Vaccine related autism study?

[Magical Realist]

Here the source studies for the previous post:


Outbreak of Measles Among Persons With Prior Evidence of Immunity, New York City, 2011 http://cid.oxfordjournals.org/content/early/2014/02/27/cid.ciu105

2. Detection of Measles Virus RNA in Urine Specimens from Vaccine Recipients http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7494055

3. Comparison of the Safety, Vaccine Virus Shedding and Immunogenicity of Influenza Virus Vaccine, Trivalent, Types A and B, Live Cold-Adapted, Administered to Human Immunodeficiency Virus (HIV)-Infected and Non-HIV Infected Adults http://jid.oxfordjournals.org/content/181/2/725.full

4. Sibling Transmission of Vaccine-Derived Rotavirus (RotaTeq) Associated with Rotavirus Gastroenteritis http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/125/2/e438

5. Polio vaccination may continue after wild virus fades http://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective/2008/10/polio-vaccination-may-continue-after-wild-virus-fades

6. Engineering attenuated virus vaccines by controlling replication fidelity http://www.nature.com/nm/journal/v14/n2/abs/nm1726.html

7. CASE OF VACCINE-ASSOCIATED MEASLES FIVE WEEKS POST-IMMUNISATION, BRITISH COLUMBIA, CANADA, OCTOBER 2013 http://www.eurosurveillance.org/ViewArticle.aspx?ArticleId=20649

8. The Safety Profile of Varicella Vaccine: A 10-Year Review http://jid.oxfordjournals.org/content/197/Supplement_2/S165.full
9. Comparison of Shedding Characteristics of Seasonal Influenza Virus (Sub)Types and Influenza A(H1N1)pdm09; Germany, 2007-2011 http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0051653

10. Epigenetics of Host-Pathogen Interactions: The Road Ahead and the Road Behind http://journals.plos.org/plospathogens/article?id=10.1371/journal.ppat.1003007

11. Animal Models for Influenza Virus Pathogenesis and Transmission http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3063653/

12. Acellular pertussis vaccines protect against disease but fail to prevent infection and transmission in a nonhuman primate mode http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3063653/

13. Study Finds Parents Can Pass Whooping Cough to Babies http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/03/health/03coug.html?_r=0

14. Immunized People Getting Whooping Cough http://www.kpbs.org/news/2014/jun/12/immunized-people-getting-whooping-cough/

15. Vaccine Failure -- Over 1000 Got Mumps in NY in Last Six Months http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2010/03/06/vaccine-failure--over-1000-get-mumps-in-ny-in-last-six-months.aspx

16. Impact of Repeated Vaccination on Vaccine Effectiveness Against Influenza A(H3N2) and B During 8 Seasons http://cid.oxfordjournals.org/content/early/2014/09/29/cid.ciu680.full

17. http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2012/09/18/flu-shot-increases-flu-illness.aspx - See more at: http://globenewswire.com/news-relea...ad-Disease.html#sthash.rYc2vVFL.wirCUqcy.dpuf

 

[Magical Realist]

You cited the report by Hooker?

The report which was retracted by the journal because it was so false?

Wow, you really are scraping the bottom of the barrel.

Retracted my ass. Here' what your own author says:

"I’ll get into the issues with this study a bit more later, but I’ll admit up front that it’s hard to go too deeply into this study without a statistician and access to the actual restricted data set from the CDC used. Not having access to the data set, I have no way of knowing if the analyses Hooker used were appropriate."

You hack!

You should be absolutely ashamed of yourself.

Your ideology is as bad as those of people who claim that HIV/AIDS is caused by homosexuality and then cite false studies to support their claim. This is exactly the sort of bullshit you are trying to pull here.

LOL! Your obviously unfamiliar how the govt initially tried to pin AIDS on gay men as the gay disease. You obviously don't know how hard it was to get the govt to fund studies in AIDS research in the 1980's. So don't play the homophobe card with me. YOU'RE the one speaking for the govt/cdc/big pharma. YOU'RE the one smearing a tiny minority as dirty and diseased.

 

[billvon]

"Scientific evidence demonstrates that individuals vaccinated with live virus vaccines such as MMR (measles, mumps and rubella), rotavirus, chicken pox, shingles and influenza can shed the virus for many weeks or months afterwards and infect the vaccinated and unvaccinated alike.

Right. That's how live vaccines work. If this happened to you, you would be lucky indeed, because you would then become immune to that disease.

