Who was Jesus talking to when he said...

M*W: After having studied both sides of christianity for some 35+ years as well as the heart of it, the final conclusion I have come to is that it was all based on ancient astrology.

I would say It is based on the words of the bible which were written for people to know of the past, most major events in our world are related to astrology it seemes. Christianity is based on people.
 
The Devil Inside said:
how not? leaps of faith as to linguistic interpretations of names, from hebrew, to aramaic, to english... how is it more plausible than some guy that was executed wondering about his plight?
Click to expand...

*************
M*W: It is more plausible, because that guy who was executed only lived in the words of the gospel writers and not in reality.

The theory of Occam's razor can only be applied against the existence of god in that a god is an unnecessary figurehead.

The truth of astrotheology as the progenitor of all man-made religions does not require any human beings to exist. The ancients saw the stars, planets and constellations as familiar gods they created stories about. Those stories turned into myths that turned into other myths and even ancient sciences.

There is/was and never will be a true god other than what the ancients saw as the sun. There is/was and never will be any son of a god except for what the ancients saw as the sun/god and son-of-god.

It is more plausible to believe in the ancient science of astrology-turned-theology than it is to believe in the personification and anthropomorphism of stellar gods and angels that are merely nothing more than extra-terrestrial rocks that reflect the light of the sun and moon.
 
Kendall said:
I would say It is based on the words of the bible which were written for people to know of the past, most major events in our world are related to astrology it seemes. Christianity is based on people.
Click to expand...

*************
M*W: Christianity was based quite predominantly on sun worship and the study of the zodiac. The NT was originally written as an astrological book, with Jesus playing the role of the sun.
 
Medicine*Woman said:
*************
The theory of Occam's razor can only be applied against the existence of god in that a god is an unnecessary figurehead.
Click to expand...

The OC was not a theory but a suggestion about procedure. At no point was he trying to say that simpler theories are more likely to be correct or that it is best to assume certain things don't exist unless proven otherwise. The OR was a suggestion about what theories to attack first, but is used, all the time, as justification, even, oddly, as proof (via authority) that God or ghosts or Jeus or whatever probably does not exist.

The truth of astrotheology as the progenitor of all man-made religions does not require any human beings to exist. The ancients saw the stars, planets and constellations as familiar gods they created stories about. Those stories turned into myths that turned into other myths and even ancient sciences.
Click to expand...

You are making a claim that religions are based on interpretations of myths based on interpretations of star patterns, while we know that certain religions built up around living humans, say Islam, and this makes it seem at least possible that other religions have their roots in living people (or demigods).

It is more plausible to believe in the ancient science of astrology-turned-theology than it is to believe in the personification and anthropomorphism of stellar gods and angels that are merely nothing more than extra-terrestrial rocks that reflect the light of the sun and moon.
Click to expand...

Science begins with deadness and assumes deadness unless it is proven otherwise. The assumption that this is the way one should begin - with the assumption of deadness is simply that an unproven axiom. We've gotten so used to it (read: have been brainwashed) we don't notice this is an assumption.

Until as recently as 30 years ago if you talked about animals having feelings it could jeopardize your career in the biological sciences. And even now the Descartian errors and counterintuitive BS that assumes a lack of life and sentience goes unchecked. A brief browse through the current neurosciences will show that we humans are barely considered alive or sentient by many scientists.

Assumptions.
Make the assumptions long enough.
Then tell 'believers' that the onus is on them.

Why the name medicine woman, by the way? It seems an odd name to take on given its general usage and your unbeliefs.
 
Medicine*Woman said:
*************
M*W: Christianity was based quite predominantly on sun worship and the study of the zodiac. The NT was originally written as an astrological book, with Jesus playing the role of the sun.
Click to expand...

this is an opinion, and not a very well founded one, having read 2 of the books recommended by you.
 
Medicine*Woman said:
*************
M*W: That may be so, but whatever the origin of the words "eli, eli, lama, sabachtheni," it is referring to speaking to the god in the heavens, or the sun. In fact, "eli" does not mean "my father," it means the "sun" who was called "god." In other words, Jesus could have easily said in English, "My SUN, why are you setting now?
Click to expand...

Everything was\is created, "my SUN"...yes that could have been spontaneous utterance. Two steps forward...
 
Medicine*Woman said:
*************
M*W: After having studied both sides of christianity for some 35+ years as well as the heart of it, the final conclusion I have come to is that it was all based on ancient astrology. When I endeavor to search in another direction from this point, I reach a dead-end that continues to confirm that ancient astrology leads to the basis of all theology. Now that I've come to this point in my research, I am confident I can never go in another direction and be right about it. I don't think Occam's Razor has anything to do with it.
Click to expand...

