U.F.O.s ?

Zion

I think Kmguru meant an evolutionary path that we haven't percieved (namely a path that we have no data upon).

Although the topic of Perception is something else, as there are thoughts on the possibility that thought can manipulate reality.
(So please be careful what you believe heh)

As for the topic of UFO's, well I've mention in the other thread which I linked my understanding of how to create a UFO phenomona without the need of a craft or alien pilot.

Of course there is another kind of story/conspiracy (That I of course am not stating is a reality)

Imagine a hairless monkey or clone is constructed genetically to act as a biological entity that is placed in use with some frequency equipment. It would be possible to structure that monkey as a neural network junction on an array, and then "Crash land it" at a country to do some "Military reconnaissance" namely it gets mistaken for some alien entity (although it just crashed because it was a glider craft without the ability to power itself.)

Of course the problem with the clone, is that when it's taken into a Faraday cage or Nuclear Bunker it becomes detatched with the force controlling it, which only in the case of the clone would make it die.

I'm not going to ask you to guess about the possibility of where this fictional statement could of occured, although I don't think thats what happened.

Why did I just mention all of this:
Well people hear of an event that has happened or hasn't happened, and they imagine what could of happened, if of course it did happen like how they imagined it does that mean that it was created from just a thought, a frequency?

(This is noticable because if you travelled at light speed you would exist as a frequency, so whats to say something couldn't come into being from being a frequency?)
 
Hi zion,

It is just a speculation, nothing more...not even theories. Say, we have an underground society in MARS for the last 10,000 years, we would not know, would we? If we have beings that are nano size but exist as a collective intelligence, we would not know it for sure. If there are beings live in slightly out of phase to our time line, we would not know except once in a while see them as ghosts. You can come up with own own scenario.

At our present development in science and technology that is growing at an exponential rate, do you think we pretty much filled up the knowledge bank or will we keep discovering new things for the next 10,000 years or 100,000 years or even a million years?

Try to project the exponent for a million years and see what you get.
 
re: intelligence

Tell me what you all class as an intelligent being, every one has some kind of intelligence,are you talking about someone who can do everything with ease.
 
It is just what you call intelligent...

Humans have intelligence, but do not always act that way.

In the case of the existance from Spacecrafts they act rather foolish I think.
There are so very, very much Planets, humans haven't even discovered and then again, it is pretty arrogant of the humans to think they are the only ones in the Universes with intelligence and a way of technology.

There are really too many sightings to ignore them. Perhaps the extraterrestrials have another kind of intelligence, thusfar that they are smart enough to keep away from the great intelligent human world leaders.

Remember that Neptune and Pluto were only discovered in the beginning of 1900 and in, I guess, the 1930's. Not that long ago.

They discovered the so called exo planets circling around a bigger Planet and assume there could be life only by the existance of water and oxigen.
Perhaps the extraterrestrials don't need water and oxigen, but live from a whole different kind of liquid and so on.

Why should it be water under the surface of Mars?
It can be another 'frozen liquid' as well. They only think it must be water, ballanced on what the Earth needs to exist.

Food for thought?

And then again, should the human race not take care first of their fellow humans who are in need and who are dying from starvation in stead of going up in Space with their very expensive inventions?

So what does intelligence mean then exactly...
 
space

We send rockets up into space at a cost of christ no's what,we go looking for other planets we dont even know all there is to know about our own planet, keep the money dont send as many rockets up,and help the human race instead christ it needs it.
 
BLASTOFF, what do you mean exactly with this reply?

Are you trying to be sarcastic or what?

What about this christ crap?

Explanation please...

What does it have to do with UFO's then?:confused:

The question was about intelligence and that is what I replied to...
 
Originally posted by kmguru
It is unfortunate that UFO is defined as alien spaceships.
I just want to point out that UFO is not synonymous with aliens spaceship. It means Unidentified Flying Object. Just because some people assume they're alien ships, doesn't change the meaning of the word.
 
