The Paul File

[adoucette]

Yes, for money to work it does need to flow freely. That's not what's happening. Thanks to crony capitalists on WallStreet it's heads they win, tails you loose. Money is flowing AWAY from where it's needed on Mainstreet into mega Too-Big-Too-Fail Bankopolies who vacuum most money into their coffers leaving Mainstreet only with debt.

Are you kidding?
Do you have ANY CLUE as to how a bank makes money?
Banks don't make money when it sits in their vault.
They pay INTEREST on deposits.
They only make money by lending it.
And that requires a growing economy.
Which is when banks do well.

Even Arthur's smug post reported that the top few banks have Trillions in capital. These need to be broken up with anti-trust monopoly laws and we need currency competitions so you're not FORCED to eat the shit they're feeding you.

More BS, those are by no means monopolistic nor the largest banks in the world, and you can do business with international banks even if you are in the US. Go to ANY moderate size city in the US and you have the choice of banking LOCALLY with dozens of banks. Go online and you can bank over the internet with any number of other banks, or get loans, buy a house or a car etc etc, the exact opposite of a monopoly.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=aqH4r8ZRyqqA

The reason the Federal Reserve was able to bail out it's buddies on Wall Street is because they had YOU the cattle to sell them to. You are literally being promised to China and Japan and now the Banks. It's your future labor that was and is used to bail out WallStreet. I'm not sure if you get that. It's YOU and your labor that's going to pay back with interest these debts.

Even MORE BS
As of last November, the Treasury has received $317 billion in repayments and other income from its TARP investments.
That's ~77 percent of the $413 billion disbursed under the program to date.

And AIG, an INSURANCE firm, was the biggest at $182 Billion, but that has been paid back such that only $50 Billion remains, but the Treasury Treasury has received 1.655 billion shares of AIG common stock (approximately 92 percent of AIG’s outstanding common stock) and $20.3 billion in preferred equity interests in AIG. So, no it's not taxpayers on the hook, it's AIG itself.

http://www.treasury.gov/press-center/press-releases/Pages/tg1347.aspx

Paul would liquify some of the debt, some of the mega banks will go bankrupt,

You believe this BS because Paul says it.
Here's a clue: THERE ARE NO LARGE BANKS IN DEBT TO THE TREASURY.
NONE

Six banks repaid nearly half a billion dollars in funds they received from the government bailout of Wall Street, the Treasury Department said, bringing the total bank repayment under the Troubled Asset Relief Program to 99%.

The Treasury on Wednesday said the banks repurchased TARP investments with proceeds to taxpayers totaling about $475 million. TARP was created in 2008, with its Capital Purchase Program set up for banks hurt in the financial crisis.

Through the repayments announced Wednesday, as well as dividends and interest, taxpayers have recovered about $244 billion of the $245 billion in TARP funds disbursed to banks, the Treasury said.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704261504576205142438418336.html

government services will have to shrink, we can be free of many debts (why should YOU pay for someone else's decision to buy a fourth house?) - we will have to pay some obligations, but, not the bank bailouts.

More BS, you never had to pay for anyone's fourth house and the banks have paid back their loans.

 

[eyeswideshut]

Keiser Report: Economics of Suicide

In this episode, Max Keiser and co-host, Stacy Herbert, cover the great unmentionables: Ron Paul, Vermin Supreme and blackstonesucks.com. In the second half of the show, Max and Stacy discuss Treasury Secretary Geithner trying to coax China into committing economic suicide and learning your maths in America by counting slaves.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpEuzBmfH3g

 

[spidergoat]

Why would government spending be better than private spending on alternative energy?

I've invested my own personal wealth into an alternative energy company. I don't expect them to see any decent returns for 10+ years. I support their research, I know a little about what they do, and I think yes the USA needs to move from oil dependency.

As I've said, we all want the same thing in the end. It's just getting there that's tricky.

Because the government has more money, because it can coordinate it's investments strategically, because it can contribute the work of government scientists to the cause, and because they aren't answerable to shareholders for short term profits.

 

[Michael]

There is nothing illegal about Americans investing, owning or selling gold.

So, if there ARE actual regulations then just don't say there are, POINT TO THEM.

Never made that argument.
Just said it was a dumb idea.
It is.

Yeah just ask the street vendor to exchange NH dollars for a hot dog in New Jersey.
No, they would need to be physically exchanged.
Incredibly stupid.



No, the essence of America starts with our Constitution and Section 10 prohibits states from making their own money.

For good reason.

Yes, of course you can own gold and silver. I actually own some. It's minted into a coin and the numismatic value is always way over the legal tender. Say a $1 coin being worth $25 intrinsically. Secondly, Peter Schiff may be bullshitting, why a person who owns a multimillion dollar company, popular author, and potential politician would make a mistake regarding his own company is beyond me. Unless he was demagoging this issue of currency.

