The power of prayer - or not...

these people didn't even know who they were praying for. A name on a list.
I think if there is a higher purpose for prayer, beyond our own selfish needs, which there must be, it might be to allow humans to experience community and show concern for each other. Perhaps when a person cares and their prayer is "answered" they feel glad to have participated in a positive event, even if they had no direct effect, they connect themselves to the event in at least as strong a way as a fan watching their favorite team or rockstar, but actually much stronger emotionally.
The purpose of prayer is definitely not to control all situations - people that think this is what prayer is for are silly because praying obviously doesn't change circumstances all the time.
If the athiest thinks that is what prayer is for they are silly too, because that is logically untenable.

If prayer has a higher purpose, then prayer undertaken with another purpose -especially one as stupid as, "let's prove God exists, or doesn't exist" - should be ignored, because it is just an act.

P.S. even an unknown name on a list, in a church environment, has the ability to, in some small way, show a person's concern for their community.
 
Godless said:
Example: Boxer A & B pray to god for victory;
Boxer A almost kills boxer B with a blow to the head; in interview;

Boxer A thanks god for his undisputable victory; Boxer B gets rushed to the hospital and dies overnight.

What the hell happened to boxer B's prayers? God dindn't listen, did he favor boxer A over Boxer B. or did he listen to a desperate gambling man to answer his prayer and give boxer A a quick victory because he bet the house?


Ah! I guess that's why they say "god works in misterious ways"

Godless
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Easy, Christians don't Box. Just as Christians do not fight in wars. too easy.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days
 
He's right - according to this: http://www.bible-truths.org/questions&answers/isboxing.htm :D


Then of course there's Christina Christian :eek:
http://www.womenboxing.com/christianc.htm


Christian Bank Holiday after Christmas is called BOXING Day :)


From this website: http://www.wels.net/sab/qa/behav-08.html
Is boxing a Christian sport?
In general, particular sports in and of themselves are neither "Christian" or "non Christian." Boxing, like other sports, falls into the area of life we call adiaphora - things that God has neither commanded nor forbidden. In other words, God has left it up to a Christian's freedom whether he wishes to participate or not in such activities. Scripture nowhere forbids the believer's participation nor commands that he must take part.

Of course, the participant's attitude in any sport can still be very important. If a participant takes part in any sport because he enjoys inflicting severe bodily harm to his opponent (a football player who intentionally seeks to injure a member of the opposing team, for example) that would be a sin against the 5th Commandment. A Christian would want to participate in any sport by using his God given talents to the best of his ability, according to the rules of the sport. By such participation, the Christian can bring honor to his Savior even in an activity which in and of itself is an adiaphoron.

The specific sport you asked about, boxing, would follow the same principle of being an adiaphoron. If someone participates in boxing merely because he loves to inflict injury on his opponent, such a motivation would be sinful. However, there would be nothing inherently sinful to merely seeking to win a boxing match while honoring safety factors instituted for the well being of both participants (such as padded gloves; rules about legal and illegal punches).
 
I pray because I like to talk with God, insofar as I can. God being infinite, of course I can never truly "approach" God - but by the means which God provides - I have some way of communicating.

Here is a quote that I believe helps answer the question:

The wisdom of prayer is this: That it causeth a connection between the servant and the True One, because in that state (i.e., prayer) man with all heart and soul turneth his face towards His Highness the Almighty, seeking His association and desiring His love and compassion. The greatest happiness for a lover is to converse with his beloved, and the greatest gift for a seeker is to become familiar with the object of his longing; that is why with every soul who is attracted to the Kingdom of God, his greatest hope is to find an opportunity to entreat and supplicate before his Beloved, appeal for His mercy and grace and be immersed in the ocean of His utterance, goodness and generosity.

(Abdu'l-Baha, Tablets of Abdu'l-Baha v3, p. 683)
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Adstar said:
Easy, Christians don't Box. Just as Christians do not fight in wars. too easy.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days
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*************
M*W: Someone needs to pull the plug on Adstar. He's brain dead.
 
