religion, and somewhat of the Hebrews history and customs. Although it got a bit shredded in the Middle Ages, it isn't exactly meaningless.
 
Why is there so much respect for the bible? it is another book and yet i have been in so many religous arguements where the other person thinks "the bible say's so" is an actual reson. it pisses me off!:mad:

It's because people bind it's content to their identities and disrespecting the bible is equivalent to attacking their identities... which is often interpreted as attempted murder by the individual feeling attacked.
 
The Bible should be respected: it's an important historical account of the creation of a religion, and somewhat of the Hebrews history and customs. Although it got a bit shredded in the Middle Ages, it isn't exactly meaningless.

It actually isn't an account of the creation of a religion. It is an account of the creation of the world in the religion's mythology. It's a work of fiction.

I think the only respect it deserves is as literature. If you read the King James version, you're actually reading fine literature, worthy of praise, even, for its style and beauty. But the beliefs within it do not require any respect.
 
Isn't "literature" another word for "historical account"..?
It's just I thought it was.

Would the Essene Gospel, or the Dead Sea scrolls be literature, or a historical account?
 
Isn't "literature" another word for "historical account"..?

Not at all.

Would the Essene Gospel, or the Dead Sea scrolls be literature, or a historical account?

The King James version of the Bible is beautifully written, which I don't know if is a result of a very lenient translation, or what, so I can't say that the Dead Sea Scrolls or Essene Gospel are of the same quality. But there is no reason to believe they are historical accounts.
 
JD said:
But there is no reason to believe they are historical accounts.
So, it goes in the SF & Fantasy section?

I would say there might be one or two, um, historians, anthropologists, linguists, archeaologists, etc, who would be a little upset with the classification, but, what the hey?
 
So, it goes in the SF & Fantasy section?

Yeah, pretty much.

I would say there might be one or two, um, historians, anthropologists, linguists, archeaologists, etc, who would be a little upset with the classification, but, what the hey?

Well, I'd like to meet those one or two, um, historians, anthropologists, linguists, archaeologists, etc., and ask them just what the hell proof is there that the accounts in the bible are accurate.
 
JDawg said:
there is no reason to believe they are historical accounts.
And the Dead Sea scrolls have nothing whatsoever to say about how the people who wrote them lived, or what their customs, languages and beliefs were?
No historian or anthropologist would consider consulting them, or any part of the Bible, because everyone knows that they're total fantasy?

Thanks for sorting that one.
I 'spose it's a good thing I'm into SF then?
 
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