At least a few states are starting to think outside of the box:
Utah passes bill to make gold and silver legal tender


In regards to the hotdog stand, as a private company, the owner would be able to choose which currency they'd accept. If you used electronic currency and the hot dog vendor has an iPhone you could do the transaction instantaneously just as any Visa payment is made. The point again is, people would have the choice to accept or not accept your currency.

 

[Michael]

Because the government has more money, because it can coordinate it's investments strategically, because it can contribute the work of government scientists to the cause, and because they aren't answerable to shareholders for short term profits.

Do remember that the government ONLY has the money it takes from the public. AKA, if the government has a LOT of money, then this means the Cattle are being milked at full capacity. I personally don't think this is a good thing.

Government Scientists are no where near as productive as private Scientists. I can personally attest to this as I know both sides of the coin. As a matter of fact, I know lab technicians at the NIH (which do nothing but routine lab maintenance - they conduct NO research) who are on $150,000 simply due to the amount of time they've spent working in government and all the protections promised therein - you'd never get that pay on the open market with those skills.

That's only one a millions of examples of government waste. Everyone knows the NIH is one big waste of money. I mean, mega waste on a scale you'd want to punch someone.

Compare with a colleague of mine who works in private enterprise. He's was on $80K, works 50+ hours a week and is leading the world in terms of a certain niche in biofuel production. They have an extremely efficient team and everyone is working for the time when biofuel is a reality.

You keep thinking government does a good job with the money it rapes off the public. Well it simply doesn't. It's wasteful and neglectful. AND government employees are given WAY MORE than the private individuals of comparable statues. It's completely backwards. The inefficient are given huge pay and lots of vacation and great medical and only work 36 hours or so a week and needn't worry they'll ever loose their job regardless of their performance and the most efficient are given pay at market price, market equal vacation time, are in a state whereby they could loose their job if they don't produce a product the public wants and to top it off, THEY the ones who are FORCED to PAY for the inefficient slobs working plush at the government.

That's f*cked up.

Dollar for Dollar the government doesn't compare with private enterprise. So, IF your intention is to end up with medical or scientific advancement, you'd be better off seeing the money STAY in the private sector.


Lastly, while SOME people invest short term, not everyone does. I gave the example of myself. I put in a size able investment in biotech and it's there for the long run. NOT that this really matters that much. Stock is only one part of a company. Oh, and I might loose ALL of my investment. See, this means I should be allowed to keep all of the gain as well. Why should some overpaid douche at the government be given money from my risk taking? Someone whose probably paid much more than me and has a much more secure job with much better benefits?

Something to think about.

Don't think like Cattle is the first step I suppose :shrug:

 

[adoucette]

Yes, of course you can own gold and silver. I actually own some. It's minted into a coin and the numismatic value is always way over the legal tender. Say a $1 coin being worth $25 intrinsically. Secondly, Peter Schiff may be bullshitting, why a person who owns a multimillion dollar company, popular author, and potential politician would make a mistake regarding his own company is beyond me. Unless he was demagoging this issue of currency.

Again, POINT TO ANYTHING to back up your claim.
So far you haven't.

At least a few states are starting to think outside of the box:
Utah passes bill to make gold and silver legal tender

Actually that is something that is allowed for the states to do by the Constitution.

Section 10 - Powers prohibited of States

No State shall ...make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts

LOL

In regards to the hotdog stand, as a private company, the owner would be able to choose which currency they'd accept. If you used electronic currency and the hot dog vendor has an iPhone you could do the transaction instantaneously just as any Visa payment is made. The point again is, people would have the choice to accept or not accept your currency.

Yes, if you do it electronically it's called a debit card or credit card and the form of currency you eventually settle with the bank in is not an issue to the vendor. It is when you are talking about physical currency, which is 28% of transactions.

That's a problem.
A huge problem is the cost of setting up the printing/engraving and each state running it's own counterfeit detection program.
How is someone in New Mexico to know that that $100 bill from NH is valid when they only see one every few years?

Fact is you are just creating problems, not solving anything.

 

[Michael]

Are you kidding?
Do you have ANY CLUE as to how a bank makes money?
Banks don't make money when it sits in their vault.
They pay INTEREST on deposits.
They only make money by lending it.
And that requires a growing economy.
Which is when banks do well.

Lets think about this Arthur.

Wait role did the banks play in creating the Financial Crises? The so called "Great Recession"?

What proportion of blame do the banks share in this?

Just because an economy is growing doesn't mean it's growing healthily. As an example see: Great Recession discussed above. Banks make money when people go into debt. Which is why the Federal Reserve likes to replace one bubble with another. After the Tech Bubble popped the Fed blew up the Housing Bubble. Over the course of a decade banks were reaping HUGE profits all the while they were destroying our economy. ALL that time the economy was "growing" as American jobs went overseas and everyone went deeper and deeper into debt thinking houses prices would go up forever.


Do you think of currency carry trades as lending money?

 

[adoucette]

No, Banks make money when people pay off their debts.

