The Reason Why No Open Contact Yet

I believe wholly that the aging process will be halted and nano technology will rise to a level that will eliminate almost all diseases (except nano viruses ;) but as for downloading your mind into a computer is an almost absurd idea. The human psyche could not handle being deprived of its biological part. People are known to go crazy in a sensor deprivation chamber (a form of interrogation, people will talk to the apparitions in their hallucinations) and this will have much the same affect. Personally i could never handle not being able to touch another human being. The thought that the best I could would be to superficially have contact through sensor pads is horrifying. Biological perfection is a much more likely path and I believe that is the one that will be perused. As for this being the reason that aliens are not making contact with us seems to be untrue. A more viable explanation is that are not here. The details are too vast to go into in full but Here is a really short summery. The more abductions you study the more absurd they end up becoming. Why they have abducted more than 3 or 4 people does not make any sense. Most abductions center on sex or warnings that the earth is going to end, both highly unreasonable. Cattle mutations are even less reasonable. More and more pictures / videos are being proven as just flukes and some of the most renowned pictures are found to be fakes. There is no hard evidence that they are here and that is because they are not. One day they will be, it just isn't that day yet. And specifically to Ahkros, the human sexuality and interaction point is well made but i don’t believe that anything is EVIL, it is simply the implementation that is used for "evil" or "good."

Sorry for the length of this.


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If the theory does not fit reality then reality MUST be changed.
 
`FA_Q2 ; I just agree with you ; my Evil notion there was a bit to harsh ; I know some will consider that I am too much into God but it depends of your education ; religion and culture somehow.
I just know that if you look sharply to it you discover that apart from the fact our body don't last for instance and can be victim of viruses or disease it is in a way a perfect conception and machine.
Yes I hope one day light comes over us and we pass into a new dimension regarding our longevity...
 
human being- A member of the genus Homo and especially the species H. sapiens.
human- Referring to or indicative of the weaknesses, imperfection, and fragility associated with human beings.
humanity- Human beings as a group; e.g. the human race.
Have to agree with Time and Alien in regard to their posts on this topic...I find it hard to believe that there are individuals out there willing to throw away "humanity." You speak of taking the human brain and downloading it into a mechanized creation...why bother...the human brain can be so easily be clouded by emotion...by hormonal influences...a synapse misfires...I'm sure that other anal-compulsive sociopathic emotionally-retarded geniuses in their sterile labs somewhere would figure how much more perfect and efficient it would be to better the process by eliminating the waste of time spent downloading from humans. I mean think of how much more perfect these mechanized creatures would be if they weren't hindered by the shortcomings of a "human's" brain. Their creators could also pick out each of the charateristics they wished to endow on their robotic dildos; say for convenience and productivity's sake, meekness and submissive tendencies would be two good ones---that way they would never talk back. Throw away free will and sexual intercourse for a hard drive and contrived manipulation of your pleasure center by R2D2 and C3PO!!! What you suggest is the end of mankind!
If I was ET I probably wouldn't want to stay long either for fear that some deranged person might try to take my brain and "download it!!!!"
One forgotten point...one of the truly beautiful things about nature---is how it manages to keep up with everything that man does to try and undo it...for example the good old antibiotic...ever heard of MRSA or VRE?? or the other favorite, multiple drug-resistant TB. Evolution isn't as slow as some would have you believe.
 
FA_Q2, have you played Deus Ex too :)? I agree in that nano-technology will probably be a safer and less emotionally and ethically straining mode of self-perfection. Also, as for most cases being gibberish, ya, lots of people are either insane or crazy for attention, but there seems to much going on for nothing to be going on. Many people aren't just loonies, many are "normal" conservitive people who are the opposite of the wackos who are often associated with the study.

