Western Historians on The Islamic Conquests

* Im not sure what your position is on the point .

* I understand your line of thought that if they would be left in peace they wouldnt have reason later on to rebell . However if they would been forced to convert , todays decendants wouldnt be in a position where rebellion or resentment is possible .

* I think the left Christians & Jews (pre-zionism) in the ME and their position toward Islam and the Islamic implemented ways of life show exactly (wich is quite positive in general) what you mean , and perhaps this is what you meant in the first place but I simply didnt get it .
 
* Im not sure what your position is on the point .
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My point was basically what you said in your second notation. If the religion had forced everyone to join, then people wouldn't have the freedom to attack that they have today. However the fact that they weren't forced to convert and that they were allowed freedom, means that for descendants of the freedomites ( :rolleyes: ) to go back and attack them is disgusting!

Everyone cannot have been forced to convert because people were obviously allowed to go free, otherwise how else did people spread across the Earth (unless they escaped in the night).

So people were free to abandon God if they chose to, but then for these Godless descendants to go back, attack, and force their Godless ways on the people who left them free to disbeleive if they chose to, is just wrong! Especially when God is almost always given a patriarchal status: it's the people who feared the father most who left, and they now go back and attack the people, and force their ways on them, when their ancestors were left, free to beleive what they wanted.

One must wonder how much bias and prejudice has been passed down by these people who feared the father so much...! In fact it would be very hard to distinguish because we are part of this culture, and it would take an independant person to know this, perhaps people who are part of their society (the (middle) east)! Who knows what history they have written down because it would just be ignored and probably ridiculed by the West anyway.
 
My two cents on this----Watered down religion

I'm sick and tired of you people attacking Islam. First, you must, I repeat must, understand that the Islam that you see today in Philippines, Malasia, China, India, Saudi, ect....IS A WATERED DOWN VERSION......Yes, it's very diluted, handled by many entities, and shaped by many cultures....Let me give you guys examples from Christianity. If one tries to compare the Italian catholism with the Latin American Catholism with the Egyptian Catholism, one would see many many differences. Why, because people add their culture aspects and their old traditions to the religion they are about to recieve. Same in Islam, Iranian understanding differs from Egyptian understanding, differ from Saudi understanding, and all see to think they are muslims in thier own unique ways, while what they profess is more influenced by their culture and tradition that it does of the universal islam message that was revealed 1500 years ago.

Islam and Christianity were mainly spread by trade and missionaries. Traders and missionaries knowing little about the core of the religion taught the people the best they can, which is clearly a watered down version influenced by the traders traditions and personal veiws. Those people who get the message first hand from the missionaries become the teachers to other and yet convery the message with additional water, ect....If you have played the game of whisper in ten people ears and see what is the end product, you'll know what I'm talking about.

The message of Judiasm, Christianity, and Islam are simple. Very simple that people must complicate it by watering it down with justification, traditions, and secularist ideas....This result in the chaos we see around us today where every fool feel entiteled to send the other to his hell or heaven like Tiassa says, market share system.
 
I know Sefter, my comments were not directed to you, but to general audience, the ones on offensive and defensive, just my two cents on the issue.

PS. You shouldn't defend or offend Islam to please a group of people, just do what feels right to you.
 
hef

watered down? what a frikkin insult! you just reduced the ummah to a few million people! a pox on your elitist orthodoxy!

ps: how dare you!:D
 
Re: hef

Originally posted by spookz
ps: how dare you!:D
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You're too cute when you're upset....You almost had me pull up my veil and call you Master....Start calling me Mara or Walia (woman, or the hired one that screams and wallow on the dead) and Work on the your letter Kh....it kindda sounds like you are spitting or splitting a throat, and you'll make a perfect Muslim master for me.
 
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