Furthermore, vaccine recipients can carry diseases in the back of their throat and infect others while displaying no symptoms of a disease.

Also correct.

"Numerous scientific studies indicate that children who receive a live virus vaccination can shed the disease and infect others for weeks or even months afterwards.

Also correct.

"Thus, parents who vaccinate their children can indeed put others at risk.

Ah. So either you or the author (or perhaps both) does not know how live attenuated vaccine strains work. I'd solve that problem before making more posts that demonstrate that ignorance.

 

[Magical Realist]

Here's something to think about. Why would all these measles cases START in Disneyland? Is it because of these selfish evil American antivaxxers? No..Think about it. Disneyland is perhaps the number one place foreigners come to America to enjoy. Foreigners who come from their own country where measles is more widespread or who contract it by traveling among other foreigners. So guess what? FOREIGNERS are the ones to blame for the measles outbreak, not American antivaxxers. And here's a quote from the CDC to back this up:

"Where do measles cases in the United States come from?

Measles disease can come into this country when unvaccinated U.S. residents travel internationally or foreign visitors to the United States are exposed to measles in another country and travel into the United States. The risk of getting measles may be very high for unvaccinated U.S. residents who travel abroad. The reason for this high risk is because measles is common in other parts of the world, including countries in Europe, Asia, the Pacific, and Africa. Worldwide, about 20 million people get measles each year. When people with measles travel into the United States, they can spread the disease to unvaccinated people including children too young to be vaccinated.

How many measles cases are there in the United States each year?

In 2000, the United States declared that measles was eliminated. Measles elimination means that the disease is not constantly present in this country. Since 2000, the annual number of people reported to have measles ranged from a low of 37 people in 2004 to a high of 644 people in 2014. Most of these people got measles outside of the United States or after being exposed to someone who got measles while in another country. So far in 2015, we have seen many cases of measles that are part of a large, ongoing outbreak linked to an amusement park in California. See more up-to-date information on measles cases and outbreaks."

 

[Magical Realist]

"Although most of those infected with measles this year aren't fully vaccinated, the disease is so contagious that it could wind up infecting many people who have had all of their recommended shots, health officials say.

California health officials have said that 82% of measles patients in that state were not fully vaccinated, suggesting that 18% have had a measles shot.

Does that mean that 18% of vaccinated people will come down with measles?

Not at all, says Gregory Wallace of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

To understand why, Wallace says people should remember that measles is one of the most contagious viruses known.

The virus can linger in the air "like a ghost," infecting people even two hours after the sick person has left the room, says Paul Offit, director of the Vaccine Education Center at Children's Hospital of Philadelphia. Infected people also can spread measles for four days before they develop the tell-tale red rash, as well as four days after the rash goes away.

One dose of measles vaccine protects 93% of patients, while two doses protect 97%, Wallace says.

But even with a vaccine failure rate of only 3%, a large measles outbreak can end up infecting a lot of fully vaccinated people, Wallace says.

To illustrate why, Wallace suggested considering a scenario in which 1,000 people are exposed to measles, with 900 fully vaccinated and 100 unvaccinated.

Doctors would expect 90% of the unvaccinated people -- or 90 people -- to get sick. They would also expect 3% of the vaccinated people -- or 27 people -- to get sick, for a total of 117 people.

Clearly, the vaccinated people here are much better protected. But the percentage of patients were vaccinated in this scenario is 23% -- about the same proportion that health officials tend to see in real outbreaks, Wallace says."====http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2015/02/04/unvaccinated-people-measles/22864869/

 

[billvon]

Here's something to think about. Why would all these measles cases START in Disneyland? Is it because of these selfish evil American antivaxxers? No..Think about it. Disneyland is perhaps the number one place foreigners come to America to enjoy. Foreigners who come from their own country where measles is more widespread or who contract it by traveling among other foreigners. So guess what? FOREIGNERS are the ones to blame for the measles outbreak, not American antivaxxers.

Since most foreigners have higher vaccination rates than the US does - and since most people at Disneyland are from the US - your claim is nonsensical.

 

[Magical Realist]

Since most foreigners have higher vaccination rates than the US does - and since most people at Disneyland are from the US - your claim is nonsensical.

(U.S. News' Kimberly Leonard noted that "Medical authorities have been quick to point to the anti-vaccine movement as the cause for the measles outbreak in California, but an analysis of the data suggests there may be other contributing factors, from public health measures that targeted only children to lack of access to medical care.")