Re: space

Originally posted by BLASTOFF
We send rockets up into space at a cost of christ no's what,we go looking for other planets we dont even know all there is to know about our own planet, keep the money dont send as many rockets up,and help the human race instead christ it needs it.

So, WTF did you select for yourself the name Blastoff? Are you into missles tipped with warheads instead of missiles tipped with spacecraft?

:rolleyes:

:D
 
I mentioned the post I did in another thread again:
http://www.sciforums.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=55570#post55570

I would retype, or cut and paste the exact same information, but since:

1: Cross thread posting is horrid
2: It already exists

There is no point in me doing so, but I do mention that some UFO (Unidentified Flying objects) aren't Unidentified, aren't Flying and aren't objects. (i.e. Holograms or Radar signals matrixing with television/radio/telephone signals)
 
re: rockets in space

Mr G surly even you have to think that spending money on curing illnesses instead sending it into space as much, O i picked the name blastoff because it had to do with sci fi you know space and things/ i did not say stop the things all together but to cut them down a little, and spend more money on medicine and to try to make this world a better place/ just a thought.:eek:
 
Thank you for the reply BLASTOFF.:)

Good to hear we agree at that matter.

As far as UFO's concern, the exactly definition is indeed Unidentified Flying Object, but humans are mostly referring to a Spacecraft as they see strange things in the Sky.

Guess that is the imagination of the human mind and the willing to believe in Alien Spacecrafts.
It is certainly true that most sightings are just sattelites or new aeroplanes, which are kept secret because the great world leaders only want them to be seen (or not) at their wars...

Doesn't take away the encounters some humans have with these strange lights and even see Aliens, so once in a while...

Most of all these encounters occur in Mexico and South America.

Abductions by Aliens I guess is a whole different matter in which I myself have not so much confidence...
 
Originally posted by Alpha
I just want to point out that UFO is not synonymous with aliens spaceship. It means Unidentified Flying Object. Just because some people assume they're alien ships, doesn't change the meaning of the word.

Oh! really....Tell that to people who use word and acronyms such as GAY, BPR, Knowledge Management, ERP, Miss Universe, World this, World that.. I could go on and on and on.....
 
UFOS/ALIENS/ABDUCTIONS

Banshee mentioned abductions,i watched the film fire in the sky which is based on a real life story, about a man being abducted infront of his friends,he was gone for a while and his friends where accused of killing him,they all took a lie detector test,which they passed, when he was found he told of all kinds of different things that had happened to him,he to was given a lie test and he passed, now to pass a lie detector test you have to be telling thetruth fully, or you must have total control over your whole body functions pulse/heart beat and so on, so maybe there is something in this alien abduction thing, as i dont think that there aremany (if any) people that can control there body functions to be able to pass a lie test,every body can control there body functions to a certain degree but to beat a lie test i dont know.:confused:
 
Aww come on BLASTOFF,

few men in a jungle... undergoing halucinations of a weird thing,isnt it plausible.

oh!i almost forget,about the lie detector thing,even i can do that,even you.remember a halucination is always true to a person.he"ll swear to god under hypnosis that he saw those weird things.and it sounds plausible isnt it?
think about it.

bye!
 
Zion, I agree with you.

Abductions, even in company of other humans, are in many cases hallucinations.

A hallucination is something you 'see' and take for reality. So the humans who have hallucinations are convinched it happened like that, so they tell it as the truth if they are tested by a lie-detector.

BLASTOFF, did you ever here about the 'travels' by humans in Spacecrafts who didn't get tested, but came back to Earth one week after they were invited into a Spacecraft, just by invitation of extraterrestrials?

There are documentations of them to be found in books and on the Internet as well. (search engine!)

You always hear and read about the abductions of humans who are rudely taken away by Aliens, and that they are injected with strange stuff and so on. And women who get impregnated with Alien 'sperm' and then later are taken away again so the Aliens can take their baby away because it can't live on Earth.
Perhaps some humans have a very big imagination, when they wake up in the middle of the night and see something strange shining in their window. Then it is not so hard to hallucinate and really believe it happened...

