The Trump Presidency

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Oystein said:
My hope is

(1) Over the next four years Trump proves to be the awful president that we know he is capable of
(2) The old guard Dems (Clintons, Pelosi, etc..) just . . . disappear
(3) A new Democratic shining star rises, someone like Amy Klobuchar, who is squeaky clean, someone I can be proud to vote for.
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That's a big and dangerous wish list.

(1) Who would you rather be hurt most by Trump's awfulness, and how do you expect that distribution of damage to come about? (I know it's a big question, and precision is a bit tough in answering some of its aspects, but that's part of the point.)

(2) The DLC arose because it was able to assemble a package general election voters would choose. It's one thing to want the old guard to disappear, but the Democrats have no next-gen product.

(3) That shining star is going to need a platform, and I'm already aware that Klobuchar can agitate the ire of some libertarians in questions pertaining to firearms, to the one, or violence between individuals, to the other, or the intersection of both. One of my purportedly libertarian associates picked her out once for especial ire among "foul authoritarian gits", as I believe he called them, because she's too much of a nanny-stater for him. I'm not entirely certain, though, how reliable his messaging was; that was his response to a question of firearms, stalking, and domestic violence that did not require her name. And, besides, if the Getty disrespect is any hint, Sen. Klobuchar will face serious pressborne challenges.​

Honestly, I think the first thing is that Democrats will undergo the attempted minimal shakeup and reorganization with Olympic-gymnast fake gritted smiles stapled on their faces until they find their anti-Trump rhythm, figure out how to be effective, and get over congratulating themselves for having done so. And then they will start coalescing more definitively around any number of growing accretions in the orbital plane. The platform package they can affirmatively sell will emerge from that, and it will in its moment seem more institutional than revolutionary.

Nor do I have a good time scale for that. I would like to see Senate Democrats rally 'round Murray, Klobuchar, and Warren, setting up for the midterm, and then the next presidential; it might be Warren '20. That would be the anti-Trump rhythm, and if she could take two Democrats could really highlight the policy development process. But a platform package to really pitch as a partisan cause, the kind of change we hope for on our most idealistic days, isn't coming before '24 at best; that takes a lot of time and effort. Okay, you know what, I take it back. If we have Warren '20, Democrats can pitch ferociously going into the midterm, having had enough time to find some idea of where the potentials are accreting on the plane.
 
Oystein said:
(3) A new Democratic shining star rises, someone like Amy Klobuchar, who is squeaky clean, someone I can be proud to vote for.
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She has her compromising influences - they're better than most, but she's not going to be cleaning house in any kind of heroic fashion. Not being obviously compromised by the likes of Goldman Sachs is a low bar, surely? We'll take what we can get, of course.

She's an establishment Dem, with the virtues: a very bright lawyer, good at policy and procedure, in touch with and comprehending of high quality intellectual resources, etc. Her recommendations for changes in police and law enforcement procedure, when that was part of her job, were excellent, for example. But like most of those folks she's authoritarian by nature, and "practical" in ways that can miss the point when dealing with things like NSA surveillance (http://www.politico.com/story/2013/06/amy-klobuchar-on-nsa-look-at-facts-092922) or mining companies: https://www.minnpost.com/politics-policy/2008/08/hoyt-lakes-land-sale-plan-erupting-clash-titans.

Not a "shining star" type, in other words - note that Franken, not Klobucher, provides whatever calm Minnesota hardass is involved in overtly confronting the Trumpies. If your disappointment with Clinton was based on her record, rather than her "baggage", you will face similar disappointment with Klobucher. But a solid, conservative, center-right, competent professional politician with a good people (common) touch - if that's what you want, few better.

If you throw out the Democratic Party establishment, though, you'll probably throw her out with them.
 
Tiassa said:
One of my purportedly libertarian associates picked her out once for especial ire among "foul authoritarian gits", as I believe he called them, because she's too much of a nanny-stater for him. I'm not entirely certain, though, how reliable his messaging was; that was his response to a question of firearms, stalking, and domestic violence that did not require her name.
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Questioning other people's reliability of messaging, in the middle of illustrating how foul such "unreliability" can be, is at least efficient.
Tiassa said:
But a platform package to really pitch as a partisan cause, the kind of change we hope for on our most idealistic days, isn't coming before '24 at best; that takes a lot of time and effort.
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Let's have some people in the Democratic Party who don't wait another eight years for the next new carefully vetted and compromised "platform package" before pitching their partisan cause.

That way it won't take the Dems eight years to come up with effective and opposed alternatives to what Trump managed to invent in about a week using Twitter, and at the end of those eight years all that hard work won't get shitcanned in five minutes by the next Trumpreagan.
 
The speech delivered by Tumps UN ambassador Nikki Haley is truly remarkable, for it's arrogance and grandiose presumptions.
Unconscionable, abusive and surreal are three decriptors I would use.

"There is a new US UN!"
How the volunteer nations react will be interesting.
 
