Vaccine related autism study?

Magical Realist said:
Interesting chart:

graph_incidence.jpg
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That graph is quite convincing. To a point.
The vital information is missing. What happened after the Thiomersal (mercury) was removed?
If incidence of autism went down to, say, 1980 levels, then it looks like the increase was down to the mercury.

If it was the mercury, they wouldn't admit it.
And if it wasn't the mercury, why did they remove it?

In any case, the mercury is gone.
What are the anti vaccine people saying is causing the trouble now?
 
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Captain Kremmen said:
If it was the mercury, they wouldn't admit it.
And if it wasn't the mercury, why did they remove it?
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Because if you're a public health advocate, and removing the mercury will get more children vaccinated, you'd probably do it. Better for the kids and society as a whole - even if the logic isn't there.
 
"The U.S. government has concluded that childhood vaccines contributed to symptoms of autism in 9-year-old Hannah Poling. The unprecedented concession was in response to one of three test cases that allege the mercury-containing vaccine preservative thimerosal caused autism in children.

According to the case, the child was healthy and developing normally until her 18-month well-baby visit, where she received vaccinations for nine diseases, two of which contained thimerosal. Within 48 hours of the shots, Hannah become ill, refused to walk and could not sleep through the night. Within three months, she began showing signs of autism.

According to U.S. Division of Vaccine Injury Compensation, the shots "significantly aggravated an underlying mitochondrial disorder" and resulted in a brain disorder "with features of autism spectrum disorder."

Although federal officials continue to say there is no link between autism and vaccines, this concession says otherwise.

The U.S. Department of Health and Human Services has determined that Hannah’s family is entitled to compensation from a federal vaccine injury fund in an amount that is still being determined.

There are currently 4,900 autism cases pending in Federal "Vaccine Court."====http://articles.mercola.com/sites/a...ment-concedes-that-mercury-causes-autism.aspx
 
"Millions of flu jabs issued by the Government contain a mercury-based preservative which is being phased out in Europe and the United States amid fears over autism and brain damage.

Four out of seven flu vaccine brands approved for NHS use contain thiomersal, a mercury-containing agent at the centre of safety concerns over its effect on brain function, particularly in children.

Twelve million vulnerable people, including pensioners and children with asthma, cancer, diabetes, heart and kidney problems, have been given flu jabs this winter.

A spokesman for the Department of Health said that medical advisers to the Government were satisfied there is no risk to adults from thiomersal and only a ' hypothetical risk' to children.

'Following recommendations both U.S. and European manufacturers are actively developing research programmes to eliminate, substitute or reduce thiomersal in vaccines,' he said.

' They have not recommended withdrawing any vaccines currently in use. This is purely a precaution.

'There is no convincing evidence of harm to anyone, including infants and pregnant women, caused by small amounts of thiomersal in flu vaccines, and the benefits of flu vaccine outweigh any hypothetical risks posed by thiomersal.'

But Jackie Fletcher of the campaign group JABS, which represents families who claim their children have been damaged by vaccines, said: 'The jury may still be out on the links between mercury in vaccines and brain damage, but surely the Government should err on the side of caution? Thiomersal-free flu jabs are available and people, particularly children, should be offered these.'

Four flu jab brands contain thiomersal, which acts as a preservative to prevent contamination, the Department of Health said yesterday.

They include Fluvirin, manufactured by Liverpool- based Evans Pharmaceuticals, a subsidiary of Powderject Pharmaceuticals, owned by Labour donor Dr Paul Drayson.

The other brands containing thiomersal are Fluarix by GlaxoSmithKline, Influvac by Solvay Health Care and Agrippal by Wyeth.

Mercury-free flu jab brands available on the NHS are Begrivac from Wyeth, Inflexal V distributed by Masta, and Inactivated influenza split virion BP, manufactured by Aventis Pasteur.

In 2001 the European Agency for the Evaluation of Medicinal Products advised doctors to use only vaccines without thiomersal for toddlers and infants, who are thought to be more likely to suffer harm from exposure to mercury.

This followed a 1999 announcement by the U.S. Public Health Service and the American Academy of Pediatrics (AAP) that thiomersal should be reduced or eliminated in vaccines as a precaution.

A study by the American Institute of Medicine concluded that a link between thiomersal in vaccines and neuro- developmental disorders --including autism - was 'biologically plausible'.