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Those who dance are considered insane by those who can't hear the music---George Carlin
 
“FA_Q2, have you played Deus Ex too?”
Shadowflame

I’m sorry but I don’t know what Deus Ex is, forgive me for my ignorance :)

There is a lot going on and its hard to believe that nothing is going on at all. I cant figure what that might be but also disbelieve that is extraterrestrials, no evidence. Many of these people are normal but so were the ones that murdered themselves when Hailbop passed. Media hype and a few support groups can do a lot to normal people. This has been compared to the Salem Witch trials, although it is not bloody or as counter productive as that incident was.


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If the theory does not fit reality then reality MUST be changed.
 
FYI, Deus Ex is a computer game focusing around nanotechnology and nanoviruses. Good game, I recommend it.
But anyway, yes there is a lot of media hype and etc., but evidence of some kind of visitation has existed in the past long before media hype. Theres the ever popular Ezekial biblical quotes, evidence in cave drawings of strange beings in helmets, the "abstract animal head" mask which looks exactly like a grey, etc. There remains tons of historical evidence that something is going on. I myself don't think that they're extra-terrestrials, but are more like our cousins who have exceeded beyond Earth. I'll try to dig up some more historical evidence.

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Those who dance are considered insane by those who can't hear the music---George Carlin
 
I have seen much of the historical evidence you are referring to and I agree, it is an amazing coincidence. I cannot explain it all and trust me I have tried. One of the things that convinced me to "swing the other way" on this issue (as I used to be a big believer in UFO's) was Carl Segans book The Daemon Haunted World. It is a good book but anyway, i remember a statement in there that went something like this: Lack of an alternate theory is not proof of another theory. In other words, just because we cant explain it doesn’t mean it to be Extraterrestrials, or people from the future or whatever other theory out there. There just simply isn’t any proof.

This is going to be confusing, I’m not good with words. Try to bear with me.

Also, if you look at enough thing eventually you will be able to pull out some similarities that are meaningless. Hoglands Mars is a good example where geometric consistencies are pulled out of nowhere to create a pattern that is meaningless. If i take 100 random numbers, and then do a whole lot of the same calculations to each on i can come out with a single number and say hey, these weren’t random but carefully chose by me and sent to your head and i would be chatoyant.

To clarify: (x*(45+3))/48x = 1
This will always = 1 no matter what number you choose and can be misleading when pulling numbers that seem to quarrelate, such as the locations of the Pyramids and Stonehenge. Yet its not immediately visible and if I wanted I could bury this so deep in mathematics that you would never find it and I could run all kinds of numbers through the equation.

I’m really sorry if this confuses you. I’m not even sure if I can make sense of it myself but ill post it anyway. Tell me if you cant understand it.


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If the theory does not fit reality then reality MUST be changed.
 
Two wrongs do not make a perfect "Right" in any given scenario within our imperfect yet impecible physical cosmos! (You do the math.)

In spite of evidence witnessed by those who "Saw" or claim to have "Seen" in reguards to the infamous "Roswell Incident" I must contend that we all(or most of our combined planetary populus) must have some small voice the echos within us, the sounds of mystery & cover up in relation that something extraordinary or extraterrestrial did in fact happen, and whatever it was, those in the highes in command of our world powers, did their damndest to hide the truth for a variety of economical & political resons.

Whatever the event & cause/s or issues surounding this incident burning up our scandelous history, the lie must continue, so that those responsible for this great hoax, (Not the UFO Crash, but the lies & cover-up & Disinformational Prpoaganda backed by extortionalists organized by tri-laterals, Bilderburgers, and neo/pseodo Nazis & Templers, Necromancers & etc, it just would expose just how sick we have allowed ourselves to "DEVOLVE" to, or better yet, allowed ourselves to follow as leaders!

We all have choices to make, but when the combined choices of humanity totals to the sum of allowing ouselves to be suppressed from the truth, how are we to evolve beyond the veil it is hidden behind?

Just my own observation is that if a interstellar craft of extraterestrial origin did in fact crash on our earth back in the fourties, it would in fact count for such a rapid growth in our technology.

