THEORY of gravity

a_ht said:
.... is only a theory, yet is presented as fact in our children's classrooms.
Click to expand...
Gravity IS a fact.
There are theories of gravity that try to describe how gravity works, how and why it operates as it does - but GRAVITY is a FACT.

People need to understand the difference between the FACT of Gravity and the THEORIES of Gravity.
The FACT is what is observed.
The THEORY is what people have put together to try to explain the mechanics behind the observation.

This is the same difference (between the FACT and the THEORY) that exists between the FACT and THEORIES of EVOLUTION.

It is when people confuse the fact with the theories that you get misunderstandings such as in the original post.
 
SuperL said:
So, how are science and religion compatible again?
Click to expand...

True science is truth, and it is true that life is able to adapt to changes in nature as Darwin said. Jesus said you will know the truth and it will set you free. He said truth isn't something to be afraid of. We will never know all of it as long as we are alive.

For a person of faith (like me) there are stumbling blocks along the way. I, for example, could not understand how there could be plants in Genesis Chapter 1 before the sun existed, assuming "a day" in Genesis is like millions of years. However, there was light according to Genesis 1, therefore the plants could have existed anyway.

Another interesting piece of information concerns the earth's atmosphere in Genesis. It was not the same as it is today. According to Genesis there was no rain, but daily the earth was watered by a mist. The earth's atmosphere must have been much thicker than it is today because of the water vapor. It has been proposed by some, that this would filter harmful radiation from the sun and slow down the aging process -- bad news for sun bathers I suppose :)

Also, this would act as an insulation blanket around the earth, shielding it from radiation losses at night. It's conceivable that the polar regions would be somewhat tropical under this scenario, and the sea level was considerably different.

Religion seeks power for its leaders, and pacification of its followers.
Click to expand...

Yes indeed, how sadly true this is. For this reason, Jesus was crucified by the pharisees. They liked their power, and they didn't like Jesus taking their followers away from them. This reduced their income and their control. The catholic church repeated this mistake with the grand inquisition. The Jesus in the bible hated religion more than you do. He called it a trap.

Here is an interesting what-if scenario:

What-if man evolved to be in the image of God? This would answer a a question that has perplexed theologians for centuries -- Who did Adam's children marry?

Perhaps God created Adam and Eve as living souls, and their offspring became hybrids with the evolved form of mankind that did not have a soul, the result being humanity as we have it today.

This would not be so far-fetched an idea because Jesus is considered (by believers) to be a hybrid between God and man, or God-man as it were, through immaculate conception.

This proposition is getting interesting because there are actually two accounts of the creation of man in Genesis: Genesis 1:27 and Genesis 2:7.
I never understood the biblical account concerning God's creation of man before the end of the seventh day, then he rested, and then created man a second time -- or was this a redundant account of the first creation? The first type of man appears to be a hunter the second one, Adam, tilled the earth through cultivation.
 
Last edited:
The thing about Christians, is that they pretty much discount science at every turn, unless they can scrape the barrell of science to somehow support their dellusions (which they always fail).

What-if man evolved to be in the image of God? This would answer a a question that has perplexed theologians for centuries -- Who did Adam's children marry?
Click to expand...

What about the theoretical alien that is much more intelligent than us? Wouldn't they be offended that you think God made humans in his image?Adam never existed, he is a character in a story.
 
Woody, you're engaging in rampant speculation solely to justify a centuries-old book written by scientific illiterates. We don't have to do that nowadays. Our knowledge of Earth's ancient past is derived from the study of actual evidence - not the twisting and liberal interpretation of archaic allegorical texts.
 
Kenny JC says:
What about the theoretical alien that is much more intelligent than us? Wouldn't they be offended that you think God made humans in his image?Adam never existed, he is a character in a story.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure what you mean. If they cared what we thought then they would leave us their version of the bible. Perhaps we could call it the "Alien Bible." :)

The thing about Christians, is that they pretty much discount science at every turn, unless they can scrape the barrell of science to somehow support their dellusions (which they always fail).
Click to expand...

