The Paul File

So, we're all in agreement that the only way to truly make meaningful and beneficial change is to vote for Ron Paul POTUS :)

I Skyped a friend of mine who lives in Florida (sadly she's loosing her house after working 3 jobs for 5 years :( Anyhow, as we were chatting before she had to head out to one of her jobs, I asked who she was voting for and she said: I hope this doesn't sound crazy but, I think I'm voting for Ron Paul.

Wow, I don't even think she's voted in the past. It's great to hear she's interested in voting Paul. It did bother me that she said "crazy" because I've seen on the idiot brainwash box (via YouTube) how the talking heads continue to associate RP with "dangerous" and "crazy". She even mentioned how she did "worry about his overseas policy... When I asked what specifically she's couldn't really say.

Check out yet another superficial "analysis" with an MSNBC talking head hosting yet another dumb-down the American public Newsertainment.
 
adoucette said:
I was surprised myself, but I was told afterward that it isn't that uncommon in Italian restaurants in South Philly
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It should perhaps be mentioned that "old, family-owned Italian restaurant in South Philly" is not necessarily exclusive of "black/grey market cash economy."
 
He is dangerous and crazy. Dangerous because he would withdraw from the world and let our enemies get stronger. Crazy because he's a doctor that doesn't believe in evolution.
 
RE: Competing currencies.
adoucette said:
Which would be one of the worst ideas you can imagine.
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So, I think religious indoctrination is a horrible idea - yet we have private Jewish, Christians and Islamic schools. Yet they are free to do so.

I think buying "Name Brands" is one of the worse ideas anyone could imagine. Yet, people are free to do so.

I think taking pills for minor mood control or minor pain relief is horrible. Doctors are still free to prescribe these.

IOWs, it's not what I think is a good or bad idea that's the point. The point is about giving people freedom to choose what THEY think is a good idea for THEM. You may not have noticed it, but thanks in part to the Federal Reserve manufacturing has been DECIMATED in Michigan as well as most other states. Life would probably be better FOR the citizens of MI if our State could pay people with our own currency. As a matter of fact, the unemployment is so f*cking high, I am 100% sure people would be more than happy to be paid something, anything, if it means they could get on with their lives and try to be productive.

Not that this matters. The point isn't whether it IS or ISN'T going to work. Or whether you and I think it is a good or bad idea. The point is American Citizens should have the freedom to choose for themselves what sort of currency they want to use. Why should YOU decide that for THEM. You may not like it, well, I don't like religion, we both have to share this space and so the best is to not use FORCE against one anther and let people have the freedom to make their own decision.
 
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spidergoat said:
He is dangerous and crazy. Dangerous because he would withdraw from the world and let our enemies get stronger. Crazy because he's a doctor that doesn't believe in evolution.
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Did you ever hear about the 12 year Japanese girl who was pulled into a field by some American solders, beat, duck taped, hog tied and raped?

Ever been to bars around some of the Korean military bases? You won't be let in if you're an American (I have an Australian passport so I'm let in :) The Korea's are still at war, it's been 50 years. This isn't about solving problems or defending Americans.

Ever speak to Germans about what they think of military bases in Germany. Not a news site or a survey, just sit down over a beer and talk about it. Many think it's time for America to leave - though they may not say so out loud because they worry more about anything that may effect their economy.

Do you think most Iraqis were happy we invaded? I'd say a large percentage will be happy if we were not there.

You do know Iran can NOT use it's military against us? Iran doesn't even make their own god damn fuel spidergoat. They have maybe a couple months supply at best and they don't have a navy that can leave their own waters before it must return. They are NOT a threat against America and our military is there to defend the USA. That's what they volunteer for. You can not send them to die in Africa because Shell wants some oil. You can not send them to defend other nations over what MIGHT happen in the future - that is morally repugnant.