Don't know how to put it in another way...

Yes, there are rare cases of humans who show strange side affects after such abduction, but the human mind can do very strange things to humans and their body if they really are convinched of it. Think of the hypochrondial diseases humans are suffering from. The body reacts on it, like it really is sick, it shows even the symtoms, because the inhabitant of the body 'tells' it to do so...

Try to find out about the more 'normal' contacts and 'travels' from a few humans who have had an invitation to come aboard of an extraterrestrial Spacecraft and who do not have any kind of nasty experience. But information they have...

And there were other humans around also when these humans were invited...

And I can assure you that you can be at the lie-detector and lie to it. Rather easy to do, if you realy are a nasty person with real a nasty inside, you can lie to every one and everything and conviche it/them...

It is only a machine and machines make mistakes. You can make your body so much at ease because you are used to the lies that the lie-detector never will find out...
There is a technique you can learn to make your body act just the way you want it.
And never fear such lie-detoctor, 'cause then it will show.
But you can fool it...
 
There's something worth pondering in this aspect though

Hi everyone,

there is something very weird though .....about abductions....

the consistency of these reports...

even U.F.O.s TAKE A LOOK AT MY POSTING IN Kms thread of past civilization,the references to flying saucers dates back to not just 6000 B.C but it goes untill very-very early period,no i dont believe that U.F.O s are alien in nature,but this has often wondered me,did our ancestors have far more knowledge than us?,the references of U.FOS dates back to 20,000 B.C...in form of petroglyphs in france,other European parts...
we can agree that U.F.Os seen U.S or any other developed part of world are nothing but tests of the advanced machinery but what about these sightings...
take for instance in one of the petroglyphs,a flying saucer is shown and there is an arrow pointing towards cattles specifically...

i dont know its all so confusing...i got confused specifically writing my posts about vimanas in Kms thread...specially those biblical references about clouds sucking and taking the sacrifice with it,star showing people path...ramayana refernces,mahabharata references about the flying saucers...is quite similiar to modern day abduction scenarios.although it is impossible to verify such reports but consistency does hold ground...

perhaps a desperate attempt of ignoring this aspect will be that people were making stories for excitment,or may be they were looking for limelight,publicity etc...

bye!
 
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U.F.O & me.F.O

Hey everyone

well you all had your turn so i figured i'd have mine, lol

I've read what you all have written and i believe some of you have some valid points, both for and against the existance of UFO and Alien Lifeforms etc.

However, I would like to make a statement of opinon,

Only human arrogance would allow and expect us as intelligent beings to disregard, and deny the possiblility at least , that extra terestrial life forms do exist, after all we came into being, so why couldnt another race of beings have done the same somewhere in this so far relatively uncharted universe.

Im not saying i believe everything i hear or see about so called aliens and UFO's , but ive seen enough thru my life to sit up and at least admit the definate possiblity.


Is the moon sterile? if not that would prove the existance of an alien life form, (intelligent or not)

As for an intelligent race that maybe evolved billions of years before us somewhere in the reaches of space, wouldnt it seem possible at least that this race has technologically advanced to a point that we couldnt even begin to imagine let alone believe.

Wasn't that long ago that we burnt people at the stake, calling them devils and witches for experimenting with crude forms of penicilan and other herbs, people were executed in some cultures for writing etc.

but now we look at penicilan as just another drug nothing important, and writing is an expected ability in todays western cultures.

In early1900's do you think people would have believed that we would fly to the moon or perform heart transplants, fly around the world in a jumbo jet , even television would have seemed so far fetched.

We are advancing at a phenominal rate, technology breeds technology and speeds its invention, kinda like a snowball effect, so once again, if aliens did exist and they did appear billions of years before us , dont you think their technology would be awsome in comparison with ours?
Look at what we have acheived in the last 100 years alone, imagine what we will acheive if we survive another billion years.

