What is the material of our soul?

[Cris]

usp,

There is evidence God exists.

Uhh – no there isn’t. Kinda been through this several thousand times here over the past 5+ years on this forum.

Anyhow, there has to be an initial thump to get things started and something has to create it, and that is the God of that action. It's common logic to me.

Yet it is total nonsense. Introducing a god to answer the question of how things started doesn’t answer anything. You are now faced with your own logic of explaining what started God, what was his initial thump. And then of course what started that, ad infinitum. If we use simple algebra and cancel out the redundant clauses we find the God component is entirely superfluous with the most likely theory that the universe is infinite and has always been in motion. Note that something must be infinite otherwise nothing could have begun. Why introduce an unnecessary complex fantasy supernatural component into the equation?

 

[Cris]

usp,

the starter of the reaction

Why must there be a beginning?

 

[Cris]

Provita,

Hi welcome to sciforums. Are you another name for usp? Your writing styles appear the same.

… there is no apparent evidence saying a soul does not exist.

Just like the other infinite number of fantasy ideas that never amount to anything. The only thing that removes something from that infinite fantasy set is evidence; otherwise the ideas are of little practical concern.

But to say it does, without a doubt, exist or not exist, is ignorant. It cannot be proven nor disproven.

I don’t think so. The idea is now redundant. It was nice for a long time when no one knew how the brain worked but now we know we have this complex organ that we are still trying to fathom how it works with the processing power equivalent to some 20,000 high end computer systems, and still you are suggesting that a soul does all that. So we have thoughts, emotions, memory, self-awareness, etc., on one side and……………a massively complex bio-electrical processing engine on the other. Might I suggest you join up the dots and voila. So if a soul existed what the heck would be its function? Given that the brain now accounts for all the things people in past thought was what the soul did, what is left for the soul?

The soul concept no longer has any meaningful credibility.

 

[Mythbuster]

A soul.. is going to be debated forever.. or until/if someone creates a computer with emotions and such~ ie. acts just like a human (and then claims war on us and- *shot*). does instict have anything to do with a soul..?

Anyway I remember reading a point. all the other gods, different beliefs.. all that.. they cant agree? That's because, it's true, many of them are made up in the mind of man. It's irrefutable; The majority of religion will turn out being incorrect just because so many disagree and *someone* has to be wrong.. as well as someone being right.
From here it comes down to 'Did man create god in his head to satisfy the want for a higher power/reason to explain everything' or 'a tendency or yearning for a God because we are supposed to reguard (him) and are incomplete without'
Having a god ussually gives us a indefinite purpose; serving or reguarding (him). The other leaves purpose open to self identification, community support, self support, etc... most gods holds these as secondaries, though.. so start with a higher being or not..?

oh, and a point I want to make: We CANNOT put total faith in ourselves(obviously, we know first hand that we fail), others(yeah, they definatley fail XP) or actions/goals(because of luck and circumstance. It'd be unfair for those in natural advantages...).

Heres another very interesting thought: how many of you guys out there think: 'I wish there was a god but look at this proof, there just couldn't be...' as to 'here's the proof, no god, yay!'. Then on the other side, how many go: 'wow, I really think theres a god out there... I wish there weren't ' as to 'Wow, theres a god out there! ^___^'

 

[Provita]

It is very possible, and widely accepted, that most if not all gods and goddesses were made up. It makes total sense that we, as men, without a distinct purpose except to not die, created (a) higher being(s) for our satisfaction so we could have a purpose. Many religions DO disagree, making it logic that most, if not all, are false beliefs, but that does not mean without a doubt that all are wrong (not saying u think that, im just stating.) If I were to see a pattern, all with the outcome that the religion is false (hypiothetically speaking), then it would be inductive logic to claim that ALL religions are false, but we must realize: inductive logic isnt always correct. We must always acknowledge the possibility that we may be wrong.

Yes, if i found out my God did not exist (and i like how u put "(him)" and not "him") I would probably be very devistated. On the other hand, if I found out God existed, I would rejoice and celebrate. A very good example for humanity's longing for a purpose. But you never know... perhaps that purpose... is the real reason we were here ^^.

But i say again, we will probably never KNOW... yes we can always guess, theorize, believe, make up, ect. ect. But we will never KNOW the purpose of life. Whether it be to strictly reproduce; stay alive; worship some(one/thing) or (ones/things); or maybe our purpose in life varies for each individual. We will never know.

A sould is rather impossible to prove or disprove, so there is no need to debate, but we can always discuss our personal views of what a soul is so we can explore the different possibilities.

 

[Mythbuster]

Provita are you agnostic ?