And then there's THIS:

"An outbreak of measles that started in California's Disneyland probably came from overseas, carried either by a foreign tourist or by an American coming back with the virus, a top federal health official said Thursday.

The virus has now infected 94 people in eight states, and 67 can be clearly linked to Disneyland, California health officials report. Because measles is so contagious, more cases can be expected.


"We don't know exactly how this outbreak started but we do think it was likely a person infected with measles overseas," Dr. Anne Schuchat of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention told reporters.

"We assume that someone got infected with measles overseas, visited Disneyland park, and spread the disease to others."

"This is a wake-up call to make sure that we keep measles from regaining a foothold in our country."

There's been on ongoing outbreak of measles in the Philippines, but no imported U.S. cases have been linked to the Philippines this year, Schuchat said. Genetic tests of the virus affecting Americans are similar to strains seen in Indonesia, Qatar, Azerbaijan and Dubai.

Whoever first brought the virus to Disneyland is probably long gone, Schuchat said, and could even be unaware that he or she caused the outbreak."===http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/me...asles-outbreak-came-overseas-cdc-says-n296441

Oops. That can't be Jenny McCarthy or Edward Kennedy now could it?

 

[billvon]

(U.S. News' Kimberly Leonard noted that "Medical authorities have been quick to point to the anti-vaccine movement as the cause for the measles outbreak in California, but an analysis of the data suggests there may be other contributing factors, from public health measures that targeted only children to lack of access to medical care.")

Of course; there is always more than one cause. Easy access to medical care helps reduce contagion risk after exposure, and public health measures should indeed target everyone. Still, the fact remains that if those people had been vaccinated we would not have to deal with this.

 

[Magical Realist]

Of course; there is always more than one cause. Easy access to medical care helps reduce contagion risk after exposure, and public health measures should indeed target everyone. Still, the fact remains that if those people had been vaccinated we would not have to deal with this.

If many people aren't being vaccinated because of poor access to medical care or because public measures that only targeted children, it's harder to blame the antivaxxers. But you wouldn't want that would you? So much easier to scapegoat and malign them for the problem.

 

[billvon]

If many people aren't being vaccinated because of poor access to medical care or because public measures that only targeted children, it's harder to blame the antivaxxers.

I blame the people who could get vaccinated - and decided not to for bullshit reasons, such as the ones you've posted here.

 

[Magical Realist]

I blame the people who could get vaccinated - and decided not to for bullshit reasons, such as the ones you've posted here.

LOL! That's what I said. Despite the evidence it came from overseas from a foreigner.

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/me...asles-outbreak-came-overseas-cdc-says-n296441

 

[Bells]

Retracted my ass. Here' what your own author says:

"I’ll get into the issues with this study a bit more later, but I’ll admit up front that it’s hard to go too deeply into this study without a statistician and access to the actual restricted data set from the CDC used. Not having access to the data set, I have no way of knowing if the analyses Hooker used were appropriate."

Yes, it was retracted.

With very good reason.

And really good work taking things out of context and being misleading.

LOL! Your obviously unfamiliar how the govt initially tried to pin AIDS on gay men as the gay disease. You obviously don't know how hard it was to get the govt to fund studies in AIDS research in the 1980's. So don't play the homophobe card with me. YOU'RE the one speaking for the govt/cdc/big pharma. YOU'RE the one smearing a tiny minority as dirty and diseased.

Oh my god.. Here we go. Government/big pharma conspiracy.

It's hacks like you who are driving us back to the middle ages in regards to health care.

You are literally encouraging and supporting self interest groups who think that because they are too rich, they cannot get sick and media personalities who have no clue about medicine or how vaccines even work and why they are so effective literally endanger the population.

What you are doing right now is tantamount to telling men and women to have unprotected sex because HIV/AIDS is only a gay man's disease. You know how dangerous that ideology is and this is exactly the same kind of bullshit you are pulling in this thread by spreading misinformation and lies. And it's the same bullshit that witchdoctors in Africa pulled when they told the local populace that ebola was a manufactured disease and to not cooperate with the doctors and to not go to the ebola centers.. Some doctors and nurses and their clinics were even attacked at ebola sufferers taken home, because of this same sort of misinformation and dishonest bullshit lies which anti-vaxxers feed on. The result has been one of the biggest ebola outbreaks in our history.