Adstar said:
Easy, Christians don't Box. Just as Christians do not fight in wars. too easy.
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If ever there are words written that prove a person's mind is under control by some outside agency, this is it. The sheer absurdity of such a statement is completely lost on you. I don't know whether to laugh at you or shake my head as I pity you. I sure as hell can't pray for you. Even god himself spit up his beer after that one. Wow!
 
(Q) said:
So, has everything you've ever prayed for happened? No.
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Correct.



Have some things happened and others not? Yes.
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Correct.



Why didn't prayer work for those things that didn't happen?
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Simple :) , because God did not deem it good for those prayers to be granted. I can pray for anything and everything but my prayers are only requests. I trust in Gods judgement on what He grants and what He withholds. He has ultimate wisdom and knows what should be granted and what should be withheld. I trust in His judgement on the matter.



All Praise The Ancient Of Days
 
Medicine Woman said:
*************
M*W: Not only do christians fight in wars, they start them. I feel sorry for all the christian families who have lost their sons and daughters in Iraq. You slap them all in the face with your ignorance.

http://www.stormfront.org/whitehistory/hwr43.htm
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While some of their family members might be Christian the solders who went to iraq to fight where certainly Not Christians. They where not following The Messiah Jesus in doing what they where doing they where following worldly political masters Not the Lord Jesus. So Yes i slap them in the face if they dare to declare their war fighting sons and daughters Christians, they are liars to God and deceivers for calling their sons and daughter Christians.


For those "christians" who are open to the truth i will once again give you the Word.

I will try to explain it to anyone who is open to it.

OK
Ever since the Messiah came back to life on the third day after his execution all of humanity has been invited to accept him as the Messiah to have their sins forgiven through his grace so as to be acceptable to exist in the presence of The Ancient Of Days for eternity. This Invitation is open to all people until the moment of their deaths.

When we kill others who haven’t accepted our Messiah we are denying them the chance for redemption that The Ancient Of Days has offered them through the Messiah. We sinners who are saved by grace have no right to kill others for the sins that they do.

To defend or avenge ourselves may be our human notion of what is good or just but once the Messiah was raised from the dead The Ancient Of Days provided a route to eternity for sinners that did away with justice. If The Ancient Of Days used justice to determine who would enter the Kingdom Of Heaven would we have any chance of entering it? I can be assured in myself that without the grace of the Messiah I would burn.

So if we are followers of The Messiah we shall attempt to overcome evil with good and not allow ourselves to be overcome by evil by joining in their game. Love is the only weapon Our Messiah has given us to use.

When we understand these things we then know why we are told to turn thy cheek, love thy enemy, do not avenge yourselves and pray for those who spitefully use you and persecute you. It no longer sounds like foolishness, for The Ancient Of Days has made the wisdom of man as nothing He reaches out to ALL men. How then can we kill one to whom The Ancient Of Days is reaching out for, in Love.

For those that can read and perceive

Matthew 5:38-39

38 "You have heard that it was said, "An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth. 39But I tell you not to resist an evil person. But whoever slaps you on your right cheek, turn the other to him also.

Matthew 5: 43-48

43 "You have heard that it was said, "You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy.' 44But I say to you, love your enemies, bless those who curse you, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who spitefully use you and persecute you, 45that you may be sons of your Father in heaven; for He makes His sun rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust. 46For if you love those who love you, what reward have you? Do not even the tax collectors do the same? 47And if you greet your brethren only, what do you do more than others? Do not even the tax collectors do so? 48Therefore you shall be perfect, just as your Father in heaven is perfect.

Romans 12:17-21
17Repay no one evil for evil. Have regard for good things in the sight of all men. 18If it is possible, as much as depends on you, live peaceably with all men. 19Beloved, do not avenge yourselves, but rather give place to wrath; for it is written, "Vengeance is Mine, I will repay," says the Lord. 20Therefore "If your enemy is hungry, feed him; If he is thirsty, give him a drink; For in so doing you will heap coals of fire on his head." 21Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.