If this supposed crash never occured, our current Time-Line would have not been altered, and our society would not have evolved much beyond what we had in the fifties. I believe that this supposed extrarestrial interstelar craft had in fact
carried secrets of technology, technology that was latter, "reversed engineered" to contribute & assymilate to that of our own, and this direct action is a direct contributor to the "Alteration" of earth's otherwise naturally occuring chronological "TIME-LINE"

<font face=park avenue font size=12 color=blue>T H I N K..."Real Hard"</font
 
I understand what your saying, I've heard about it before. But what I'm saying is that while it may not be "proof" per se, it still indicates very strongly that there is some kind of influence going on. One more thing, do you recall the Mothman story?

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Those who dance are considered insane by those who can't hear the music---George Carlin
 
There is no “UFO” needed to account for our supposed jump in technology. Computers in of themselves can easily support that burden. Things have evolved since the fifties at an increasing rate, as things have always done. 50 years from now, the rate which we discover technology now will seem slow by comparason.

”If this supposed crash never occured, our current Time-Line would have not been altered, and our society would not have evolved much beyond what we had in the fifties.”

Technology always goes forward and very few times in the past has it ever stood still. Nowhere in modern history has it stood still.

The idea that new technology helps find new technology holds true. The more you have, the faster you get more.


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If the theory does not fit reality then reality MUST be changed.
 
FA_Q2;
You are thinking in the "Linear" understanding of what I commented on as you replied to in your post, in another of "many" parallel dimensional universes, This "Roswell-Incident" perhaps never did occur, and I grant you that in that dimension's "Current" Time-Line of 2000, they are more than likely observing technology that is behind ours another 50 yrs. perhaps.........
 
I was referring to our current timeline. Other timelines do not matter as we are not able to observe them. As it goes today in our timeline, the UFO crash at Roswell was not needed. Indeed it was probably an advanced military machine, maybe from Russia or us. Nothing that was that advanced or from another planet, or future earthmen.

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If the theory does not fit reality then reality MUST be changed.
 
Does anyone find this subject as... potentially evil?

Maybe I'm the only one who has every played it, but there was once a game called Total Annihilation based on a huge galactic war that started when the government made "patterning", download of consciousness into a machine, mandatory, and half the population revolted on a massive scale.

I have to concur, in some ways, that such adaptions of the human race may have to occur in order for space exploration to thrive... Most of the universe is totally non-survivable to human beings. But I think very serious considerations have to be done before we begin patterning people.

I can have my brain scanned up and down, my neural patterns recorded and then laid down into the circuits of a human-based mind matrix, but what does that make me? Is it really possible to "transfer" consciousness, or does such a procedjure merely mimic the original being? And is there more to a person than just a consciousness... Can a SOUL ever be transfered into a machine? (Hate to bring up that sort of discussion again, but it should be noted.)

Given the choice, how many of you would undergo a patterning operation?
 
I agree with Chris.The Human race is not considered to be an inteligent life form,by other species,in the universe.We are probably looked upon as vile,primitive creatures.Other,real life forms,have proliforation of the species as a main objective.We seem to be bent on self destruction.We humans are killing ourselves and the planet we live on.And we can't even see it.Earth will become uninhabitable before we have the technology to be able to leave here and look for another planet to poison.Our planet is beyond repair.Therefore they are leaving us here,victims of our own vices.The last thing they want is for us to become smart enough to be able to try moving to thier neighborhood.We are being watched closely.Shareing of knowledge would be interfearing with normal evolution.Only humans do this.Teaching us anything would be like giving nuclear weapons to Saddam Hussian.We are closer to extinction with every tech. advancment.(No,my name is not Ted K.)Space-Time travel may be the only thing that can save us,or rather,prolong our stay.However long we hang on,our existance would be as insignificant as a speck of dust on an infinite timeline.Another scarry thought:insects will outlive the human race in the test of time.They allready have.
 
