where is the evidence for alien visitation?
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Can I toss in a couple of remarks? If I may? No. Wait. Instead, please allow me to nod Sir Gustav, albeit late, for short-circuiting that trap that is Mister Synonymous—with a British vernacular. It was all so… phew… such an escalating and savvy display of verbal mite-tossing—ifyouknowwhatImean. I could never, in my zaniest aspirations, finger, as you did, JDwang and Mister Synonymous' deliciously, I mean pathetically synthetic, wrinkle resistant fabrics. But you managed somehow to reveal something of them. Such pretty boys, too. But it was wild to watch, I mean read. And although I spent most of it smirking with evil indulgence, I managed somehow to take note, Sir Gustav, of their fisting, I mean fishing techniques. I thank you for this exposition. It was, uh, frightfully kinky, I mean slinky.
It's all just information aquisition and control.
STDD
STDD
Ah...I feel stupid. You are right, Gustav, and I mistook the context. I thought you were merely...well, nevermind. Let me just say that I do understand what you mean; the coverups, if any, occur after the actual event, which is almost never disputed. Something happened at Roswell, and at these sites where credible witnesses say they happened...the problems occur after the events. Coverup? Lies? Exaggerations?
I apologize for taking this incredible discussion down a road it didn't need to go.
Agreed. I guess I didn't do enough research to realize that many governments take these events very seriously and very publically. Again, though, I have to say that nobody is claiming the crafts or lights or whatever, are alien.
You are right, Gustav. Let us now set these ground rules, for future reference. I say proof is testable, verified evidence of the actuality of something; if you say the sky is blue, I need more than three people who can agree to this, plus a visual of this so-called "blue" color, and a professional painter and scientist to tell me that this is true. So...if you say that there is a military cover-up, I need some credible witnesses, some visuals of these items being covered up, some professional military/scientific/governmental people to agree upon this. I need this ALL to come together. If you provide less than all of that, the best I can do is say "well, maybe." But I will never agree, not without what I consider proof.
Let me tell you what my stance is, and my personal belief is in this matter...
I believe that the universe is big, and that with as many stars as there are in the universe, there must be life elsewhere. That said, I have come to a couple of conlusions (albeit temporary, based on advances in knowledge on the matter that may come with time) and those are that A) The universe is SO big that if life exists on even the most outer reaches of our own galaxy, it might take far too long for a sentinent being to travel to our little planet for it to be worthwhile. And you must remember that if our closest intelligent neighbor exists 10 thousand light-years away, the earth they see through their telescopes is 10 thousand years younger than the one we live on today. Therefore, all the pretty lights we shine into space today aren't the ones those intelligent beings see.
And B) Maybe, just maybe, we are special. Not completely unique, but special. Dinosaurs lived for how many millions of years, and never evolved into intelligent beings. Scientists say that some dinos evolved into todays birds, so that would make them billions of years old, and still no intelligence. I'm not saying that there aren't intelligent beings elsewhere in this universe, because I would imagine that if we have one on this planet, we must have one somewhere else, but it's a possibility that they are as few and far between out there as they are on earth. After all, for all the billions of years that the Earth has been around, it's only developed one...just one.
JD
why do you presume birds hae no intelligence?.......and you are trying to work out about oter beings travelling etc looking through te limitations of your own current state of the art
this is what gets me about you so-called sceptics. many just dont seem to have imagination. you explore this issue in a cage of your own making........even in our science tere are theories that we probably live in many more dimensions than 3...!...do you take other dimensions into account?
this is what gets me about you so-called sceptics. many just dont seem to have imagination. you explore this issue in a cage of your own making........even in our science tere are theories that we probably live in many more dimensions than 3...!...do you take other dimensions into account?
snake river rufus
Registered Senior Member
Do birds make tools, or have a written form of communication? While you are daydreaming why not tell us what makes a lifeform intelligent.
snake river rufus said:me:h ....shmit, your name's wasted on ye. shoulda called yourself 'cold-logik' o something likemthat!
Do birds make tools, or have a written form of communication?
me::and that is what you rate as the critera for intelligence do you? Actually i have heard some species of birds do USE tools. Seeing they have no flexible thumb dont see how they could make them, but they do make intricate nests, and can fly.
can you??
You humans who are so self-superior-thinking really are the most ignore-ant when it comes to really feeling interelationship with Nature.
While you are daydreaming why not tell us what makes a lifeform intelligent.
Nature IS Intelligent, not just birds. you have grown OUT of Intelligent Nature and then after your cultural indoctrination about how better you are than rest of life, slagit off and have no inkling of its Intelligence. you just presume intelligence is the privilege of humans with their technology and written word. T
he written word has been one of THE most insidious inventions of man that has in man ways DIMINISHED human intelligence. in that it has created a mindset for many which is cut off from Nature! which is most definately NOT intelligent. and is curently trying to destroy Nature which includes mny other specis it views as unintelligent and there meaningless. This event, of course, you will not notice--(i am preempting your next response) which of course is again not intelligence but ignoreance!