Do you actually understand how close the world came to eradicating measles? Any idea at all? And then one fuckwit of a scientist with his own agenda, lied for money, fabricated a study (and abused children in the process by performing unethical and invasive tests on them) and some blonde bimbo in the US jumped on the bandwagon and here we are. We have literally gone back about 30 years medically because of it. And it is absolutely despicable that selfish people like you can be allowed to continue to endanger the lives of people who need the "herd" to be immunised so that they do not die.

Frankly, each and every single one of the anti-vaxxers belong in jail, because they are literally the 'scream fire in a crowded theater' types who, with your selfish and moronic bullshit ideology and propaganda, have resulted in multiple deaths because diseases that had been eliminated is once again endemic in the population, endangering the lives of those who need the most protection from others. And for you to spout that same ideology here, to the point where you are falsely claiming that people who vaccinate their children are endangering the population not only shows you have no bloody idea how vaccines even work, but it is also a god damn lie that does endanger people's lies. And it is despicable.

Freedom of speech should not extend to people like you who go out and deliberately endanger people's lives through lies and misrepresentations because it suits your fruitcake seeing the boogeyman and flying saucers and ghosts agenda to do so.

 

[Magical Realist]

Yes, it was retracted.

With very good reason.

And really good work taking things out of context and being misleading.



Oh my god.. Here we go. Government/big pharma conspiracy.

It's hacks like you who are driving us back to the middle ages in regards to health care.

You are literally encouraging and supporting self interest groups who think that because they are too rich, they cannot get sick and media personalities who have no clue about medicine or how vaccines even work and why they are so effective literally endanger the population.

What you are doing right now is tantamount to telling men and women to have unprotected sex because HIV/AIDS is only a gay man's disease. You know how dangerous that ideology is and this is exactly the same kind of bullshit you are pulling in this thread by spreading misinformation and lies. And it's the same bullshit that witchdoctors in Africa pulled when they told the local populace that ebola was a manufactured disease and to not cooperate with the doctors and to not go to the ebola centers.. Some doctors and nurses and their clinics were even attacked at ebola sufferers taken home, because of this same sort of misinformation and dishonest bullshit lies which anti-vaxxers feed on. The result has been one of the biggest ebola outbreaks in our history.

Do you actually understand how close the world came to eradicating measles? Any idea at all? And then one fuckwit of a scientist with his own agenda, lied for money, fabricated a study (and abused children in the process by performing unethical and invasive tests on them) and some blonde bimbo in the US jumped on the bandwagon and here we are. We have literally gone back about 30 years medically because of it. And it is absolutely despicable that selfish people like you can be allowed to continue to endanger the lives of people who need the "herd" to be immunised so that they do not die.

Frankly, each and every single one of the anti-vaxxers belong in jail, because they are literally the 'scream fire in a crowded theater' types who, with your selfish and moronic bullshit ideology and propaganda, have resulted in multiple deaths because diseases that had been eliminated is once again endemic in the population, endangering the lives of those who need the most protection from others. And for you to spout that same ideology here, to the point where you are falsely claiming that people who vaccinate their children are endangering the population not only shows you have no bloody idea how vaccines even work, but it is also a god damn lie that does endanger people's lies. And it is despicable.

Freedom of speech should not extend to people like you who go out and deliberately endanger people's lives through lies and misrepresentations because it suits your fruitcake seeing the boogeyman and flying saucers and ghosts agenda to do so.

Here's the difference between what I've posted and what you've posted. I back up everything I say with evidence. I argue logically and empirically for the freedom to decide for yourself on this issue. You otoh rant and spue insults and ad homs and obscenities full of hatred and the desire to persecute a small minority of parents because they want to protect their kids from getting autism. Hell, now you wanna censor us for even presenting our argument. THAT's the bigot's side. THAT's the side that calls gay people perverts and advocates them being persecuted and jailed for their lifestyle choice. That's the side that says women should be forced to give birth instead of having the choice not to. That the side that says your ethnicity or race makes you a lesser human being who shouldn't have the same freedoms as other people.