We have spaceships painted on primative cave walls, we have runways that were built in stone thousands of years ago, we have millions of people sighting UFO's and apparently undergoing abductions world wide.

The best place to hide something is in plain site I say,
for it is human nature to distrust and disbelieve and overlook the obvious.

open your eyes and at least admit it possible that humans are not the centre of the universe and quite possibly not alone.
...................................................................................................

you can check out some interesting De-Classified information at
www.blackvault.com.
 
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Hi razz,

Some of us agree with you. The problem is that whatever these UFOs are, we do not have enough information to judge one way or another. So any speculation can not be verified by way of any sensor data or physical evidence that you can touch and feel or show and tell.

So, we still speculate...until such time as our understanding of the world around us improves to the point we can figure out what they are, or if they are our figments of imagination.

That is why, the best approach is to speculate in a specific direction and see if we can obtain proof in that direction. Without proof, that direction does not lead us anywhere. In this forum, we can speculate areas that we may not have developed technology but someday we can and therefore we can get proof at that time.

So, you are welcome to speculate what they are and how you are going to prove for that specific theory. For example:

UFOs are crafts from another dimension. Well, not until recently, we could not even think, there could be other dimensions. Now the problem is what method one would use to travel to or through other dimensions? Could it be that to go from one universe to another, one must travel through a path that takes you through our solar system? and so on....
 
you Know Razz ihave been thinking about the same thing,it cant be that thousands of people through all these years who have expressed what arial activity they saw via potraits,petroglyphs,wall carvings are either uniformly lying or crazy.there is SOME truth to it.like for example Vimanas.

bye!
 
40 Questions For Scientists Who Care About Truth...

40 Questions for Scientists Who Care About Truth
By Joe Firmage

1.What are the implications of physicists' realization that
"space-time" is not a void, but is rather an ocean-like medium of
energy? (1)

2. Are scientists and journalists aware of new, broadly-published,
peer-reviewed theories of the nature of gravitation and inertia meeting every experimental test of general relativity, yet in principle allowing super-luminal motion of gravity-propelled spacecraft without time
dilation? (2)

3. If scientific papers speculating on time travel, worm holes, and
'many universes' are greeted by the press with respectful wonder and awe, why are scientific papers speculating on notions far less exotic - propulsion systems not requiring that we shoot matter out of a nozzle - greeted with skeptical disdain, especially when no empirical data exist to support the former, while much exists to support the latter?

4. Are scientists and journalists aware that much of the research staff on a pivotal government-funded study of UFO evidence - the Condon Committee - resigned or were fired when they challenged its director's intention to report a pre-ordained conclusion that all UFO sightings can be explained in mundane terms? (3)

5. Are scientists and journalists aware that the chief scientific consultant in the Air Force's Blue Book study of UFOs later
characterized the project as a publicity maneuver to mollify the public, himself convinced by the evidence he saw that genuine, unexplained aerospatial phenomena are in our midst? (4)

6. Are you aware that reports of these two government-funded,
now-discredited studies - the Condon Committee and Project Blue Book - are the primary reasons why most scientists and journalists have dismissed UFO evidence as pseudoscience? (5)

7. Are scientists and journalists aware that hundreds of thoroughly credentialed pilots and military officers have officially documented sightings of structured craft demonstrating motions possible only through gravitational propulsion, and that some of these sightings are accompanied by radar records? (6)

8. Are scientists and journalists aware that hundreds of thousands of similar sightings have been made by people around the world, dating back thousands of years? (7)

9. Why have U.S. intelligence agencies refused an official request
by the Federation of American Scientists to release their budgets for the years 1947 through 1970? (8)

10. May there have been a larger reason than Cold War fears driving the establishment in 1947 of the National Security Act, the CIA, and the Air Force?