Are you happy to SEE the backsides of Americans who join the military to defend American? Are you happy to send them into war? How about you? Would you be as happy to send Americans into battle if it were YOU who had to go live in Afghanistan?

Paul is NOT an isolationist, he's just not a warmonger.



As for Evolution, most doctors I train are Christians and have a similar view on Evolution. They believe in a God and that "He" created the Universe and Evolution would, at best, "part of His plan". This is a case of indoctrination. No one's "crazy" (whatever that word means). I know a lot of Buddhists who think there was a Buddha and there is an afterlife of sorts (reincarnation). Are they "Crazy"? No, they were raised to believe this and so most do so unquestioningly. Why do they? I think it has to do with wanting to believe there's an afterlife :shrug: Even Scientologists have an afterlife. I don't think any religion doesn't have an afterlife.

Oh, and it should be noted, Obama also believes in a Creator God. Obama still has the same people who were under GW Bush's White House Office of Faith-Based and Neighborhood Partnerships AND Obama is looking to expand it! Paul wants government OUT of the domain of religion.

So, as a matter of police matter, seeing as in both Paul AND Obama believe in a Creator God, it is ONLY Paul who is going to separate government from supporting religious organizations. You would therefor aline with Paul on this issue spidergoat, if you were being genuine.

I'm not voting on that, as Paul's stance on the Economy is what matters to me. Generations from now religion will be something people read about like we read about Zeus or Thor and that will happen (is happening) naturally.
 
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Michael said:
Not that this matters. The point isn't whether it IS or ISN'T going to work. Or whether you and I think it is a good or bad idea. The point is American Citizens should have the freedom to choose for themselves what sort of currency they want to use. Why should YOU decide that for THEM.
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Yeah, it is the point.

This was figured out a long time ago, and guess what, Ron Paul isn't getting nominated and thus he isn't getting elected and the Fed isn't going away.

Time to live in the real world, not your fairy tale.
 
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adoucette said:
Yeah, it is the point.

This was figured out a long time ago, and guess what, Ron Paul isn't getting nominated and thus he isn't getting elected and the Fed isn't going away.

Time to live in the real world, not your fairy tale.
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What's the point?

I didn't get your intention.

As for "time to live in the real world" you can already use gold as a means of transaction if you are lucky enough to have a non US passport. Isn't that odd? I as a dual citizen can open an account, change my currency directly into gold (which is held in physical) then I'm issued a CC which I can then use in the USA to purchase anything a Visa can purchase - including USD. The company makes the exchange on the minute and deducts that much "gold" from the account. HOWEVER, if I were ONLY an American Citizen, then I wouldn't legally be ALLOWED to do so.

Tell me why that's so Arthur? Why does the USA make it illegal for Americans?

I don't see the sky falling. LaLa land I think not, people are already spending alternative currencies INSIDE the USA.
 
Michael said:
What's the point?

I didn't get your intention.

As for "time to live in the real world" you can already use gold as a means of transaction if you are lucky enough to have a non US passport. Isn't that odd? I as a dual citizen can open an account, change my currency directly into gold (which is held in physical) then I'm issued a CC which I can then use in the USA to purchase anything a Visa can purchase - including USD. The company makes the exchange on the minute and deducts that much "gold" from the account. HOWEVER, if I were ONLY an American Citizen, then I wouldn't legally be ALLOWED to do so.

Tell me why that's so Arthur? Why does the USA make it illegal for Americans?
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And why do you think this is illegal for Americans?

Merchants don't ask for our passport, so if you have a MC that operates as you claim who would even know?