 

[usp8riot]

Geez, to come into this forum claiming to believe in God is to tread into a lion cage with a steak tied on you. I kind of figured I'd get a lot of disapproval. Believing in a creator is totally screwball as opposed to not being able to figure out who created us or thinking we *poofed* here. Maybe I need to see a quack, I must be going crazy.

 

[c7ityi_]

I don't know. Reality seems to have processes built in that promote survival which results in points of conciouness (take any mammal for example). For all I know the purpose of survival could be conciousness and then the question could be what is the purpose of conciousness? Don't know... and the question may not make any sense at that level as it concerns the rules of reality which may be 'as is'.

A void in knowledge isn't a gap to thrown in the ol' substitute 'God did it'. It's an opportunity to figure things out and learn.

I believe the purpose of reproduction is to have somebody to love. Ultimately, the universe exists because we 'want' it to exist (ie. 'God did it')

Beyond is the question, why do we want. The will (love, the only energy) is born from the principles of 'nothingness'.

Nothingness doesn't need any cause because it is the base state, the first cause, the logical 'existence' which exists no matter what.

The ancient myths have explained this.

 

[Lerxst]

Geez, to come into this forum claiming to believe in God is to tread into a lion cage with a steak tied on you.

Yeah, but it is a good experience, if you can seperate out the valid criticisms (and their name is legion) from the personal attacks that come with the messageboard format.

 

[(Q)]

Well, Newton. It's been about 10 years since I took a high school science so I'm rusty. Yeah, that something I call God. Heck, why not give "it" a name, the starter of the reaction. What will it hurt? Do people just have something against the name "God", is there politically correct people on the forum? What should I call it? Is the name offensive? I don't care if it was a dust particle that started from all this. We wouldn't be without it. I would call it God if it is the initial stimulus of the reaction.

You may simply call it for what it was, an event yielded from natural processes.

By calling it a god, you make a claim that it was more than just an event, that there was intelligence, purpose and design involved. Very different indeed.

 

[(Q)]

Geez, to come into this forum claiming to believe in God is to tread into a lion cage with a steak tied on you. I kind of figured I'd get a lot of disapproval. Believing in a creator is totally screwball as opposed to not being able to figure out who created us or thinking we *poofed* here. Maybe I need to see a quack, I must be going crazy.

It is a science forum first, with a religion board inserted within. If you want total agreement, there are plenty of religious forums available.

If you really want to learn how the universe came to be, you must first shed the concept of a creator and start to think about simple natural processes that work without the need of creators or gods. You may come to conclusions, that without valid evidence will lead you to stating that you just don't know. That's fine, but don't just jump to the conclusion that gods can preclude that which may not be known, yet.

 

[usp8riot]

Ok, His/it's name is Jimmy for the politically correct out there. It is the process who drew the bow, shot the first marble, threw the ping pong ball on the proverbial mousetraps. The difference is, I will give my initial stimulus a name instead of saying, thank you for what you have started, initial stimulus that started it all.

By calling it a god, you make a claim that it was more than just an event, that there was intelligence, purpose and design involved. Very different indeed.

Okay, Jimmy had no purpose in doing it. It's all just a crapshoot. But we are here. Life is going on. Let's all just be idiots and not know or care that something started it all. We *poofed* here by nothing which triggered, or not triggered, an action. If some people took time away from debunking others' Gods, then they may actually find a God of their own but they spend their life in others' business telling them to stop believing and therefore, have no life of their own. But nevermind, this is a topic about religion anyway, so I won't go there. It's just crazy how adament a lot of these Godless liberals are at trying to tell you there is no God, that it's all magic and somehow happened for no reason. Or no, that it didn't happen in their eyes, I mean. God has rules and to spite God, an executioner of rules for the health and welfare of our fellow human beings, is to spite your fellow humans. But when you step back and see it through the eyes of logic that we weren't created, that we just got here from "i don't know what the heck", then you'd see how nonsensical it would seems.

 

[(Q)]

It's just crazy how adament a lot of these Godless liberals are at trying to tell you there is no God, that it's all magic and somehow happened for no reason.

So, you have no intention of learning anything, but will go on to claim that the natural processes that caused the universe to come about are somehow magical and nonsensical, and claim that an imaginary being waved his hand and created everything is somehow logical.

And yet another mind falls prey to fantasy and ignorance.

 

[usp8riot]

and claim that an imaginary being waved his hand and created everything is somehow logical

I don't know what religion you get that from, but my God is a God of science. Science is His rules by which to do things and He always obeys them. There is no hand waving going on in my religion. He is the maker of mathematics and science. The ultimate mathematician and the ultimate physics professor. He is of infinite wisdom. Do you talk physics with a generation of pre-Newton man? Will they believe you or know what you're talking about? What do you expect out of a document from God through the eyes of 1st century man?