Nope, I find it interesting that evolution confirms the bible at every turn. Look at the order in which life was created and where it came from. For example how did birds come from the sea? Most evolutionists agree that many land animals evolved from sea animals.

The bible says God looked at his creation and saw it was good, and I must agree it is really good that life can adapt the way Darwin said. I feel great about it. How about you? :D

This keeps getting more interesting.
 
Last edited:
The Devil Inside said:
woody,
christ was not crucified by jews. the romans did it.
learn your religion before you spew it at us.
Click to expand...

The pharisees set him (Jesus) up for it and persuaded Pontious Pilate to exectute the crucifiction order. As I recall from reading the scriptures, they first sought to kill him when Jesus healed a man on the sabbath, and violated their view of the Mossaic Law (Ten Commandments). They also paid Judas 40 pieces of silver to betray Jesus and deliver him for an inquistion before the Sanhedrien which ultimately lead to His death, along with the other activities they planned out. I can't fully fault Pontious Pilate. He was willing to release Jesus, but feared he would lose his political authority if he did not go along with the Pharisees. It was blackmail.
 
It's more that you can interpret the Bible in ways that agree with the facts once you know what the facts are. The people originally reading the Bible thought the world was flat, sun went around the earth, etc.
 
1. it was 30 pieces paid to judas.
2. pilate had him crucified.
3. "the passion of the christ" is not an accurate movie to base your assertions on. my entire adult life has been dedicated to studying these subjects, and by your own admission, you are a fairly new christian.
dont talk about things you dont know about. you give the rest of the religious folks on this board a bad name.

please, do not associate me with this idiot, fellow sciforums folks.
 
The Devil Inside said:
1. it was 30 pieces paid to judas.
2. pilate had him crucified.
3. "the passion of the christ" is not an accurate movie to base your assertions on. my entire adult life has been dedicated to studying these subjects, and by your own admission, you are a fairly new christian.
dont talk about things you dont know about. you give the rest of the religious folks on this board a bad name.

please, do not associate me with this idiot, fellow sciforums folks.
Click to expand...
You are correct about the amount of money but he was right in the rest of what he presented. Pilate followed the custom of allowing one man to go free and suggested it be Jesus. The crowd, however, insisted he be the one put to death. And that was at the urgings of of the priests and the pharisees.
 
Woody said:
it's not an either or proposition. The bible and evolution are compatible. Does this sound like heresy?

Your view creates a division, you need to find common ground, if you can't then don't burn the bridge.
Click to expand...

the bible and evolution are inherently incompatible. you do not need to find common ground, you need to discard irrationality and embrace reason before God's people destroy our world with their foolish bickering idiocy.
 
Light said:
You are correct about the amount of money but he was right in the rest of what he presented. Pilate followed the custom of allowing one man to go free and suggested it be Jesus. The crowd, however, insisted he be the one put to death. And that was at the urgings of of the priests and the pharisees.
Click to expand...

that is not true. he was right in terms of biblical fiction, but there is not much support for that being the real state of affairs. there is little or no evidence that the romans ever adopted a custom of allowing one person to go free. in fact, historical evidence is against this being anywhere near likely since directly before this incident Pilate was informed by his superiors that if he did not quell the growing insurgency in the lands under his governorship, that he would be recalled to Rome in disgrace. because jesus was a causal element at the center of a popular uprising, Pilate would have been out to crucify him no matter what. in addition to that, the Pharisees were allowed to prosecute violators of religious law themselves, and to dole out their own types of punishments. the Sanhedrin would typically meet to decide the fates of people accused of such transgressions, and when a death sentence was carried out, it was death by stoning. in order to have been brought before the romans, jesus would have had to have broken secular roman law, and there is no indication whatsoever in the movie or in the bible that he did that. crucifixion was a specifically roman punishment reserved for breakers of roman laws.
 