Living in La la land is thinking Paul is going to get the nomination and the Fed is going away.
 
quadraphonics said:
Well, that and old farts who haven't realized that you can pay for everything with a credit card now (see also: checks). Any time I see anyone under the age of 30 paying with cash, I assume they're either a drug dealer or waiter/bartender/whatever. I stopped carrying cash at all years ago - what's the point? Just makes my wallet bulky and risks getting lost. And I haven't held a $100 bill in years and years - you have to actually go inside a bank and wait in line to get those! Meanwhile, you don't even have to set foot inside a bank to get a mortgage these days...
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Speaking as an old fart, I prefer using cash. It keeps me cognizant of how much money I am spending. I even feel that companies should give a cash discount. After all, I'm saving them at least 2 to 3% in processing fees. Maybe more, depending on the type of "service" they have.
 
Michael
Ever hear of the rape of Nanking? The Japanese can be xenophobic at times. I don't care about Paul's religion, but evolution is science, you would think a doctor would recognize that. Paul wants to end all kinds of things, the fact that some of these things may line up with someone's ideological views seems accidental. I'm sure there are some things I would like to do away with, like spending on faith based institutions, but you can't sucker me in like that. You have to look at the big picture. Austerity, which may sound appealing and commonsensical, doesn't work. We would end up just like Greece. For money (value) to pass through society where it can benefit everyone, it needs to flow, which means spending. We need to spend but spend wisely, take advantage of what we already have and build a sustainable society that can be free from foreign energy.
 
This video will blow your mind away. I don't think there is anybody that can criticize Dr. Paul or ever support Romney after viewing this. You have to remember Dr. Paul is a DOCTOR, he knows what he is talking about. And Romney? He is after all, just a shill of all the interests of the corporatocracy's interests that are lined up against the prospects of what the decriminalization and legalization of marijuana would do to the pharmaceutical industry, paper industry, etc.

Ron Paul and Mitt Romney Both Speak To Same Dying Medical Marijuana Patient
 
adoucette said:
And why do you think this is illegal for Americans?

Merchants don't ask for our passport, so if you have a MC that operates as you claim who would even know?

Living in La la land is thinking Paul is going to get the nomination and the Fed is going away.
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The company, according to the founder Peter Schiff, is not allowed to issue the CC to US Citizens. Obviously he's spent a good deal of time studying that aspect of his company and so he knows the law and regulations.

As for Ron Paul getting the nomination, that's a separate issue. He may not, I'm not even sure I want a Libertarian in office at this time. What's important is a lot of people are beginning to see a different side to the story.

Lastly, you didn't make your case against competing currency other than to say it was tried before. That's not a very logical argument. According to that line of reasoning we shouldn't have tried Democracy, the Romans and Greeks had tried it and it didn't work then and so it won't work now. Can you see the logical flaw? We're living in a different time and place compared with 300 years ago. It's now possible to convert currency instantaneously on the spot from one type into another. It's a whole different world.

AND even this is besides the point. Who am I and who are you to think we can dictate what other Citizens can and can not do with their private wealth? If they want to create their own currency, they should have the legal right to do so - whether anyone thinks it's a good idea or not a good idea. THAT is the essence of America - having freedom FROM government violence. You OTOH seem to think government violence is moral. This is why I moved philosophically from Liberalism which is collective violence to Libertarianism which is non-violent.
 
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spidergoat said:
Michael
Ever hear of the rape of Nanking? The Japanese can be xenophobic at times. I don't care about Paul's religion, but evolution is science, you would think a doctor would recognize that. Paul wants to end all kinds of things, the fact that some of these things may line up with someone's ideological views seems accidental. I'm sure there are some things I would like to do away with, like spending on faith based institutions, but you can't sucker me in like that. You have to look at the big picture. Austerity, which may sound appealing and commonsensical, doesn't work. We would end up just like Greece. For money (value) to pass through society where it can benefit everyone, it needs to flow, which means spending. We need to spend but spend wisely, take advantage of what we already have and build a sustainable society that can be free from foreign energy.
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Yes, for money to work it does need to flow freely. That's not what's happening. Thanks to crony capitalists on WallStreet it's heads they win, tails you loose. Money is flowing AWAY from where it's needed on Mainstreet into mega Too-Big-Too-Fail Bankopolies who vacuum most money into their coffers leaving Mainstreet only with debt.