Now you're accusing me of all people, a gay man, of promoting unsafe sex. That's a really vile and desperate move on your part. It smacks of the same bigotry that wants to tie gayness to the spread of disease. As if my lifestyle endangers other people because I'm gay. Obviously you have no other argument to make here beyond casting overpersonalized aspersions against anyone who doesn't jump onto your dubious bandwagon of a disease-free utopia. But that's never going to happen. Even if there were no antivaxxers, only 1.5 % of the population, there will always be the 3% who can't vaccinate because of allergies or compromised immune systems. There will always be those who can't vaccinate because they are homeless, or have no access to medical care, or who just aren't informed about the need and timing of vaccines. There will always be the undervaccinated, whose vaccine has worn off. There will always be those spread the illness even though they are vaccinated. There will always be those who get the illness because of vaccine failure (about 3%). And there will always be unvaccinated foreigners visiting our country. So much for your paradise of a measles-free country eh? Deal with it.

We all live with risk in our lives. We make decisions for ourselves and our children weighing one risk against another. If a mother wants to risk her child dying from measles (1 in a 1000 risk) as opposed to him getting autism from a vaccine (1 in 68 risk) who are we to judge her? She made her decision. She will accept the consequences. Such is life.

 

[Bells]

You have backed your argument up by using articles and so called studies by from anti-vaccination sites. Not only that, you have muddied the waters by including reactions to flu vaccines, which have nothing to do with the autism debate and which has absolutely nothing to do with the MMR vaccine. This is such a dishonest and despicable act by you that it does bear mentioning. It is the exact tactic used by anti-scientific anti-vaxxers. Most of your links have been from anti-vaxxer sites and the only scientific links you have managed to actually provide that were not retracted for their misleading and false results and misrepresentations have been about the flue vaccination, which has nothing at all to do with the MMR vaccine or with autism. Hence why your argument is one that hacks use and frankly, because the result is that you and those who think like you, do endanger the lives of people, it borders on the criminal.

I have provided you with links to studies that encompassed millions of children world wide, that clearly show there is no connection between the MMR vaccine and autism. I also provided you with a years long study in Japan, for example, to test the MMR vaccine when it came to autism. MMR was withdrawn - in that for several years, the MMR vaccine was not administered to Japanese children in a whole area in Japan. Autism rates still continued to rise even in children who had not been vaccinated, which clearly showed that the MMR vaccine has absolutely nothing to do with autism.

This study examined cumulative incidence of ASD up to age seven for children born from 1988 to 1996 in Kohoku Ward (population approximately 300,000), Yokohama, Japan. ASD cases included all cases of pervasive developmental disorders according to ICD-10 guidelines. Results: 

The MMR vaccination rate in the city of Yokohama declined significantly in the birth cohorts of years 1988 through 1992, and not a single vaccination was administered in 1993 or thereafter. In contrast, cumulative incidence of ASD up to age seven increased significantly in the birth cohorts of years 1988 through 1996 and most notably rose dramatically beginning with the birth cohort of 1993. Conclusions: 

The significance of this finding is that MMR vaccination is most unlikely to be a main cause of ASD, that it cannot explain the rise over time in the incidence of ASD, and that withdrawal of MMR in countries where it is still being used cannot be expected to lead to a reduction in the incidence of ASD.​

Your response to that was to post more hack so called studies from anti-vaxxer websites and articles you clearly sourced by quote mining from anti-vaxxer websites, where they mixed in influenza vaccine information with the specific intent to misrepresent scientific fact to support their own agenda.

As I have said, the actions of the anti-vaxxers boarders on the criminal because they are literally endangering the lives of children with their crusade. Children are literally dying and are at risk of permanent brain damage as a result and it is god damn criminal. How anyone can defend it, let alone continue to spread their lies under the guise of moronic conspiracy theories is beyond me. My children are healthy, they received all of their vaccinations. Not just for them, but they were vaccinated to ensure those who cannot be vaccinated could be protected. Your dismissal of the thousands of deaths as being unimportant because it wasn't too many American deaths (yet) is despicable and shows just how much you have bought into the whole anti-vaccine movement which centers on that selfish and elitist ideology that now sees a measles outbreak that is out of control because of their actions.

Measles was no longer endemic in the US. It had been eliminated. It is now endemic and you are defending this? Worse yet, you are spreading misinformation and lies which is so dangerous, that people could die if they listen to the absolute bullshit you have spouted here just today alone. You are literally like those backwards witchdoctors who tell people in Africa that ebola is a government conspiracy and false and to ignore it and you are literally like those fuckwits who tell people that AIDS is a manufactured disease and a gay disease, so they do not need to use condoms. That is the level of danger of the ideology you are spreading on this site.

 

[billvon]

LOL! That's what I said.

Good. Then we agree. Would be a good idea to stop with the bullshit reasons, then.