The New Testament was changed in a way to accomodate all the pagan beliefs and Mythraism into 1 and only Religion.

Ever since the beginning of time, astrology have come hand by hand with religion. Like the 12 tribes of Israel as a reference to the 12 Zodiac signs, just meaning Jesus was from the tribe of Levi, he was a Piscis.

This doesnt change the fact that Jesus was an enlightened being, put here in Earth to help mankind with a message of love and wisdom.

If you dont believe he existed, you cannot deny the existence of ALL Truth Teachers like Jesus:

- Apollonius of Tyana (he was killed too)
- Paracelsus (Philippus Theophrastus Aureolus Bombastus von Hohenheim)
- Enoc (Bible)
- Melquisedec (Bible)
- Gautama Buddha
- Lord Krishna
- Other 28 Buddhas: "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_the_28_Buddhas"
- The Dalai Lamas
- Jesus
- Thot (Egyptian)
- Hermes Trismegistus (Greek)
- Lao Tze (Asian)
- (St.) Thomas Becket
- Jalaluddin Muhammad Akbar
- Count of St. Germain
- Djwhal Khul
- Kwan Yin
- Sri Ramakrishna
- Lahiri Mahasaya
- Meher Baba
- Hazrat Babajan
- Sai Baba of Shirdi
- Upasni Maharaj
- Ramana Maharshi
- Paramahansa Yogananda
- Sri Yukteswar
- Lord Metatron
- Confucius
- Ganesha Chaturthi
- Padre Pio
- Prophet Elijah
- Zarathrustra

By denying Jesus, you are doing nothing.
 
Muslims say that was not Jesus on the cross. So, that was not Jesus talking to God. Muslim say that the prayers of Jesus were always answered, and this one was answered too: Matthew 26:39: “He went a little farther and fell on His face, and prayed, saying, "O My Father, if it is possible, let this cup pass from Me; nevertheless, not as I will, but as You will.'' Since Jesus, and God are always in agreement, John 10:30 "I and My Father are one'' then what Jesus wills, so does God will too. Esoteric Christians say that Jesus is an allegory for the sun, where the sun passes over the vernal equinox around Easter time, when the warmth of the sun destroys the death of winter, and brings a season of growth so that all of life may continue. Therefore Jesus had to likewise pass over the cross, and another, a look alike was crucified, for otherwise if the real Christ died we would be held in the grip of winter. The solar myth stories therefore align with an un crucified Christ.

If any one thinks Jesus came back to life three days later, think on this. IF the sun went out, no heat, for three days, then when the sun finally reappeared the entire earth would be at around 120 degrees F. below zero. Life on our planet, as we know it, would be dead. It would likely take billions of years of evolution before the planet once again had humans walking on it.
 
danross said:
Muslims say that was not Jesus on the cross. So, that was not Jesus talking to God.
Click to expand...
I would make a slight correction, Muslims say Jesus did not die on the cross. I think the Koran passage that you are referring to is;

The Women [4.157]

“And their saying: Surely we have killed the Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, the apostle of Allah; and they did not kill him nor did they crucify him, but it appeared to them so, and most surely those who differ therein are only in a doubt about it; they have no knowledge respecting it, but only follow a conjecture, and they killed him not for sure”

I think this passage can be interpreted in one of two ways;

1. That Jesus simply did not die on the cross, he survived was healed and there was therefore no resurrection. I think it is still valid that he was put on a cross because of the phrase “it appeared to them so”.

2. Is that all that was crucified and killed was a body; whereas the real Messaih / Christ – the real part of Jesus, could not be killed. The real part being the spiritual part - the soul if you like, being eternal.
 
Why do people try to make something out of nothing? "Why is jesus yelling "My God My God, Why have you forsaken me?".

Do scientists have any common sense?

If you step on a nail, what happens? You say "Oh shit that hurts!"

If you had a nail in each hand, a nail in each foot, and thorns sticking in your head, I am guessing it would hurt so bad that you would want to say something.

Since Jesus cannot say "GOD DAMN THAT HURTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!'".

So instead he says "My God(Ouch) My God(Ouch) Why have you(ouch)forsaken me?(Owwwwwww it hurts!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)

Jesus was exclaiming in pain. He was not saying any message. Duh.
 
denis said:
Why do people try to make something out of nothing? "Why is jesus yelling "My God My God, Why have you forsaken me?".