And what evidence is any of this based on? Scattered reports of abductions, some sighting of unexplainable phenomenon across the globe, and all the sudden we know the reasoning behind intergalactic species?

I think not. It is a good idea, but it is not fact, but pure specualation. Just thought I should point that out. I am not trying to take anything away from the idea, just making sure everyone understancds the distinction.

This is sort of off topic, but has anyone read Childhoods End? Its pretty goof, and kind of relates to all of this.
 
Some interesting views.

I’ll pose you a slightly different variation. It is inevitable that computing power will reach the power of the human brain within a few decades and then will continue onwards. If we do not transition into this technology then the AI machines will most certainly dominate us. How happy will we be as the second class citizens of the planet? We might think we can maintain control of the machines but we would be deluded – they will simply be able to out-think us – in the same way as we can out-think the apes. There will be no way to put the genie back in the bottle. We will have little choice but to accept these momentous changes. Biological changes are just not going to occur fast enough to keep pace.

Those that accept these technology changes will likely be atheistic – i.e. no belief in supernatural spirits or other entities. The issue of transferring a soul simply will not arise – unless someone can show evidence of such entities, and for the moment scientific studies indicate that a spirit is highly improbable.

As for sex and fluidic-based emotions: I have met people who live for sex and who would be devastated if they lost those abilities. I have also met those who have no problems with celibacy. It must be emphasized that sex is a primitive instinctive mechanism developed by evolution to ensure survival of the species. The purpose of life is survival and sex is merely the tool. When survival can be achieved without sex then sex will simply fade away and not be seen as a requirement. We will learn to adapt (re 7 of 9).

If the high points of your life are based on sex then you have my sympathy. I believe there are greater pleasures to be experienced, primarily creativity, which will be greatly enhanced by a significant increase in intelligence.

Our current electro-chemical lifeform is enormously inefficient and poorly developed; it was after all the result of a long random evolutionary process. We now have the chance to design new bodies and correct all the deficiencies of the human form. Robotic bodies will have significant advantages and far greater flexibility and options. While early versions may be initially clumsy it can be reliably assumed that significant refinements will quickly follow. Your sense of touch, initially, may be poor compared to human touch but wait a few years and I suspect that those senses will be amplified and enhanced way beyond crude human senses.

Have fun whatever
Cris




[This message has been edited by Cris (edited November 03, 2000).]
 
You make several strong points, Cris. First, let me remind you that the sensation humans associate with sex is little more that a set of chemical reactions in the brain, and if patterning operations do succeed, it should be fairly simple to reproduce such things electronically.

But let me state my point of view on patterning a little more... Is it really life? You say that humans will never survive our own war and pollution without new, mechanical bodies and synthesized, patterned brains. But if we do manage to pull off a "transition" for everyone, and we have our robot selves running about in the galaxy, what part of us is really out there? What am I if the sum of my cosciousness is my advanced computing power and expanded logic subroutines? Can a machine ever experience beauty, or joy, intruigue, curiosity, creativity? Can a machine laugh? All those things that lie in my cousciousness between instinct and logic, things that have no use to a machine, would all those be lost?
Would survival, as you define it, really be worth the abandonment of so many things?

It seems to me that humanity is going to die anyway. Either we suffocate from our own greenhouse gasses or we create mechanoid mimics of ourselves and pretend to live on.

Some might say that my morals are going to kill me in the future, but offered the choice between death and patterning, I might not take the latter. At any rate, if mankind is really so destructive, is there really any justification in allowing the species to live on? Perhaps minds as destructive as ours should not be allowed to control the universe, whether those minds be contained by walls of flesh or iron.
 
DataBob,

The brain scanning research requires not just the electrical neuron activity but all hormone and other chemical interactions. Everything that makes us human must be duplicated for the upload to be acceptable. It will not be acceptable for us to lose any emotional or intellectual activity.