11. Why were administrative and communications records from the Roswell Army Air Force Base covering the period 1945-1949 destroyed without explanation? (9)

12. Why did defense contractors' ubiquitous predictions in the 1950s of the emergence of gravitational propulsion systems suddenly go quiet? (10)

13. Why did the National Security Agency and partner organizations secretly begin tapping land-line phone conversations world-wide by the 1950s, expanding the capability in recent decades to include most satellite communications? (11)

14. Why did President Eisenhower, in his nationally televised
farewell address, bluntly warn his fellow citizens of the "potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power", sought or unsought, by the military-industrial complex? (12)

15. Are scientists and journalists aware that, on November 12, 1963, President Kennedy issued National Security Action Memorandum 271 directing NASA to begin preparations for a joint space program with the Soviet Union? (13)

16. Are scientists and journalists aware that among thousands of pages of allegedly-authentic leaked classified documents relating to UFOs is a purported memorandum from President Kennedy, also dated November 12, 1963, directing the intelligence community to begin sharing classified UFO files with NASA in preparation for a joint US-USSR space program? (14)

17. Are scientists and journalists aware that perhaps history's most quoted and respected debunker of UFO sightings, Harvard astronomer Dr. Donald Menzel, was in fact a consultant with Top Secret Ultra clearance to the National Security Agency? (15)

18. Why did President Reagan mention the hypothetical scenario of an extraterrestrial presence around Earth in several of his most important speeches, including to the United Nations? (16)

19. May there be a deeper reason explaining why President Bush is so adamant about fielding a new defense shield against '21st century threats from rogue objects in the air and space'?

20. Why has President Bush ordered that presidential papers
following the Carter administration may be concealed from our democracy forever? (17)

21. When the vast majority of U.S. advanced physics research has been funded by the military-industrial complex, what discoveries may have been concealed long ago under the premise of National Security?

22. Are you aware that former leading officials of the French Air
Force and Space Agency published a report in the summer of 2000 stating their appraisal that some UFOs are likely spacecraft of extraterrestrial origin, and that the U.S. probably has come into possession of extraterrestrial craft? (18)

23. Are you aware that prominent U.S. physicists have begun to come out in support of the likelihood that some fraction of UFO sightings do indeed identify spacecraft of extraterrestrial origin? (19)

24. Are you aware that the Aerospace Editor for Jane's Defense
Weekly - among the world's most respected defense analysis journals - publicly released less than 90 days ago the following conclusion after ten years of research: the U.S. military has likely been experimenting with gravitational propulsion systems for many decades? (20)

25. If the music industry can align all powers in its possession to
obliterate Napster's liberation of songs, what might vastly larger
interests have done with energy and propulsion technology that would liberate electricity and transportation. And global politics?

26. How might human civilization have (d)evolved if Faraday's
discovery of the principle of induction was made not in the public
domain, but in a secured facility, deemed a "national security threat" by virtue of its power to revolutionize steam locomotion and oil-based lighting infrastructure, and kept secret for half a century?

27. If there is a world-changing secret buried within our National Security State, which dynastic interests most likely govern it today?

28. If the massive National Security Agency and National
Reconnaissance Office were kept entirely secret for decades, is it
possible that other large, classified programs remain largely unknown to Congress and the public?

29. Are you aware of the lengths to which the
military-industrial-intelligence community could go to prevent
revelation of world-changing knowledge, if such knowledge would thoroughly challenge its power structure, and if there are indeed severe risks of misuse of resulting technology? (21)

30. Do you believe that the revelation of past contact with
extraterrestrial life forms could profoundly transform our world for the better, giving us all an inspiring, unifying perspective of the grandeur of the Cosmos from which we spring, and pointing to new technologies that could dramatically reduce humanity's environmental footprint on Nature?

31. For how long will scientists and journalists continue to be
happy with spoon-fed denials by officials of any significance to the following documented quotes? (22)

32. Will the community of scientists - stewards of humanity's
wisdom, knowledge, history and future - look away in denial of overwhelming evidence that the Cold War's capitalist-military-intelligence complex has managed the epochal process of CONTACT for at least a half-century under cover?