 

[Bells]

Here's the difference between what I've posted and what you've posted. I back up everything I say with evidence. I argue logically and empirically for the freedom to decide for yourself on this issue. You otoh rant and spue insults and ad homs and obscenities full of hatred and the desire to persecute a small minority of parents because they want to protect their kids from getting autism. Hell, now you wanna censor us for even presenting our argument. THAT's the bigot's side. THAT's the side that calls gay people perverts and advocates them being persecuted and jailed for their lifestyle choice. That's the side that says women should be forced to give birth instead of having the choice not to. That the side that says your ethnicity or race makes you a lesser human being who shouldn't have the same freedoms as other people.

Now you're accusing me of all people, a gay man, of promoting unsafe sex. That's a really vile and desperate move on your part. It smacks of the same bigotry that wants to tie gayness to the spread of disease. As if my lifestyle endangers other people because I'm gay. Obviously you have no other argument to make here beyond casting overpersonalized aspersions against anyone who doesn't jump onto your dubious bandwagon of a disease-free utopia. But that's never going to happen. Even if there were no antivaxxers, only 1.5 % of the population, there will always be the 3% who can't vaccinate because of allergies. There will always be those who can't vaccinate because they are homeless, or have no access to medical care, or who just aren't informed about the need and timing of vaccines. There will always be the undervaccinated, whose vaccine has worn off. There will always be those spread the illness even though they are vaccinated. And there will always be unvaccinated foreigners visiting our country. So much for your paradise of a measles-free country eh? Deal with it.

We all live with risk in our lives. We make decisions for ourselves and our children weighing one risk against another. If a mother wants to risk her child dying from measles (1 in a 1000 risk) as opposed to him getting autism from a vaccine (1 in 68 risk) who are we to judge her? She made her decision. She will accept the consequences. Such is life.

Oh look, more misrepresentation and dangerous lies. What a surprise.

Yes, I am accusing you of all people of being exactly like those people who promote unsafe sex. Your actions and the lies and misrepresentations you have spouted in this thread is exactly the same kind of utter crap that they spout. Only you are doing it with measles and vaccines.

I don't give a shit if you are gay or straight. I also said you were exactly like those backwards witchdoctors in Africa who tell people that ebola is not real and to not seek treatment, which has helped ensure that thousands die as a result of the outbreak. You are exactly like those people, but only with measles. Measles is one of the most preventable diseases and you are advocating, through absolute lies, its continued spread.

If you don't like being lumped in with groups who deliberately set out to endanger the lives of people by spreading absolute and unfounded lies, then stop doing it. You are exactly like the people to scream fire in a crowded theater. Lies and the result is endangering the lives of people.

And really, autism from a vaccine is 1 in 68? What in the hell kind of crap are you spouting now? What kind of dangerous ideology are you endangering people with? This is the sort of dangerous lies that makes you like those people. Frankly, if you spout this crap to people, you belong in jail if anyone gets sick if they listen to you. Because it is criminal.

 

[Magical Realist]

You have backed your argument up by using articles and so called studies by from anti-vaccination sites. Not only that, you have muddied the waters by including reactions to flu vaccines, which have nothing to do with the autism debate and which has absolutely nothing to do with the MMR vaccine. This is such a dishonest and despicable act by you that it does bear mentioning. It is the exact tactic used by anti-scientific anti-vaxxers. Most of your links have been from anti-vaxxer sites and the only scientific links you have managed to actually provide that were not retracted for their misleading and false results and misrepresentations have been about the flue vaccination, which has nothing at all to do with the MMR vaccine or with autism. Hence why your argument is one that hacks use and frankly, because the result is that you and those who think like you, do endanger the lives of people, it borders on the criminal.

I have provided you with links to studies that encompassed millions of children world wide, that clearly show there is no connection between the MMR vaccine and autism. I also provided you with a years long study in Japan, for example, to test the MMR vaccine when it came to autism. MMR was withdrawn - in that for several years, the MMR vaccine was not administered to Japanese children in a whole area in Japan. Autism rates still continued to rise even in children who had not been vaccinated, which clearly showed that the MMR vaccine has absolutely nothing to do with autism.