Quantum Quack said:
The speech delivered by Tumps UN ambassador Nikki Haley is truly remarkable, for it's arrogance and grandiose presumptions.
Unconscionable, abusive and surreal are three decriptors I would use.

"There is a new US UN!"
How the volunteer nations react will be interesting.
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Welcome to the American Republican Party AKA Radicals R Us.
 
The Repubs would love to do away with the UN. The Repubs only tolerate the UN when it votes for allowing the US to use its military in some trumped-up war. If not, then the UN is evil and/or useless.
 
Quantum Quack said:
The speech delivered by Tumps UN ambassador Nikki Haley is truly remarkable, for it's arrogance and grandiose presumptions.
Unconscionable, abusive and surreal are three decriptors I would use.

"There is a new US UN!"
How the volunteer nations react will be interesting.
Click to expand...

It depends on how you see it. I can see how you or others could think it was grandiose and presumptuous. It could also just be ignorance. I think most people knows how the UN works. The US cannot dictate to the UN. It can exert influence but it cannot by itself change the organization. I think much of her brief comment were directed at Trump's base. These are people who don't like the UN. They think it's a waste of money as evidenced by Trump supporters who have posted here. I think it was encouraging she stated the UN has value.
 
joepistole said:
It depends on how you see it. I can see how you or others could think it was grandiose and presumptuous. It could also just be ignorance. I think most people knows how the UN works. The US cannot dictate to the UN. It can exert influence but it cannot by itself change the organization. I think much of her brief comment were directed at Trump's base. These are people who don't like the UN. They think it's a waste of money as evidenced by Trump supporters who have posted here. I think it was encouraging she stated the UN has value.
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Regardless and either way, the UN will be even more dysfunctional at a time when we as a global community, need it to function the most.

As you already know:
Like all voluntary organizations it only succeeds through the good will and intention of it's members. It's degree of success is a reflection of it's membership.
 
Something to consider:

Narcissistic personality disorder (NPD)

DSM5

Symptoms :
  1. Grandiosity with expectations of superior treatment from others
  2. Fixated on fantasies of power, success, intelligence, attractiveness, etc.
  3. Self-perception of being unique, superior and associated with high-status people and institutions
  4. Needing constant admiration from others
  5. Sense of entitlement to special treatment and to obedience from others
  6. Exploitative of others to achieve personal gain
  7. Unwilling to empathize with others' feelings, wishes, or needs
  8. Intensely envious of others and the belief that others are equally envious of them
  9. Pompous and arrogant demeanor
Diagnosis by attending physician.
Treatment: Psycho therapy

Proposed causation (history of):
  • An oversensitive temperament (personality traits) at birth.
  • Excessive admiration that is never balanced with realistic feedback.
  • Excessive praise for good behaviors or excessive criticism for bad behaviors in childhood.
  • Overindulgence and overvaluation by parents, other family members, or peers.
  • Being praised for perceived exceptional looks or abilities by adults.
  • Severe emotional abuse in childhood.
  • Unpredictable or unreliable caregiving from parents.
  • Learning manipulative behaviors from parents or peers.
  • Valued by parents as a means to regulate their own self-esteem.
Src: Wiki
Opinion of source credibility : 9/10

Again I ask where are all the doctors, the health professionals, the psychiatrists in all this... Are they on the streets demonstrating or are they just sitting back going tutt tutt tutt?

If they need examples of NPD inspired dysfunction to make a diagnosis they haven't got far to look....
 
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Interesting news:
"One of Russia's most successful cybercrime investigators and hacker hunter at one of the world's biggest security companies, Kaspersky Lab, has been arrested by Russian law enforcement as part of a probe into possible treason, according to reports. Kaspersky has confirmed that its incident response chief Ruslan Stoyanov was at the center of an investigation, but could not offer more details."
src: http://www.forbes.com/sites/thomasbrewster/2017/01/25/russia-kaspersky-treason-arrest/#30bc4a994a68

Could it possibly be that someone in the USA administration is leaking confidential information.?
IT security specialists in the USA are going nuttso over this one....
 
Quantum Quack said:
Interesting news:
"One of Russia's most successful cybercrime investigators and hacker hunter at one of the world's biggest security companies, Kaspersky Lab, has been arrested by Russian law enforcement as part of a probe into possible treason, according to reports. Kaspersky has confirmed that its incident response chief Ruslan Stoyanov was at the center of an investigation, but could not offer more details."
src: http://www.forbes.com/sites/thomasbrewster/2017/01/25/russia-kaspersky-treason-arrest/#30bc4a994a68

Could it possibly be that someone in the USA administration is leaking confidential information.?
IT security specialists in the USA are going nuttso over this one....
Click to expand...
It very well could be. Many of Trump's closest advisers have close Russian ties.
 
The irony here is Trump may force some Republican congressmen to work with Democrats to form a new political block at least for the duration of Trump's administration.
 