Matthew 5:9
Blessed are the peacemakers, For they shall be called sons of God.

Revelation 13:10
He who leads into captivity shall go into captivity; he who kills with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.

Do you have the patience and the faith of the saints?

May the Spirit convict.



All Praise The Ancient Of Days
 
PsychoticEpisode said:
If ever there are words written that prove a person's mind is under control by some outside agency, this is it.
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:) Yes i am lead by the Holy Spirit. An outside agency indeed


The sheer absurdity of such a statement is completely lost on you. I don't know whether to laugh at you or shake my head as I pity you. I sure as hell can't pray for you. Even god himself spit up his beer after that one. Wow!
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Absurd to you. But you are blinded to the truth, for you have rejected the love of the truth just as false christians who wage war have rejected the love of the truth.

The Messiah's Words will not be undermined by the twisting of satan's theologians, His Word Reigns.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days
 
Adstar said:
While some of their family members might be Christian the solders who went to iraq to fight where certainly Not Christians. They where not following The Messiah Jesus in doing what they where doing they where following worldly political masters Not the Lord Jesus. So Yes i slap them in the face if they dare to declare their war fighting sons and daughters Christians, they are liars to God and deceivers for calling their sons and daughter Christians.

*************
M*W: You ignorant bastard. You are the one who deserves beheading. The atheists on sciforums would even pray for that!
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Adstar said:
And you should know that people should not but God to the test.
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And why not? Is it because you wish to remain ignorant in your belief? Oops, pardon me, "ignorant" is not the politically correct term, my apologies. I guess the correct term would be "faith".
 
Adstar said:
And you should know that people should not but God to the test.
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"That way, it can never be proven that God actually doesn't exist. Teehee."
 
"Behold with a great plague will the LORD smite thy people and thy children, and thy wives, and all thy goods: And thou shalt have great sickness by disease of thy bowels, until thy bowels fall out by reason of the sickness day by day." (II Chronicles 21:14-15)

hahahhaaha.


Praying is like the child who asks santa for a present, when really it is the parents giving the gifts every year.
Real miracles (e.g. like healing a very sick person) are carried out everyday by human beings in hospitals (acting under the guidance of science).
That's why I'm a humanist.

"The hard work of one does more than the prayers of millions".
 
Adstar said:
Simple :) , because God did not deem it good for those prayers to be granted. I can pray for anything and everything but my prayers are only requests. I trust in Gods judgement on what He grants and what He withholds. He has ultimate wisdom and knows what should be granted and what should be withheld. I trust in His judgement on the matter.
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So, your prayers for some selfish petty things get answered while the prayers to put an end to starving children and disease go unanswered.

Yes, your god has ultimate wisdom and you trust him in these matters.

Why would he grant you your petty wishes and withhold prayers that actually had meaning?
 
QueenTiye said:
I pray because I like to talk with God, insofar as I can. God being infinite, of course I can never truly "approach" God - but by the means which God provides - I have some way of communicating.

Here is a quote that I believe helps answer the question:
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You must be 'communicating' about the weather or some such triviality. Have you ever 'communicated' the need for real changes on earth? You must feel so good that your god talks to you to make you feel better while ignoring that his children die of starvation every day.
 
(Q) said:
You must be 'communicating' about the weather or some such triviality. Have you ever 'communicated' the need for real changes on earth? You must feel so good that your god talks to you to make you feel better while ignoring that his children die of starvation every day.
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Actually Q I think you'll find that 'we' are responsible for those children dying and starving, we have enough wealth in this world to put an end to starvation and poverty, but WE choose not to. I guess when we stop being greedy and decide to cure our own problems and those of others we will have evolved at last into the higher beings we constantly rant on that we are.

God, has provided the means to cure these problems, just we prefer to use those 'means' for other purposes.
 
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