This study examined cumulative incidence of ASD up to age seven for children born from 1988 to 1996 in Kohoku Ward (population approximately 300,000), Yokohama, Japan. ASD cases included all cases of pervasive developmental disorders according to ICD-10 guidelines. Results: 

The MMR vaccination rate in the city of Yokohama declined significantly in the birth cohorts of years 1988 through 1992, and not a single vaccination was administered in 1993 or thereafter. In contrast, cumulative incidence of ASD up to age seven increased significantly in the birth cohorts of years 1988 through 1996 and most notably rose dramatically beginning with the birth cohort of 1993. Conclusions: 

The significance of this finding is that MMR vaccination is most unlikely to be a main cause of ASD, that it cannot explain the rise over time in the incidence of ASD, and that withdrawal of MMR in countries where it is still being used cannot be expected to lead to a reduction in the incidence of ASD.​

Your response to that was to post more hack so called studies from anti-vaxxer websites and articles you clearly sourced by quote mining from anti-vaxxer websites, where they mixed in influenza vaccine information with the specific intent to misrepresent scientific fact to support their own agenda.

As I have said, the actions of the anti-vaxxers boarders on the criminal because they are literally endangering the lives of children with their crusade. Children are literally dying and are at risk of permanent brain damage as a result and it is god damn criminal. How anyone can defend it, let alone continue to spread their lies under the guise of moronic conspiracy theories is beyond me. My children are healthy, they received all of their vaccinations. Not just for them, but they were vaccinated to ensure those who cannot be vaccinated could be protected. Your dismissal of the thousands of deaths as being unimportant because it wasn't too many American deaths (yet) is despicable and shows just how much you have bought into the whole anti-vaccine movement which centers on that selfish and elitist ideology that now sees a measles outbreak that is out of control because of their actions.

Measles was no longer endemic in the US. It had been eliminated. It is now endemic and you are defending this? Worse yet, you are spreading misinformation and lies which is so dangerous, that people could die if they listen to the absolute bullshit you have spouted here just today alone. You are literally like those backwards witchdoctors who tell people in Africa that ebola is a government conspiracy and false and to ignore it and you are literally like those fuckwits who tell people that AIDS is a manufactured disease and a gay disease, so they do not need to use condoms. That is the level of danger of the ideology you are spreading on this site.

No..the studies I've cited were specifically about VACCINES and AUTISM. If a vaccine for influenza is linked to causing autism, that's an argument for my position. What part of this debate don't you get?
Once again, for those who can't refer to the previous posts in this thread, is a list of REAL studies linking vaccines to autism. The links to the actual papers are included for those paranoid about lying antivax websites. Snip the repeated litany of juvenile ad homs and insults. Ooo..you're gonna throw us all in prison now? Right. Let me know how that works out.

http://www.activistpost.com/2013/09/22-medical-studies-that-show-vaccines.html

"Read the links to the right and the fifteen PubMed links below. See what you
think. If you want more, there are many, many more. You can search
PubMed for keywords and read until your eyes are bleary. And it's not just
about autism.

If you have a child with any autoimmune condition: asthma, allergies, pandas,
mitochondria disorder, adhd, diabetes, and so on... sadly, you will find there
are links to vaccines for all types of autoimmune disorders.

Anecdotal no more. You know where to look. Check it out. Pass it on."

http://www.regardingcaroline.com/pubmed

 

[Magical Realist]

"For all those who've declared the autism-vaccine debate over - a new scientific review begs to differ. It considers a host of peer-reviewed, published theories that show possible connections between vaccines and autism.

The article in the Journal of Immunotoxicology is entitled "Theoretical aspects of autism: Causes--A review." The author is Helen Ratajczak, surprisingly herself a former senior scientist at a pharmaceutical firm. Ratajczak did what nobody else apparently has bothered to do: she reviewed the body of published science since autism was first described in 1943. Not just one theory suggested by research such as the role of MMR shots, or the mercury preservative thimerosal; but all of them.



Ratajczak's article states, in part, that "Documented causes of autism include genetic mutations and/or deletions, viral infections, and encephalitis [brain damage] following vaccination [emphasis added]. Therefore, autism is the result of genetic defects and/or inflammation of the brain."



The article goes on to discuss many potential vaccine-related culprits, including the increasing number of vaccines given in a short period of time. "What I have published is highly concentrated on hypersensitivity, Ratajczak told us in an interview, "the body's immune system being thrown out of balance."



