kx000
Valued Senior Member
That plain makes no sense to me.
'There is no God' - Rational, logical, justifiable?
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That plain makes no sense to me.
Just try to understand God, religion, angels, devils, sin, good acts, Goa at prime & gross level---means basics of sprituals by discuusions at following link:-
http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=206010
Just ignore the odds, since scepticision can make people to dout & aurge.
Good luck.
That's the whole point.
@ Knowledge please watch this video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KayBys8gaJY
Neither from nothing nor stuff forever seem to make sense at first glance, yet one must be true, so… one of them is the answer, and neither one is 'God'; thus, no 'God'. The end. Finis.
kx000
Valued Senior Member
Ok. Im agnostic, and I have faith in God. I do believe he is real, so I am searching for this proof, but consider who God is. Its not exactly like were lacking technology to search for him. We're looking for something with no equal except everything good & evil plus God himself. We can not expect to find something so powerful with simple observation, excavation, and historical investigation. He can be hiding in plain sight, not behind the bush, but as the bush. If he has reason to stay out of the way, he will stay out of the way.
What reason would he have to let us kill each other, instead of him saving us all right now?
We should open a investigation into the faithful of God. Test them on things from morality, to wisdom. Also, we must come up with a test to test faith, and test to tell deception. I pull an atheist can be a faithful as well.
kx000
Valued Senior Member
The universe going on forever makes sense. Eventually you get sucked into the vacuum, but maybe there is a little center to the universe in which "nothing" once existed.
So were totally cool with believing in NOTHING, over something all powerful existing?
Don't worry, it didn't exist long. In fact, the notion of time didn't exist when there was nothing.
The universe may go on a long time, dispersing, over trillions upon trillions of years, the remaining photons ending up so far apart that they are nowhere near each other. And so this is what our beginnings meant, which is not much.
No choice on the NOTHING. No contest. No way around it. Emotion can try to still have it, but that is just a comfort, not a bill of goods.
All Powerful is out, a zillion times over. We may become more intelligent in the future. Knowledge91 may go on to Knowledge999…
It requires nothing prior, which you could take two ways.
Yes, I absolutely agree with you. Also as a conscious people, we should try to know true. I always believe that everything is controlled by supreme power. From my life experience, I can feel that how powerless we are, we are like a insect.
Ex Nihilo:
The Real Book of Genesis
The Real Book of Genesis
1 First, as ever and always, nothing made the heavens and the Earth, since there was nothing to make it of. Technically, nothing made the teeny-tiny secondary ‘elementals’, as opposite pairs, before their subsequent combinations, which then went on to form higher complexities, even us.
2 The Earth was once without form, and void [zilch], and darkness was upon the face of the deep; and the spirit of nothing was moving over the face of the waters. Hey, what waters? Water came later. No waters.
3 And not a thing said, “Let there be light”, and there were photons, and a big electric bill, too. And then as well came forth electrons, quarks, and their anti-particles of opposite matter and charge, ever still summing to the sum-thing zero-balance of nothing. OK, now we’re cooking.
4 And nullity saw that the light was good; and nil separated all the more the light from the darkness in equipoise of positive and negative.
5 Zero called the light day, and the darkness it called night. And there was evening and there was morning, one fine day, and even an afternoon. It was Oneday. Yes, even out in space.
6 And void said, “Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it separate the waters from the waters.” The “waters” must have been mirages, for there weren’t no waters before all, nohow, no way.
7 And naught made the firmament and separated the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament. And it was so. Water, water not everywhere, nor any drops to drink!
8 And zip called the firmament Heaven. And there was evening and there was morning, a second day, plus a yesterday and a tomorrow to come. It was Twosday.
9 And nada said, “Let the waters under the heavens be gathered together into one place, and let the dry land appear.” And it was so. Finally, water was in its proper place, as really having become of H2O.
10 Diddly-squat called the dry land earth, and the waters that were gathered together it called seas. And nobody saw that it was good.
11 And not anything said, “Let the earth put forth vegetation, plants yielding seed, and fruit trees bearing fruit in which is their seed, each according to its kind, upon the earth, plus very many weeds.” And it was so.
12 The earth brought forth vegetation, plants yielding seed according to their own kinds, and trees bearing fruit in which is their seed, each according to its kind. Duh, that was expected. And trifle saw that it was good. Um, wait, there was evolution.
13 And there was evening and there was morning, a third day. OK already; we get the day to day thing. It was Wedding-day.
14 And no big deal said, “Let there be lights in the firmament of the heavens to separate the day from the night; and let them be for signs and for seasons and for days and years and weeks and months and seasons and years and millennia and eternity.”
15 “And let there be lights in the firmament of the heavens to give light upon the earth.” And it was so. Actually, protons made the stars.
16 And neither here nor there made the two great lights, the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night. This was before Thomas Edison invented the light bulb.
17 And nonentity set them in the firmament of the heavens to give light upon the earth, meaning that they really slowly formed—
18 To rule over the day and over the night, and to separate the light from the darkness. And no-name saw that it was good. Alright, let’s get on with it already.
19 And there was evening and there was morning, a fourth day. Cripes! Sure Happy It’s Thursday, or Thirstday.
20 And God Damnit Nothing said, “Let the waters bring forth swarms of living creatures, even mosquitoes, I guess, and let birds fly above the earth across the firmament of the heavens.” So immutable! Evolution, remember?
21 So nonperson created the great sea monsters and every living creature that moves, with which the waters swarm, according to their kinds, and every winged bird according to its kind. And Lloyd saw that it was good.