Even Arthur's smug post reported that the top few banks have Trillions in capital. These need to be broken up with anti-trust monopoly laws and we need currency competitions so you're not FORCED to eat the shit they're feeding you.

The reason the Federal Reserve was able to bail out it's buddies on Wall Street is because they had YOU the cattle to sell them to. You are literally being promised to China and Japan and now the Banks. It's your future labor that was and is used to bail out WallStreet. I'm not sure if you get that. It's YOU and your labor that's going to pay back with interest these debts. Austerity is coming under the current system whether you want it to or not. It's already here. The free ride is over, if you missed it, well you missed it. The Chinese are not going to keep working for $2 and hour so you can buy three iPhones a year. We will adjust our lifestyle and it is going to be austere compared to how things were. That's reality. Americans and Europeans lived life on debt, and were told by these CC companies and banks to buy now and pay later, told by Technocrats they didn't need to save (saving was bad) and they should consume - even Bush Jr came out after 9/11 and didn't reassure the Nation, he told the Cattle / Americans to go out and mindlessly spend money following 9/11. Well guess what? All the while Americans and English were partying and going into debt, selling of our industry for some shinny beads, the Germans, Japanese and Chinese were working, saving and investing. Obviously they want to be paid back for their hard work.


Paul would liquify some of the debt, some of the mega banks will go bankrupt, government services will have to shrink, we can be free of many debts (why should YOU pay for someone else's decision to buy a fourth house?) - we will have to pay some obligations, but, not the bank bailouts.

That aside, it's immoral to stick a new born child with $70,000 in debt because people wanted three cheap iPhones, 5 rental properties and full benefits when they retire. It is immoral. Each generation is incumbent to pay their own way. That's why so many young people support Paul. They know that the babyboomers could give a toss about them, they'll be long dead when the huge debt repayments are due. It's already been 5 years of bailing out mega banks and they're only more greedier, more sinister, MF Global was so brazen they stole money right out of people's bank accounts!

I understand change is a little scary, but, just try and remember that's how Americans felt when we fought the revolution. Many migrated to Canada in support of the King and out of fear of change. If you really want change, you're going to have to vote Paul. If you don't, if you think things are fine, then it doesn't really matter - Obama, Romney, hell you could put Cheney in office, you'll only get more of the same.
 
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spidergoat said:
We need to spend but spend wisely, take advantage of what we already have and build a sustainable society that can be free from foreign energy.
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Why would government spending be better than private spending on alternative energy?

I've invested my own personal wealth into an alternative energy company. I don't expect them to see any decent returns for 10+ years. I support their research, I know a little about what they do, and I think yes the USA needs to move from oil dependency.

As I've said, we all want the same thing in the end. It's just getting there that's tricky.
 
Michael said:
The company, according to the founder Peter Schiff, is not allowed to issue the CC to US Citizens. Obviously he's spent a good deal of time studying that aspect of his company and so he knows the law and regulations.
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There is nothing illegal about Americans investing, owning or selling gold.

So, if there ARE actual regulations then just don't say there are, POINT TO THEM.
 
Michael said:
Lastly, you didn't make your case against competing currency other than to say it was tried before.
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Never made that argument.
Just said it was a dumb idea.
It is.

It's now possible to convert currency instantaneously on the spot from one type into another.
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Yeah just ask the street vendor to exchange NH dollars for a hot dog in New Jersey.
No, they would need to be physically exchanged.
Incredibly stupid.

AND even this is besides the point. Who am I and who are you to think we can dictate what other Citizens can and can not do with their private wealth? If they want to create their own currency, they should have the legal right to do so - whether anyone thinks it's a good idea or not a good idea. THAT is the essence of America - having freedom FROM government violence.
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No, the essence of America starts with our Constitution and Section 10 prohibits states from making their own money.

For good reason.
 
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