You use the word ‘machine’ in a derogatory manner, I think born of exposure to science fiction and Hollywood perceptions. The human body and brain is also a machine but is carbon based and poorly constructed. Our transition will be to a more flexible, resilient, and advanced metal/silicon/plastic based structure.

I need to say that I didn’t make any pessimistic references to wars and pollution.

The objective of transhumanism is to be able enhance and improve the human condition. It will not be acceptable to lose anything, at least initially, we may at a later date find that some evolutionary instincts have no relevance to our new advanced format and we might decide to remove such redundant features. Much like the appendix serves no useful purpose to us as humans and is often a problem if it becomes infected.

Be more optimistic. The future looks like being very exciting. Will it all work out right? Yes it will. How do I know? I don’t know it’s a mystery. (Re Shakespeare in Love).

Have fun.

Cris (Eternal Optimist)
 
There are some interesting thoughts going on here.I've developed a pretty solid mathematical background during my humble existance.The people I work with,along with myself are firm belivers(my spelling is suffering)there is nothing that can't be described with numbers,done with numbers or communicated by numbers.Numbers are in everything from the shape of the doughnut you eat in the morning to the dust you inhale when your head hits the pillow.Getting back to the "No contact yet" thing,are there any thoughts out there why we haven't gotten an answer to any of the battery of codes we bombard our little spot in the galaxy with?Our spots too small?Signal too weak?Math is not the language of the universe?No one is listening?They don't want us to know they're listening?Are we too simple?Does "matter" even matter?
 
That last post on your view of patterning made ME optomistic.
I still do not know if mankind is going to destory this planet, but at any rate there is much hope that our condition will improve, and even if I don't think we deserve to live, it's certainly not up to me to decide. (We decide for ourselves, in everything we do.)

As for patterning, I really just think it needs to be debated heavilly before applying it is considered, and it should never, under any circumstances, be made mandatory.
And I do see the wisdom in it... We may reach a point when we need to go beyond the limitations of our slightly limited bodies and allow our minds to travel and explore the universe without them. In some ways, I look forward to that time.
But if even the slightest, most seemingly trivial function of the human brain is lost in trasfer, the "new organism" (More to your liking than "machine"?) ceases to be any more than an AI construct. Keep that in mind.

So in response to the topic, why haven't we been contacted? I'm not entirely sure, but I see a few possibilities.
Maybe, as many have tried to point out to me, our whole race is really primitive and no one even wants to meet us. Obviously, if we were contacted by an advanced society, we'd be very hungry to have a sample of their advanced technology. If I were an alien, (If... :) ) I would think that new races should think up their own technology, and in doing so learn how to use it responsibly. Like, imagine if we'd gone back in time and given people in the dark ages something like atomic energy, so they'ed have all the light they needed. Not too smart, is it? So maybe these aliens don't want to contact us because it would make us too jealous of the knowledge they don't want to give us.
On the other hand... Even though there must be millions, if not trillions of advanced civilizations out there somewhere, simply given the immense size of the known universe, life must still be pretty rare. There may be only ten or twenty other planets in this galaxy with life, for all we know. Maybe even less. And this is a HUGE galaxy.
If humans gained sufficient technology to explore the universe on a feasible scale (I.E. warp drive, wormholes, etc.) and started looking for other civilizations, it would still take a very very long time to find one, simply because of the sheer distance between every star and more so the sheer number of stars. We'd have to search nearly every one to be sure to find aliens, and the Milky Way galaxy had several hundred billion stars, last time I checked.
Maybe there are aliens looking for us right now. Heck, maybe they're already on their way.
And you may point out that we have all these radio waves and TV signals going out into the cosmos all the time... But I have doubts as to their power. Why can't I pick up the TV stations that are broadcasting on the other side of town? How is anyone supposed to pick up those same signals on the other side of the galaxy? And, who's to say that any alien races still use normal radio waves? They are very slow for long range communication, completely inadequate for interstellar transmitions, if you ask me.

But then again, who is to say that we HAVEN'T been contacted?
 
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