When banks are forced to foreclose on properties they LOSE money.

 

[Michael]

No, Banks make money when people pay off their debts.

When banks are forced to foreclose on properties they LOSE money.

Unless they're Too Big Too Fail and they stick the public with their debts. Then they indeed DO make a lot of money - or at least their crooked CEOs do.

You missed the first two questions.

 

[Michael]

Again, POINT TO ANYTHING to back up your claim.
So far you haven't.

Here's the transcript of the radio broadcast.

In Peter Schiff’s July 29th radio show [36.02-38.35], Peter confirms that it is a MasterCard and not a VISA, “What we are going to be doing is allowing our banking clients [who are can not be American nationals] to purchase metals from us and then we will store the metal and we will give them a MasterCard that will function like a debit card, except what they are debiting is their gold holdings. … When you go into a store … the merchant has no idea what you are spending. He doesn’t know whether you have dollars, or gold or euros [backing the card]. He just sees a MasterCard and he puts it in and gets an approval code and you can buy what you want. … What that enables you to do is keep your principle in something that is not loosing value everyday.”Peter goes onto say that the gold holdings will be reduced according to the currency you are spending against and that currency’s exchange rate to gold. So if you are in europe and spending euros, it would be the euro rate of gold and the more the euro decreases against gold, the lower the reduction to the gold holdings.

As to WHY Americans can not have a card, it has to do with US regulation. Obviously if he could do business in the biggest market he'd do it.

 

[Michael]

How is someone in New Mexico to know that that $100 bill from NH is valid when they only see one every few years?

Fact is you are just creating problems, not solving anything.

Yes, and they COULD refuse the currency - again, that's their choice. OR, and is more likely, they could use a debt card with NM dollars storing their wealth.

Is it less efficient? That's debatable. If you count the massive fraud perpetrated on the American public and the lost decade+ of productivity as "efficient" then I suppose the USD is your man.

Yes, the Bankopolies, skipped due diligence (for which a lot of people should go to prison for) and efficiently ran up housing prices, poisoned the USA economy, funded the efficient transfer of our GDP to China and efficiently destroyed the American Middle Class.

I'll take a few minor "inefficiencies" any day of the week thank you - and THAT should be my choice. It's more efficient to round up all children, intern them in one big camp and teach them there - returning them to their family in the summer. Very efficient, very stupid as well. Efficiency isn't everything.

 

[786]

no, the essence of america starts with our constitution and section 10 prohibits states from making their own money.

actually that is something that is allowed for the states to do by the constitution.



Lol

lol

 

[adoucette]

Unless they're Too Big Too Fail and they stick the public with their debts. Then they indeed DO make a lot of money -

Nope, all the banks paid back their loans.

 

[adoucette]

lol

Nope, they aren't the same thing.

Gold is Gold and has an intrinsic value.
It's not the same as a paper currency.

Do try to keep up.

 

[adoucette]

Yes, the Bankopolies, skipped due diligence (for which a lot of people should go to prison for) and efficiently ran up housing prices, poisoned the USA economy, funded the efficient transfer of our GDP to China and efficiently destroyed the American Middle Class.

Nope, not even close.
Most of the mortgages were originated by Mortgage brokers not banks.

That's why Country Wide went under and the reason the acquisition of World Savings led to Wachovias downfall, but BofA and Wells were not heavily involved.

 

[786]

Nope, they aren't the same thing.

Gold is Gold and has an intrinsic value.
It's not the same as a paper currency.

Do try to keep up.

Huh do I care if it is paper currency on not. Who said money has to be paper. One point you say states can't make money per constitution but when Utah allows gold as money you say that it is allowed?

 

[spidergoat]

Gold is Gold and has an intrinsic value.

Why?

 

[Michael]

Why?

It takes 10 men working with big machines all day to dig out an ounce of gold. Lots of things have intrinsic value. A car, a building, a computer.

Gold is limited and eternal, which means it also has an extremely stable intrinsic value. 1 once of gold or $20 USD could buy you a very nice suit in 1919. Today, 1 once of gold or $1500 can buy you a very nice suit. A couple silver dimes could buy a gallon of gas in 1950, today, the silver IN those dimes could buy you a gallon of gas. Obviously $0.10 isn't worth nearly as much today as 60 years ago - maybe you could buy,,,,.... a peanut?

Which is why people have used silver and gold as currency for 5000 years.

Silvers sort of coming down off it's ridiculous highs of last year. As a rule of thumb, I like keeping 5-10% of my savings as silver and gold, just in case.

 

[Michael]

Nope, not even close.
Most of the mortgages were originated by Mortgage brokers not banks.

That's why Country Wide went under and the reason the acquisition of World Savings led to Wachovias downfall, but BofA and Wells were not heavily involved.

Let me guess, banks played no role in the financial crises?

 

[billvon]

Let me guess, banks played no role in the financial crises?

Banks played the same role in the recent financial crisis as guns play in murder statistics.