Do scientists have any common sense?

If you step on a nail, what happens? You say "Oh shit that hurts!"

If you had a nail in each hand, a nail in each foot, and thorns sticking in your head, I am guessing it would hurt so bad that you would want to say something.

Since Jesus cannot say "GOD DAMN THAT HURTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!'".

So instead he says "My God(Ouch) My God(Ouch) Why have you(ouch)forsaken me?(Owwwwwww it hurts!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)

Jesus was exclaiming in pain. He was not saying any message. Duh.
Click to expand...

LOL, I think you are right.

I also believe those were not the last words, accoring to Mark, they are, but acccording to John and Luke, they were not the last.

Mark 15: 33-34 -- And when the sixth hour had come, there was darkness over the whole land until the ninth hour. And at the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, "Elo-i, elo-i, lama sabach-thani?" which means, "My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?"

John 19:28 -- After this jesus, knowing that all was now finished, said (to fulfill the scripture0, "I thirst."

John 19:29-30 -- A bowl was there, full of cheap wine mixed with vinegar, so a sponge was soaked in it, put on hyssop and lifted up to his lips. When Jesus had received the wine, he said, "It is finished."

Luke 23:46 -- Then Jesus, crying with a loud voice, said, "Father, into thy hands I commit my spirit!" And having said this he breathed his last.
 
Medicine*Woman said:
*************
Let me explain... "El" is a shortened form of "Elias," the sun god "Helios," to whom Jesus called out from the cross. "El" is the sun. The "Elohim" also represents the many stars. Also known as the "Ali," who were associated with gods. "Ali" is Egyptian in origin and represents the "Atum," "Aten," and the "Amen," who are all part of "Elohim." "Atum" was later known as "Adam."

Jesus, as the sun of god, was crying out to his heavenly father/creator god, the sun, "Eli" and/or "Helios" who had abandoned him on the cross that day. Then the skies grew dark and stormy as the sun set behind the earth and died.
Click to expand...

El is far more likely to originate from Jewish esoteric traditions that later became known as Kabbalah. There are 10 names of God corresponding to the ten stations on the 'tree of life'. The different names of God are given as;

Ein Sof
Jehovah
Jehovah Elohim
EL
Elohim Gebor
Jehovah Alaoh va
Jehovah Tzabaoth
Shaddai El Chai
Adonai Ha Aretz

(I believe Jehovah is more authentically written as Yahweh in many versions).
 
Last edited:
Light Travelling: That is found in the Qur'an as you stated. Excuse me for not being exact all the time. I get loose here, and there, hoping the reader will know that if the Muslims say one thing, they must have got it from some where. Many times Muslims make up falsehoods, so they can put down Christians, but concerning the crucifixion they are telling the truth: it never happened to Jesus. Muslims simply say Jesus was not crucified, but a look alike was crucified instead. The look alike that appeared as Jesus was the one talking on the cross. Makes sense to be up there dying, and people think you are Jesus, then in that case you would sure feel like God forsook you.

The NT is a myth story, where Jesus is like the Greek God Hermes, the trickster. One of the original bad boys, but so cute you have to love him.

My website goes into the details on what the Koran states. Please read all of my site before replying, for if one skips through it, like they are a "know it all," they will never read enough to understand: http://home.earthlink.net/~donutnous/index.html
 
I never fail to be amazed by the lengths to which people will go to deny reality.

Absolutely amazing.
 
it never happened to Jesus. Muslims simply say Jesus was not crucified
Click to expand...

Werent they invited to the party? To bad there was not cable t.v or cameras.

Seriously, i dont think Muslims deny crucifixion but the resurrection...not sure though.

Dan, why dont you put the link to your site in your signature, so you dont have to post it every other day?
 
Last edited:
Medicine*Woman said:
*************
M*W: That may be so, but whatever the origin of the words "eli, eli, lama, sabachtheni," it is referring to speaking to the god in the heavens, or the sun. In fact, "eli" does not mean "my father," it means the "sun" who was called "god." In other words, Jesus could have easily said in English, "My SUN, why are you setting now?
Click to expand...
Archetypically, the "sun" is also a symbol of life, and of the ego (i.e. the sun sign, representing the ego in astrology)
 
Medicine*Woman said:
*************
M*W: To whom was Jesus talking when he allegedly cried out from the cross in Greek, no less, and said, "Eli, eli, lama sabachtheni?" (My god, my god, why have you forsaken me?)
Click to expand...
my guess would be Jesus thought there was god up there,
why else would he say something like that?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top