Absolutely. Nature's "intelligence" is so very different from modern man's that it should never even be compared. What bogs the mind is Nature's ultra-sophisticated network that co-operates to sustain itself — an array of very dissimilar and unique components existing as matter, energy, elements, flora, organisms, species, climate, all happening without revolt or subterfuge, commingling and united under one Will, one Order, one Law. And glued together by something called "instinct". If modern man says that's dumb, then it is modern man who's too dumb to understand Nature's "intelligence". So then, what special "intelligence" is JDwang alluding to for himself??? And, given the endless possibilities of this vast Universe, why couldn't Nature's "intelligence" not also evolve into something more… alien?
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M
Mr Anonymous
Guest
Gustav said:
Mmmm.... And yet you, and people of your sort of disposition towards these things, invariably get to "know" the intimate details of every last little aspect of these so called "cover-ups" - but don't at all find that in the least little bit inconsistent with the term cover-up.
In intelligence circles the purpose of an actual cover-up is to first and foremost cover-up what ever it is one wants further scrutiny to be deflected away from - really rather defeats the whole purpose of the exercise if first the group or organisation concerned a lets the world and his dog know all about whatever the incident was in the first place and then b proceeds to continue to allow the world and his dog to know for an absolute "fact" that steps are being made to suppress evidence of the entire initial event.
In merely responding "No" to questions along the lines of "Were objects of extraterrestrial origin retrieved from Roswell....", for but general example wholly because you brought the matter up, the US Military may not automatically and simply by default in answering in the negative be actually lying or indeed proceeding to actually be covering-up evidence of anything at all of the kind the specific line of question posited dictates.
Wanting to cover-up the existence of the covert aerial surveillance device or else plane which may have gone somewhat array during testing and which direct evidence of its development and possession in the first place more than likely constitutes a severe breech of International Treaty - now that provides both means and more than adequate motive to want to suppress, hide and remove all further possibility of direct scrutiny away from prying eyes with the greatest degree of alacrity possible.
That subsequent enquiry in to the matter centres predominantly around concerns as remotely far away directly from Military affairs direct as the term extraterrestrials is likely to get hardly hinders the process - moreover one could not un-entirely unreasonably venture if anything ensuring that such scrutiny into whatever enquiry remains subsequently exclusively within the terms of what didn't actually prove to be the case in the first place makes simple and straightforward sense.
After all, if people want to ask about crashed UFO's and extraterrestrial bodies, let 'em. No one has to tell an out and out lie when directly questioned on the matter and politically no one has to face the embarrassment of being caught out actively conducting military activities mutually signed peace treaties prohibit the development of in the first place, but strategically need to be developed wholly on the QT.
Oh, and Gustav? If you could possibly find some way of addressing your responses in such a way as to presume the person your talking to has a biological age somewhat over and above their given shoe size, that would be simply marvellous. It's a recourse I haven't in the slightest found necessary to accost you with and, incredible as it may seem, what made the likes of Einstein and all the other genuinely intelligent, significant thinkers of the 20th and 21st Century the figures of stature there ideas inevitably lead them to become wasn't their capacity in debate to stamp their feet, pout, sneer, lambaste everyone one else as being an idiot and cast aspirations on the sexual practices of those inclined to find their proposed case not wholly conclusive and simply dared to intimate as such out within ear shot....
I fully realise this sort of approach may be second nature to you, but if your case really is as pre-eminently obvious as your tone seems to continually imply, surely the facts of the matter alone should be perfectly sufficient to allow your argument to take. Do be sure to bear that in mind, there's a good chap...
Depends on your use of the term "intelligent" I guess.duendy said:
Also, the thinking that humans are above the than animals tends to be pushed by some religions.
Modern science has gained an appreciation for the complexity of nature, not the opposite as you seem enjoy thinking.
No doubt, with your distorted view of science, you will disagree.
Duendy that is probably your most stupid comment yet...duendy said:
The written word is leading to the destruction of nature? Right. How?duendy said:
(Apart from trees being chopped down to make paper)
Duendy do think early man had a better intelligence of nature ?
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Yes i do...regarding BEING in it. i know what you are aiming at. that we know so much more right? and i agree this is marvelous. you know knowing how incredibbly vast the universe is etc etc. but what has notably happend in mainstream science is that the emphasis on objectivity has atrophied the subjective awareness In Nature.....BEING Nature has been seriously atrophied.shaman_ said:
Mr Anonymous said:
hehe
i do not give a rat's ass about your sensibilities nor will i make any effort to accomadate your priggishness
as far as i am concerned it is mindless verbiage and filler intended to distract and deceive that you are really running on empty. it is the inability of some to leave their friggin egos and focus on the discussion
i mean, just look at that petty tantrum.
"significant thinkers of the 20th and 21st Century"
hehe
trolling along right smartly,eh?
just look at the wild and expansive exaggerations
the sheer scope employed
dear god, please dont strike me down
you are whining like a bitch with a fat cock up her ass
you revisit resolved issues
Mr Anonymous said:
are you that hurt, child, to bring it up again?
oh
i stomp and pound
you primp and prance like a simpering prig
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