Woody:

According to Genesis there was no rain, but daily the earth was watered by a mist. The earth's atmosphere must have been much thicker than it is today because of the water vapor.
Click to expand...

A mist. I've read genesis several times and I don't remember mists being mentioned. Could you please tell me which passages explain this?

And your speculation about the early atmosphere is interesting. The best way to learn about the early atmosphere is through examining the chemical signatures and isotopic abundances in ancient rocks (dated with radioisotope analysis) and by studying the types of gasses present in preserved objects from the formation of the solar system, such as comets and asteroids. All of this takes a lot of science. What more can you learn from the bible about the nature of earth's early atmosphere?
 
superluminal said:
Woody:

A mist. I've read genesis several times and I don't remember mists being mentioned. Could you please tell me which passages explain this?

And your speculation about the early atmosphere is interesting. The best way to learn about the early atmosphere is through examining the chemical signatures and isotopic abundances in ancient rocks (dated with radioisotope analysis) and by studying the types of gasses present in preserved objects from the formation of the solar system, such as comets and asteroids. All of this takes a lot of science. What more can you learn from the bible about the nature of earth's early atmosphere?
Click to expand...

Ok here's the verse:

Gen 2:4-6 These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens, And every plant of the field before it was in the earth, and every herb of the field before it grew: for the LORD God had not caused it to rain upon the earth, and there was not a man to till the ground. But there went up a mist from the earth, and watered the whole face of the ground.

Very interesting, I just noticed that Gen 2:4 says "the day that heaven and earth were made," But Gen 1:2 says earth was made on day 1, and verse 1:8 says heaven was created on day 2. Hence the term "day" is being used to describe something other than a 24 hour period of time, otherwise, Gen 2:4 would say "the days that heaven and earth were made." This one has to go back to the orginal Hebrew for an explanation.

Ok I got the Hebrew and "Yowm" is used in Gen 2:4 and Gen 1:2. It is also used to describe Day as in "daylight" reference vs. Gen 1:5. I've been told that day means "24 hours" by some scholars, but this is not possible, or the bible itself is in error. Day has to be something other than 24 hours or the bible made an error between Gen 2:4 and Gen 1:2 -- this is indeed interesting.
 
Last edited:
The Devil Inside said:
does this guy just pop up randomly, talking about stuff he doesnt know anything about?
he has been on a posting spree all day!
Click to expand...

ok then explain "yowm" as used in Genesis 1 and 2.
 
Woody said:
Very interesting, I just noticed that Gen 2:4 says "the day that heaven and earth were made," But Gen 1:2 says earth was made on day 1, and verse 1:8 says heaven was created on day 2. Hence the term "day" is being used to describe something other than a 24 hour period of time, otherwise, Gen 2:4 would say "the days that heaven and earth were made."
Click to expand...

sky an earth were created on the 2nd day, so the "heavens and the earth" in Gen 1:1 mean something else. the followers of god come to heaven when they die (it cannot mean the "physical" sky above us). gen 1:2 also says: "and the earth was WITHOUT FORM, and VOID; and darkness was upon the face of the deep". so the earth doesn't refer to our planet, but something formless.

heaven means our inside, consciousness, and earth means matter ("outer" reality)

on the 1st day, god also said: "let there be light". yet he created the two great lights, sun and the moon, the 4th day. how could there be "light" on the 1st day? because "light" refers to something else than the light from the sun.

in religions, light often means consciousness and darkness means unconsciousness. the 7 days refer to 7 levels of consciousness.

the "7th heaven" is mentioned in ancient egyptian religions, and many other religions. all religions come from the same god and they talk about the same things, with different forms and names.

because heaven and earth were once united, they always seek back to the paradisical prime state, they try to merge. "heaven", the other side of earth, creates magnetism and gravity.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top