In a related U.S. study, researchers found a 'statistically significant' association between thiomersal in vaccines and children with problems such as attention deficit disorder and speech and language learning delays.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/a...-flu-vaccine-linked-autism.html#ixzz3RHBjCVml
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook
 
Magical Realist said:
Good questions. You have to question the party line being pushed by mainstream media and scientists who are both funded by Big Pharma. That there's no correlation between vaccine mercury levels and autism. And yet many studies show otherwise. It wouldn't be the first time science and Big Pharma were in bed together. Remember Thalidomide and the little armless babies? Ofcourse that was back in the 50's, but hey..science majority always rules. Right?
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No legitimate studies conclude that.
 
Captain Kremmen said:
That graph is quite convincing. To a point.
The vital information is missing. What happened after the Thiomersal (mercury) was removed?
If incidence of autism went down to, say, 1980 levels, then it looks like the increase was down to the mercury.

If it was the mercury, they wouldn't admit it.
And if it wasn't the mercury, why did they remove it?

In any case, the mercury is gone.
What are the anti vaccine people saying is causing the trouble now?
Click to expand...

Apparently the mercury was never removed from the vaccines. Many still had it and continue to have it despite the recommendations of the Public Health Dept and the American Pediatric Association. Speculation arises as to WHY the pharmaceuticals won't remove mercury. Would that suddenly prove that mercury WAS causing autism, opening them up to thousands of lawsuits? Maybe so..
 
spidergoat said:
No legitimate studies conclude that.
Click to expand...

I've already cited dozens of legit studies showing a link. Here's another one. If you are claiming these studies are flawed, then show where. Where have they erred?

http://www.cellgevity4life.com/uploads/1/2/4/8/12482920/mercury_and_autism.pdf

Autism is known to lessen the body's ability to detoxify itself. Here's a study showing a correlation between the severity of autism and toxic metal levels in the body.

http://www.safeminds.org/mercury/do...d RBC Glutathione - Jim Adams - 532640.v2.pdf
 
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Magical Realist said:
Apparently the mercury was never removed from the vaccines. Many still had it and continue to have it despite the recommendations of the Public Health Dept and the American Pediatric Association. Speculation arises as to WHY the pharmaceuticals won't remove mercury.
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They have been, from many vaccines. However, some multivalent vaccines continue to use thiomersal since it's more effective for such vaccines.
Would that suddenly prove that mercury WAS causing autism, opening them up to thousands of lawsuits?
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As mentioned, thiomersal has been removed from many vaccines, so that point is a non-starter.
 
billvon said:
They have been, from many vaccines. However, some multivalent vaccines continue to use thiomersal since it's more effective for such vaccines.

As mentioned, thiomersal has been removed from many vaccines, so that point is a non-starter.
Click to expand...

What are the anti vaccine people saying is causing the trouble now?
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Thiomersal was largely replaced with aluminum, which is now being shown by studies to be at toxic levels in autistic children. Strange that they'd replace one toxin with another one just as a preservative.

http://vactruth.com/2014/01/28/toxic-levels-of-aluminum/

http://www.mdpi.com/1099-4300/14/11/2227

http://www.mdpi.com/1660-4601/12/2/1295
 
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Magical Realist said:
According to the case, the child was healthy and developing normally until her 18-month well-baby visit, where she received vaccinations for nine diseases, two of which contained thimerosal. Within 48 hours of the shots, Hannah become ill, refused to walk and could not sleep through the night. Within three months, she began showing signs of autism.
Click to expand...

The child had two doses of Thimerosal on the same day.
(That's the correct name. I called it Thiomersal in my previous post)
The advised limit in food for children under six is 0.31 microgrammes of mercury per month, so she potentially received six times that amount in a single day.
I would have thought that limits for injection into the blood would be lower than for ingestion.
I could be wrong about that.
 
Magical Realist said:
Thiomersal was largely replaced with aluminum, which is now being shown by studies to be at toxic levels in autistic children. Strange that they'd replace one toxin with another one just as a preservative.
Click to expand...
Is this an aluminium salt?
Aluminium salts are generally not particularly toxic.
What compound do they use?

Added later. I've checked. It is a salt.
The amount of aluminium salt would be completely harmless.

Many vaccines contain aluminium salts such as aluminium hydroxide, aluminium phosphate or potassium aluminium sulphate. They act as adjuvants, strengthening and lengthening the immune response to the vaccine. Aluminium salts slow down the release of the active ingredient from the vaccine once it is injected, and stimulate the immune system to respond to the vaccine. They also absorb protein well, and stop the proteins in the vaccine sticking to the walls of a container during storage.