22 And nothing blessed them, saying, “Be fruitful and multiply and fill the waters in the seas, and let birds multiply on the Earth.”
23 And there was evening and there was morning, a fifth day. Thank God It’s Friday, or Fryday.
24 And positive/negative said, “Let the earth bring forth living creatures according to their kinds: cattle and creeping things and beasts of the earth according to their kinds.” Dinosaurs were not known of. And it was so. What a zoo.
25 And lack of anything made the beasts of the Earth according to their kinds and the cattle according to their kinds, and everything that creeps upon the ground according to its kind. And zippo saw that it was really getting darned good, although getting really crowded.
26 Then yin/yang said, to his wife? “Let us make man in our image, after our likeness; (bad move) and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creeps upon the earth.” Hmmm… the poor subservient animals and the environment.
27 So love (zero in tennis) created man in his own image, in the image of empty he created him; male and female, and gays and lesbians he created them. Is that “own image” why we are so flawed?
28 And vacant blessed them, while unoccupied said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply, and fill the earth and subdue it; (so much for the environment again) and have dominion over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the air and over every living thing that moves upon the earth.” Maybe humans should use birth control and mostly multiply with calculators?
29 And bare said, “Behold, I have given you every plant yielding seed which is upon the face of all the earth, and every tree with seed in its fruit; you shall have them for food.”
30 And to every beast of the earth, and to every bird of the air, and to everything that creeps on the earth, everything that has the breath of life, I have given every green plant for food.” And it was so. Just like that?
31 And clear saw everything that he had made, and behold, it was very damned good. And there was evening and there was morning, a sixth day. Sitting day, or Satday.
kx000
Valued Senior Member
So we fazed in from absolutely nothing? You must be a Christian.
Previous somethings perhaps. Not sure how nothing requires an explanation.
kx000
Valued Senior Member
Im not sure how nothing has the necessary ingredients to create say... water?
That's because you only see water, not anti-water. Matter and anti-matter can react and cancel each other out, leaving only energy. Run that in reverse, and from nothing you get both.
kx000
Valued Senior Member
You bring up good points. You can't fathom yet why these things have to happen in nature. However, God is not a car. Christians bought and sold him like one, but there is a scientific approach to God. Maybe the point is to build our own car, and apply it. Maybe God isn't a car, but he built one and its parked in his garage? Surly you can imagine how God has the cloak of invisibility. Once we build our own car to show with his car, then we truly are worthy, no questions asked. Thats why we don't know?
Absolutely. No.
The Bible has two versions of Genesis, and so I have another one, too:
Genesis Version 2
1 Thus the heavens and the Earth were finished, and all the host of them.
2 And on the seventh day hollow finished his work which it had done, and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which it had done. (redundant and repetitious) Sundae on Sunday.
3 So idle blessed the seventh day and hallowed it, because on it nugatory rested from all the work which it had done in creation.
4 These are the generations of the heavens and the Earth when they were created. In the day that the lord worthless made the Earth and the heavens. I think we said that before.
5 When no plant of the field was yet in the earth and no herb of the field had yet sprung up, for the lord useless had not caused it to rain upon the earth, and there was no man to till the ground;
6 But a mist went up from the earth from a big sprinkler and watered the whole face of the ground—
7 Then the lord insubstantial formed man of dust from the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living being. Yeah, sure. Forgetting evolution again?
8 And the lord pointless planted a garden in Eden, in the east; and there he put the man whom he had formed.
9 And out of the ground the lord worthless made to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight and good for food, the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the apple tree of the knowledge of good and evil.
10 A river flowed out of Eden to water the garden, and there it divided and became four rivers.
11 the name of the first is Pishon; it is the one which flows around the whole land of Havilah, where there is gold; (Yukon, Alaska, California?)
12 And the gold of that land is good; bdellium and onyx stone are there.
13 The name of the second river is Gihon; it is the one which flows around the whole land of Cush.
14 And the name of the third river is Tigris, which flows east of Assyria. And the fourth river is the Euphrates.
15 The lord meaningless took the man and put him in the garden of Eden to till it and keep it. Poor choice.
16 And the lord valueless commanded the man, saying, “you may freely eat of every tree of the garden;
17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall die.”
18 Then the lord barren said, “It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him a helper fit for him.” Does she paint ceilings and cut the grass?
19 So out of the ground the lord insignificant formed every beast of the field and every bird of the air, and brought them to the man to see what he would call them; (Rover, Lady, Buddy, and Spot) And whatever the man called every living creature, that was its name. (Hey, you!)
20 The man gave names to all cattle, (Elsie) and to the birds of the air, (birds) and to every beast of the field; (it) but for the man there was not found a helper fit for him. Hard to get good help these days.
21 So the lord inconsequential caused a deep sleep to fall upon the man, and while he slept took one of his ribs and closed up its place with flesh; She would really cost the man an arm and a leg eventually.
22 And the rib which the lord trivial had taken from the man he made into a woman and brought her to the man. Some helper!
23 Then the man said, “wo, man, this at last is bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh; she shall be called woman, because she was taken out of man.”
24 Therefore a man leaves his father and his mother and cleaves to his wife, and they become one flesh. Get lost in-laws! Now you are out-laws.
25 And the man and his wife were both naked, (yes!) and were not ashamed.
…
99. And that’s the story of deadpan and absent, whose middle name is nothing.
Let’s leave it at ‘naked’.