University of Pennsylvania's Dr. Brian Strom, who has served on Institute of Medicine panels advising the government on vaccine safety says the prevailing medical opinion is that vaccines are scientifically linked to encephalopathy (brain damage), but not scientifically linked to autism. As for Ratajczak's review, he told us he doesn't find it remarkable. "This is a review of theories. Science is based on facts. To draw conclusions on effects of an exposure on people, you need data on people. The data on people do not support that there is a relationship. As such, any speculation about an explanation for a (non-existing) relationship is irrelevant."

Helen Ratajczak, author "Theoretical aspects of autism: Causes--A review."


Ratajczak also looks at a factor that hasn't been widely discussed: human DNA contained in vaccines. That's right, human DNA. Ratajczak reports that about the same time vaccine makers took most thimerosal out of most vaccines (with the exception of flu shots which still widely contain thimerosal), they began making some vaccines using human tissue. Ratajczak says human tissue is currently used in 23 vaccines. She discusses the increase in autism incidences corresponding with the introduction of human DNA to MMR vaccine, and suggests the two could be linked. Ratajczak also says an additional increased spike in autism occurred in 1995 when chicken pox vaccine was grown in human fetal tissue.



Why could human DNA potentially cause brain damage? The way Ratajczak explained it to me: "Because it's human DNA and recipients are humans, there's homologous recombinaltion tiniker. That DNA is incorporated into the host DNA. Now it's changed, altered self and body kills it. Where is this most expressed? The neurons of the brain. Now you have body killing the brain cells and it's an ongoing inflammation. It doesn't stop, it continues through the life of that individual."



Dr. Strom said he was unaware that human DNA was contained in vaccines but told us, "It does not matter...Even if human DNA were then found in vaccines, it does not mean that they cause autism." Ratajczak agrees that nobody has proven DNA causes autism; but argues nobody has shown the opposite, and scientifically, the case is still open.



A number of independent scientists have said they've been subjected to orchestrated campaigns to discredit them when their research exposed vaccine safety issues, especially if it veered into the topic of autism. We asked Ratajczak how she came to research the controversial topic. She told us that for years while working in the pharmaceutical industry, she was restricted as to what she was allowed to publish. "I'm retired now," she told CBS News. "I can write what I want."



We wanted to see if the CDC wished to challenge Ratajczak's review, since many government officials and scientists have implied that theories linking vaccines to autism have been disproven, and Ratajczak states that research shows otherwise. CDC officials told us that "comprehensive review by CDC...would take quite a bit of time." In the meantime, CDC provided these links:

Interagency Autism Coordination Committee: http://iacc.hhs.gov

Overview of all CDC surveillance and epi work:http://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/autism/research.html

CDC study on risk factors and causes:http://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/autism/seed.html

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/vaccines-and-autism-a-new-scientific-review/

 

[spidergoat]

http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2011/04/05/the-resident-anti-vaccine-reporter-at-cb/
http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/20...e-anti-vaccine-crowd-will-listen-to-anything/

 

[Bells]

No..the studies I've cited were specifically about VACCINES and AUTISM. If a vaccine for influenza is linked to causing autism, that's an argument for my position. What part of this debate don't you get?
Once again, for those who can't refer to the previous posts in this thread, is a list of REAL studies linking vaccines to autism. The links to the actual papers are included for those paranoid about lying antivax websites. Snip the repeated litany of juvenile ad homs and insults. Ooo..you're gonna throw us all in prison now? Right. Let me know how that works out.

http://www.activistpost.com/2013/09/22-medical-studies-that-show-vaccines.html

"Read the links to the right and the fifteen PubMed links below. See what you
think. If you want more, there are many, many more. You can search
PubMed for keywords and read until your eyes are bleary. And it's not just
about autism.

If you have a child with any autoimmune condition: asthma, allergies, pandas,
mitochondria disorder, adhd, diabetes, and so on... sadly, you will find there
are links to vaccines for all types of autoimmune disorders.

Anecdotal no more. You know where to look. Check it out. Pass it on."

http://www.regardingcaroline.com/pubmed

You quote mined from anti vaccine sites. Half of your links aren't even about autism or the MMR vaccine. I and others have provided actual scientific studies. You are posting absolute BS from anti-vaxxers and half of what they are posting have been discredited or retracted because the findings and the studies themselves were fraudulent. Like one you tried to pass of before. Shame the anti-vaxxer site you got that one from didn't tell you it was retracted, huh?

And once again, you are linking from anti-vaccine sites. You are now entering the territory of posting deliberate false lies and misrepresentations that do have a greater repercussion and could result in people dying. Frankly, this makes you a pathetic human being.