Who are more moral? Men or women?

Men are more idealistic and principled: they have all kinds of moral codes and laws and covenants and big long wordy treatises on ethics. Sometimes they act according to what they proclaim.
Women are more practical about doing the right thing in real situations, without always being able to articulate their reasons. Sometimes they lie and cheat.
Sin is a crazy, made-up concept nobody needs.
 
Syne said:
Are bar fights a daily occurrence for some, and does that factor in the alcohol?
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My point is: men have severe mood swings and can go from laughing to punching in less than 30 seconds under the right circumstances (not always involving alcohol). There's a reason most of crime is committed by men. There is clearly a moral dimension to that. That seems to me to suggest that, although I know some who point the finger at women, it is in fact unclear to me whether men or women have the better position.
 
Pandaemoni said:
My point is: men have severe mood swings and can go from laughing to punching in less than 30 seconds under the right circumstances (not always involving alcohol). There's a reason most of crime is committed by men. There is clearly a moral dimension to that. That seems to me to suggest that, although I know some who point the finger at women, it is in fact unclear to me whether men or women have the better position.
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There's a difference between poor impulse control and irrationality. One is about mental maturity while the other is about cognitive reasoning.

Granted, cognitive reasoning will often be compromised in post hoc justifications for poor impulse control. So even though a criminal would have thought they could "get away with it" beforehand (which may be reasonable considering some actually do), they may justify it as "being right" afterward.

Where crime is concerned, we must also distinguish between irrational and unethical behavioral causes. It is possible to be the latter without necessitating the former.
 
Syne said:
Are you a woman, or have you just not lived with a woman lately? Granted some are less irrational than others, but stereotypes do not develop in a vacuum.
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True. That is why men are stereotyped as they are. They have earned every derogatory adjective and continue in their stupid and immoral ways.

Men continue to ignore the better councils of women.

Regards
DL
 
Jeeves said:
Men are more idealistic and principled: they have all kinds of moral codes and laws and covenants and big long wordy treatises on ethics. Sometimes they act according to what they proclaim.
Women are more practical about doing the right thing in real situations, without always being able to articulate their reasons. Sometimes they lie and cheat.
Sin is a crazy, made-up concept nobody needs.
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I disagree with your last because sin is equated with crime and law in my mind.
Get rid of the concept of crime and law and you have hell on earth.

Do you see religions as having more idealism and principles and morality as these male dominated groups go about refusing to give women equality?

Regards
DL
 
Fine, but we don't all live in your mind.
Sin and crime are not equated for everyone, universally. Laws exist in all nations, past and present, under all kinds of religions as in secular states.
Men are more likely to create laws, both religious and secular, because they have a greater need of seeing things set out in black and white; they are also more likely to break those same laws under strong emotion or out of rebellion against their fathers.
Women are more adaptable to practical daily reality and see what needs to be done; need less of the stone tablet and more of compassion. Their crimes are more likely to be of deceptive kind than the violent.
There is a large area of overlap.
 
wynn said:
Welcome to Stepford!
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Wynn I feel like you know something that you struggle to put to pin . This strange bizarre , I don't know what it is .
I understand stepford pretty good . Hell in reality I am my self . Fuck Hole

There is I don't want to call it a flaw cause well it is human nature it self .

What is your thoughts on sexual oppression ? Is woman sexually oppressed by stepford rolls of excepted behavior . The Prince Charm fairy tale seems to be at play in main stream society also . Dictating what is appropriate behavior for a good little Human woman .

Fuck Me . Shit
Well I had lots of stuff on my sexual escapade story telling in public and in private ( which I have beyond at lease my own shadow of doubt. Believe is valid) I don't feel like talking about it right now . Digesting it is giving Me a belly ache. My head is still spinning
I sexually frustrated my wife . To the core . She is gonna have the sex of her life Sat. Night though so that is not that far away for her . The depressing thing is what I had to do to get her there . Strip Me of my Man Hood . Cry Cry Cry Me a river .
Shit every bodies like that too . I am hell bent to find someone not. Real life . I can see why Jane left Ted Turner now . After watching his language on T.V.
He got a good taste of the Me's
He said something I lived by . Set your goals higher than what you can accomplish then you will always have something to live for .
Surprised Me cause I learned that as a little kid from a Doctor.
He went on to say . My Dad reached his goals and then he committed suicide cause he had nothing left to live for . So I decided to set my Goals high .
See how that filters into swarm thought possess . Stepford like . Ted has to be the root as when I was taught as a moral compass it was exactly the same copy and paste.
Clones .
Wynn Eyes wide open . Like that Lady Gag Gag stuff. Unbelievable
 
Jeeves said:
Fine, but we don't all live in your mind.
Sin and crime are not equated for everyone, universally. Laws exist in all nations, past and present, under all kinds of religions as in secular states.
Men are more likely to create laws, both religious and secular, because they have a greater need of seeing things set out in black and white; they are also more likely to break those same laws under strong emotion or out of rebellion against their fathers.
Women are more adaptable to practical daily reality and see what needs to be done; need less of the stone tablet and more of compassion. Their crimes are more likely to be of deceptive kind than the violent.
There is a large area of overlap.
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So your bottom line is no bottom line.

Thanks for this.

Regards
DL
 
Bottom line as to which sex is more moral over-all?
I don't think we can really agree on a definition of morality, but in my own system, men are less moral, since they're historically responsible for crimes on the very largest scale: genocide, slavery, war, political ideology and religion.
 