33. How properly could such a singular process have been conducted, deprived for at least five decades of the diverse wisdom, knowledge and perspective of millions of philosophers, cosmologists, physicists, chemists, biologists, anthropologists, sociologists, psychologists, engineers, ethicists, historians, journalists, artists and scholars of religion?

34. If a vital truth of our very Nature has been concealed from us, may that in part explain humanity's continuing struggles with religious, political, economic, technological, and psychological adolescence - consequences of the lingering imposition of a flat-earth worldview?

35. If governments were to grant relief of security oaths relating to information on UFOs, call for witnesses to step forward and see no witnesses forthcoming, then wouldn't the question of government cover-up be put to rest succinctly?

36. If, on the other hand, governments were to refuse to offer
relief of security oaths relating to information on UFOs or refuse to call for witnesses to step forward, then what may we conclude?

37. When will we band together, demanding relief of security oaths for those with first-hand knowledge to testify in open hearings before the United States Congress and the people of Earth?

38. Do we or do we not have both the right and need to learn the truth of our Nature?

This leads me to ask two final questions.

Leaders, scientists and journalists, I ask you:

Is "Know Thyself" to be limited by the rule of secret councils of the capitalist-military-intelligence complex?

Have you read Rich Dolan's masterpiece of journalism: UFOs and the National Security State?

Joseph P. Firmage November 22, 2001
1. For an overview and references, see
http://motionsciences.org/research
2. For an overview and references, see
http://motionsciences.org/research
3. Dolan, R., UFOs and the National Security State, p. 428-440
4. Dr. J. Allen Hynek on camera shortly before his death in 1985
5. Dolan, R., UFOs and the National Security State, p. 456
6. Dolan, R., UFOs and the National Security State, p. 493-499
7. Thompson, R. Alien Identities, Govardhan Hill, 1995
8. http://www.fas.org/sgp/news/2000/12/ciaig.html
9. Dolan, R., UFOs and the National Security State, p. 58-59
10. Cook, N. The Hunt For Zero Point, 2001, available at
http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/0712669531/ref=ed_art_210370_ri_1/026-3124455-2734855
11. Dolan, R., UFOs and the National Security State, p. 274; see also
http://www.echelonwatch.org/
12. See transcript at
http://www.ukans.edu/carrie/docs/texts/ddefarew.html
13. See official archive at http://www.jfklibrary.org/nsam271.htm
14. These and other controversial documents can be examined at
http://majesticdocuments.com/documents.html
15. Letter from Menzel to JFK, 1960; Friedman, S. Final Report on
Operation Majestic 12, 1990
16. See http://www.isso.org/inbox/ubd/quote/quogov.htm
17. See http://www.msnbc.com/local/wrc/nbcl3ptdltc.asp
18. See http://www.cufos.org/cometa.html
19. Listen to Dr. Michio Kaku's remarks at
http://abcnews.go.com/onair/correspondents/wallace/internetexpose/#abc ;
see also H. E. Puthoff, SETI, The Velocity-of-Light Limitation, and the Alcubierre Warp Drive: An Integrating Overview, Physics Essays 9, 156 (1996), online at http://earthtech.org/publications/
20. Cook, N. The Hunt For Zero Point, 2001, available at
http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/0712669531/ref=ed_art_210370_ri_1/0
26-3124455-2734855
21. Evaluate Weiner, T. Blank Check, 1991, and Bamford, J. Body of Secrets, 2001
22. These and other important quotes can be found at
http://www.isso.org/inbox/ubd/quote/quogov.htm
23. See
http://www.enn.com/ennfeaturesarchive/1998/09/091698/fea0916_23526.asp

24. See
http://www.cnn.com/2001/WORLD/asiapcf/central/11/10/china.WTO/index.html

SCIENTISTS AND OTHER MEMBERS AT SCIFORUMS...Waiting for an answer.:)
Every one of the 40 questions. Answer them well.:rolleyes:

Thank you so much...
 
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