Quantum Quack said:
Something to consider:

Narcissistic personality disorder (NPD)

DSM5

Symptoms :
  1. Grandiosity with expectations of superior treatment from others
  2. Fixated on fantasies of power, success, intelligence, attractiveness, etc.
  3. Self-perception of being unique, superior and associated with high-status people and institutions
  4. Needing constant admiration from others
  5. Sense of entitlement to special treatment and to obedience from others
  6. Exploitative of others to achieve personal gain
  7. Unwilling to empathize with others' feelings, wishes, or needs
  8. Intensely envious of others and the belief that others are equally envious of them
  9. Pompous and arrogant demeanor
Diagnosis by attending physician.
Treatment: Psycho therapy

Proposed causation (history of):
  • An oversensitive temperament (personality traits) at birth.
  • Excessive admiration that is never balanced with realistic feedback.
  • Excessive praise for good behaviors or excessive criticism for bad behaviors in childhood.
  • Overindulgence and overvaluation by parents, other family members, or peers.
  • Being praised for perceived exceptional looks or abilities by adults.
  • Severe emotional abuse in childhood.
  • Unpredictable or unreliable caregiving from parents.
  • Learning manipulative behaviors from parents or peers.
  • Valued by parents as a means to regulate their own self-esteem.
Src: Wiki
Opinion of source credibility : 9/10

Again I ask where are all the doctors, the health professionals, the psychiatrists in all this... Are they on the streets demonstrating or are they just sitting back going tutt tutt tutt?

If they need examples of NPD inspired dysfunction to make a diagnosis they haven't got far to look....
Click to expand...


So . . . . . QQ . . . . I'm a bit confused . . . . are you describing our immediate former POTUS . . . . our current POTUS . . . or politicians in general . . . . . . LMAO!!
 
karenmansker said:
So . . . . . QQ . . . . I'm a bit confused . . . . are you describing our immediate former POTUS . . . . our current POTUS . . . or politicians in general . . . . . . LMAO!!
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You're a lot more confused than you know - even if you're getting paid for these posts, which would be the indicated explanation of their nature.

(We know for a fact there is a paid Republican-backing online media operation, and it can hardly have completely overlooked this corner of the online world - the only real question is who it is)

Illustration: A bright young woman who owns a horse and needs it (riding it keeps her out of a back brace, among other importance) faces financial calamity (her brothers are losing the farm to the bank). So she takes a job as car salesman for the local Ford dealer. And desperate as she is, she focuses well - she sells. She is their top salesman.

And two years later, I'm talking to her, and out of the blue she starts talking politics to me - in particular, how the liberal media have maligned American cars, creating a phony high status image for Japanese vehicles when Fords are just as reliable and well made and so forth. This is late 1970s - this is delusion, and it is new in her. She has been brainwashed by her own sales pitch.

That is a standard brainwashing technique, btw - simply have the target write and say, repetitively, for weeks or months, from their own mouth and hand, what you want them to believe.

And it will work on the hirelings - you might think you can repeat this stuff cynically, for money or whatever, and remain clear-headed and capable of reason. You probably can't.
 
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The thing is karenmansker as you type and post your asinine comments here at sciforums you are hurting in ways you can not even feel...yet.
You think it is "funny" that Trump can legitimately terrorize his own population and that of the world as he waves his big Nuke at the world and tells you Karenmankster to double down and take it like the slave that you are ......
Whether you get paid to spam a silly internet forum or not is not really the issue what is the issue is that it is You that is doing it.
People like you believe you will not be held to account for your actions. You believe that "dead men tell no tales" because your fear of being held to account means you have to believe you wont be.
Trump will be held to account for every drop of blood, every trauma induced suicide his terrorism inspires, and every hate crime he encourages. he just simply believes that he wont be.

But as Obama quotes :

"If you ignore reality it has a tendency, nay a duty, to bite you on the bum"

Ever wonder who he was quoting?

You think you and your kind know otherwise? Well I seriously suggest you think again.
 
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Quantum Quack said:
The thing is karenmansker as you type and post your asinine comments here at sciforums you are hurting in ways you can not even feel...yet.
You think it is "funny" that Trump can legitimately terrorize his own population and that of the world as he waves his big Nuke at the world and tells you Karenmankster to double down and take it like the slave that you are ......
Whether you get paid to spam a silly internet forum or not is not really the issue what is the issue is that it is You that is doing it.
People like you believe you will not be held to account for your actions. You believe that "dead men tell no tales" because your fear of being held to account means you have to believe you wont be.
Trump will be held to account for every drop of blood, every trauma induced suicide his terrorism inspires, and every hate crime he encourages. he just simply believes that he wont be.

But as Obama quotes :

"If you ignore reality it has a tendency, nay a duty, to bite you on the bum"

Ever wonder who he was quoting?

You think you and your kind know otherwise? Well I seriously suggest you think again.
Click to expand...

I refer you to post #257.
"If you ignore reality it has a tendency, nay a duty, to bite you on the bum" - ergo, his (Obama's) legacy
Ever wonder who he was quoting? - No, Have you?
 
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