Men have always been held accountable for their actions, and women have, historically, had a man to protect them from the worst of the consequences for their own actions. Granted, this has been a biological necessity of the long human gestation and maturation, but it shows why women wouldn't have had a necessity to develop as great a sense of accountability.
 
Syne said:
Men have always been held accountable for their actions, and women have, historically, had a man to protect them from the worst of the consequences for their own actions. Granted, this has been a biological necessity of the long human gestation and maturation, but it shows why women wouldn't have had a necessity to develop as great a sense of accountability.
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What a load of crap. Ignorant, puerile prattle. You should be ashamed of having said something so blindingly dense. Women, who have been persecuted for the crime of having female genitalia, who have been oppressed based on male ignorance of the reproduction cycle, have somehow been protected by their male keepers? My Pavlovian instinct is to screech an incredulous "IN WHAT WAY?!" at you, but such a question would imply that there is some justification for your asinine comments, and since there isn't, I won't dignify your opinion by pretending there is.

This thread is an exercise in sexism, in misogyny.

Even the original question of which sex is "more" moral is inane. No one involved in this conversation seems to have a handle on what morality as a concept, yet they offer clumsy answers based on their own misunderstandings and personal prejudices.

Morality isn't in a lawbook, and it isn't in a holy text; it is an innate sense of rightness that is not predominant in or exclusive to one sex. You can't name one moral act done by a man that can not be done by a woman.
 
JDawg said:
What a load of crap. Ignorant, puerile prattle. You should be ashamed of having said something so blindingly dense. Women, who have been persecuted for the crime of having female genitalia, who have been oppressed based on male ignorance of the reproduction cycle, have somehow been protected by their male keepers? My Pavlovian instinct is to screech an incredulous "IN WHAT WAY?!" at you, but such a question would imply that there is some justification for your asinine comments, and since there isn't, I won't dignify your opinion by pretending there is.
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You've made my point, without even realizing it. Just as any animal is not expected to held completely accountable for its actions, so would any human not seen as an equal be thought to lack some volition for their own actions. Historically, woman have been considered lesser than men in many ways, and because of this have not been held as accountable for their actions. Hell, even today PMS is an accepted excuse to hold a woman unaccountable for their actions. This shows evidence for the historic lack of being held accountable contributing to a lesser sense of personal accountability.

Women are extremely vulnerable during late gestation, and our species could not have survived without the protection of men.
 
JDawg said:
Women . . . have somehow been protected by their male keepers?
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Quite literally yes. If you've ever been with a woman who was nine months pregnant, or in labor, or recovering from labor - they're pretty helpless. And traditionally it's been their husband/mate who does most of the protecting during that time.

(Of course that doesn't mean that one sex is better than the other; it's just a fact of our biology.)

Morality isn't in a lawbook, and it isn't in a holy text; it is an innate sense of rightness that is not predominant in or exclusive to one sex. You can't name one moral act done by a man that can not be done by a woman.
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Agreed there.
 
Syne said:
You've made my point, without even realizing it. Just as any animal is not expected to held completely accountable for its actions, so would any human not seen as an equal be thought to lack some volition for their own actions. Historically, woman have been considered lesser than men in many ways, and because of this have not been held as accountable for their actions. Hell, even today PMS is an accepted excuse to hold a woman unaccountable for their actions. This shows evidence for the historic lack of being held accountable contributing to a lesser sense of personal accountability.

Women are extremely vulnerable during late gestation, and our species could not have survived without the protection of men.
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And therein lies the genesis of this crackpot theory. :rolleyes:

To begin, oppression does not equate to protection. In societies where women are and have been viewed as lesser beings, they are always subject to greater restrictions and punishments than men, not fewer. Women in Afghanistan under Taliban rule were forbade from going to school or getting a job, even from leaving the house without a male companion. And what do you suppose the penalties were for breaking these rules, or attempting to break these rules, or talking about breaking these rules? I can smell your brain burning, so I'll answer it for you: Beatings. Rape. Death.

And you say oppressed women are held less accountable for their actions?

Secondly, not all societies have mistreated their women, or given them less importance than men in society. There have been queens and empresses for thousands of years, and plenty of matriarchal societies throughout history in which women are the ones who dictate ethics and morality.

Women are now and always have been held responsible for their actions. Some societies have imposed greater limitations on their roles, but women have never been immune to punishment or retribution, so this idea that women are somehow less moral because they've never been held accountable is complete bunk. As is the misogynistic notion that we are predisposed to give women a pass for their behavior.

Now, to your last "point" about pregnant women requiring protection, you're talking about physical protection from outside threats, not immunity for their actions.

billvon said:
Quite literally yes. If you've ever been with a woman who was nine months pregnant, or in labor, or recovering from labor - they're pretty helpless. And traditionally it's been their husband/mate who does most of the protecting during that time.

(Of course that doesn't mean that one sex is better than the other; it's just a fact of our biology.)
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They're not helpless. If they were, we wouldn't be here now. And think about how ridiculous that idea is, bilvon. You're essentially saying that fat people are helpless.

Anyway, you're talking about physical protection. Like that buffoon quoted above, you've somehow confused this with protection from all consequences, which he cites as the reason for his absurd theory that women are less moral than men. This has nothing to do with morality.
 
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