The amount of aluminium present in vaccines is very small (less than 2 milligrams of the salts, and less than a milligram of actual aluminium). After vaccination there is a temporary increase in the amount of aluminium in the body, but this is not a lasting effect.
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http://www.ovg.ox.ac.uk/vaccine-ingredients#aluminium
 
spidergoat said:
http://lizditz.typepad.com/files/g_taylor_list_debunked_v2.0_8_7.pdf
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Just out of curiosity, why do you think the Public Health Dept and the American Pediatric Association recommended the removal of Thimersol from vaccines? What was their reasoning here? Why do you think most pharmaceuticals removed it?

Your so called "debunking" list consists of dismissals because the experiments were done on mice, non-replications, and "nothing to do with vaccines." I don't think that's debunking exactly, as if there was fraud involved. Here's 30 more studies involving autism/vaccine linkage:

http://www.whale.to/v/30_scientific_studies.html
 
Magical Realist said:
Just out of curiosity, why do you think the Public Health Dept and the American Pediatric Association recommended the removal of Thimersol from vaccines? What was their reasoning here? Why do you think most pharmaceuticals removed it?

Your so called "debunking" list consists of dismissals because the experiments were done on mice, non-replications, and "nothing to do with vaccines." I don't think that's debunking exactly, as if there was fraud involved. Here's 30 more studies involving autism/vaccine linkage:

http://www.whale.to/v/30_scientific_studies.html
Click to expand...
I looked at your link, and the first one was debunked already in my link. In fact all studies that have shown a vaccine-autism link have been debunked. ALL of them.
 
Captain Kremmen said:
Is this an aluminium salt?
Aluminium salts are generally not particularly toxic.
What compound do they use?

Added later. I've checked. It is a salt.
The amount of aluminium salt would be completely harmless.
Click to expand...

"The most common adjuvant for human use is an aluminum salt called alum derived from aluminum hydroxide, or aluminum phosphate. A quick read of the scientific literature reveals that the neurotoxic effects of aluminum were recognized 100 years ago. Aluminum is a neurotoxicant and has been linked to Alzheimer’s disease and other neurological disorders. Prior to 1980, kidney patients undergoing long term dialysis treatments often suffered dialysis encephalopathy syndrome, the result of acute intoxication by the use of an aluminium-containing dialysate. This is now avoided using modern techniques of water purification. In pre-term infants, prolonged intravenous feeding with solutions containing aluminum is associated with impaired neurologic development. Scientists speculate that aluminum neurotoxicity may be related to cell damage via free radical production, impairment of glucose metabolism, and effects on nerve signal transduction. (2) Vaccines which contain both aluminum adjuvants and mercury based preservative, greatly magnify the neurotoxic effects. (3)

Macrophagic myofasciitis (MMF) is a muscle disease first identified in 1993, and has been linked to vaccines containing aluminum adjuvants. Muscle pain is the most frequent symptom which can be localized to the limbs or be more diffuse. Other symptoms include joint pain, muscle weakness, fatigue, fever, and muscle tenderness. The disorder is associated with an altered immune system in some, but not all patients. A study published in the journal Brain (2001) revealed that 50 out of 50 patients had received vaccines against hepatitis B virus (86%), hepatitis A virus (19%) or tetanus toxoid (58%), 3-96 months (median 36 months) before biopsy. “We conclude that the MMF lesion is secondary to intramuscular injection of aluminum hydroxide-containing vaccines, shows both long-term persistence of aluminum hydroxide and an ongoing local immune reaction, and is detected in patients with systemic symptoms which appeared subsequently to vaccination”, write the authors of the study. (4)


http://www.ovg.ox.ac.uk/vaccine-ingredients#aluminium[/QUOTE]

Here's an overview of the amount of aluminum that gets into our bodies from all sorts of sources besides vaccines:

http://www.whale.to/a/alum.html
 
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spidergoat said:
I looked at your link, and the first one was debunked already in my link. In fact all studies that have shown a vaccine-autism link have been debunked. ALL of them.
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No they haven't, as if a study done on mice is somehow "debunked". But once again, why do you think Thimerosal was removed from vaccines? What data were they relying on that showed it to be harmful?
 
Magical Realist said:
Just out of curiosity, why do you think the Public Health Dept and the American Pediatric Association recommended the removal of Thimersol from vaccines? What was their reasoning here?
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Because it was reducing the number of children being vaccinated due to superstition.

If most vaccines were purple, and people thought purple vaccines caused AIDS and thus they avoided them, they'd likely change the color as well. Not because the color of the vaccine means a thing, but because the goals of those organizations are the health of children.
 
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