I can understand someone questioning God, don't get me wrong. It's good we have these discussions. To argue is to try to understand the thoughts of a believer and get rid of the negative thoughts in your mind so you can cleanse yourself. Nothing wrong with that. I know when I usually make a statement, there some people that are right on it like they have an itch that needs scratching. A yearning to get their thirst of knowledge and understanding quenched. Myself, I am content in knowing what I know. I do not seek much more knowledge because I have been there and know I was wrong. I had all the feelings a lot of you had. I kept doing the problem because I got a clue when I realized you can argue for infinity and disclaim anything and in the end, all you are is a shell of cluelessness until you get off your butt and ask someone for the answer who has also been there. By being further behind in the knowledge of physics and mathematics, I am further ahead because I realized to study an infinitely smaller and larger universe is in itself, infinite and you are wasting your life away when you could be doing something more important for your fellow human beings. I used to be really into physics and math 'til I tried to debunk the christian God using those principles and I couldn't do it, in fact, I discovered God through science and math. I am the only one I know of that has found God through science and math. It was scary. I didn't believe, I knew. It came to me like a slap in the face. Don't listen to others. Listen to yourself, what's inside using your own judgement of what you think is wrong and right and you will see, God is the way. The way of least anger, least hate, most peace, and less chaos. Chaos is not the way of science and math, they have laws and order. God is a God of law and order. Nothing according to Him is chaos, only in man's limited mind is the concept of chaos possible to see. I'm gonna stop now unless someone wants me to go on.

 

[Mosheh Thezion]

THE AURA..... IS THE MATERIAL OF THE SOUL....
SO ITS ELECTROMAGNETIC... which can become... electrostatic.

-MT

 

[Jan Ardena]

usp8riot,

What is the material of our soul?

Hi,

I believe it is pure, unadulterated, consciousness

Jan.

 

[Cris]

usp,

Geez, to come into this forum claiming to believe in God is to tread into a lion cage with a steak tied on you.

Hmmm - fresh meat!!! But realy the responses so far are very mild compared to those directed at the more extreme fundamentalists we see here.

I guess the idea that someone can say they believe and have the majority non-believers here think that is acceptable - ain't gonna happen.

 

[(Q)]

There is no hand waving going on in my religion.

There can be nothing else other than hand waving in religion.

Myself, I am content in knowing what I know. I do not seek much more knowledge because I have been there and know I was wrong. By being further behind in the knowledge of physics and mathematics, I am further ahead because I realized to study an infinitely smaller and larger universe is in itself, infinite and you are wasting your life away when you could be doing something more important for your fellow human beings.

I see, to you, learning is a waste of time and ones life. Yet, worshipping imaginary beings is important to your fellow human beings? Please explain how that could possibly benefit anyone?

I used to be really into physics and math 'til I tried to debunk the christian God using those principles and I couldn't do it

I seriously doubt your claims of having been "really into physics and math." Nice try though.

Listen to yourself, what's inside using your own judgement of what you think is wrong and right and you will see, God is the way. The way of least anger, least hate, most peace, and less chaos.

...least thinking, least living, least understanding, most ignorant, most fearful, most deluded.

Chaos is not the way of science and math, they have laws and order. God is a God of law and order. Nothing according to Him is chaos, only in man's limited mind is the concept of chaos possible to see. I'm gonna stop now unless someone wants me to go on.

It's all complete nonsense, but please go on. It's fun watching people dig deep holes.

 

[Crunchy Cat]

I believe...

Stop right there. That's emotion based thinking... not evidence based.

...the purpose of reproduction is to have somebody to love. Ultimately, the universe exists because we 'want' it to exist (ie. 'God did it')

And what's the purpose of having somebody to love? Additionally, a claim that 'God did it' is being made without evidence that 'God' exists. That's a flawed argument.

Beyond is the question, why do we want. The will (love, the only energy) is born from the principles of 'nothingness'.

Nothingness doesn't need any cause because it is the base state, the first cause, the logical 'existence' which exists no matter what.

There is no evidence to even remotely suggest that 'nothing' exists, has ever existed, or will ever exist.

The ancient myths have explained this.

They're called myths for a reason.

 

[usp8riot]

Yes, mosheh, so wouldn't any electromagnetic object have a soul then? And what happens when the electricity is cut? The energy in that object is no longer. It is transferred to other objects in the world. It is now a part of that. And so you see, all that energy is one in the universe. It can neither be created nor destroyed, only transferred. And you can say that energy in it's entirety is one. And that energy when we die is all intermingled with the energy of the universe, ie, heat, motion, etc.

So when we die and we are conscious no more, then what do you think happens then Jan?

God says we will have everlasting life if we believe and do His works. God can be able to revive an individuals DNA code and use it when He creates the new Earth. Since that DNA is ideal for an individual which can act most appropriately towards his fellow human beings.