The Para People

If it had been objectively established that PsychoticEpisode was an idiot then your question would be valid and any intent to be insulting would be revealed in probing your emotional biases. The flip-side is the question is a valid one.

If it had not been objectively established that PsychoticEpisode was an idiot then the question would very likely be intended as an insult; however, probing of emotional bias would reveal the intent as there could be the case where you had the evidence to establish PsychoticEpisode is an idiot but didn't share it yet.

None of this of course is either here nor there. What really matters is the core question: Why do claimants of the paranormal insist their claims are true despite absence of evidence supporting their claims and presence of evidence contradicting their claims? Draqons nuclear attack threat simulation dream being claimed as objectively seeing the 911 WTC attack six months in advance is a good example. If you look through this subforum you will find many threads where people issue fantastic claims and weasel out of demonstrating their claims. You will also find a few threads where people go through with the demonstration and encounter a 100% failure rate.
 
I have no nothing against psychoticepisode. I didn't mean what I said, I said it without any emotion attached to it at all. I can get emotional, this wasn't it.

He's probably pretty damn smart.

Aside,
people who claim to have psychic powers despite gathered evidence often do so because that gathered evidence does not provide them with ample reasoning. The evidence says can't be done and they experience doing it.

Plus, there is a lot of considerable evidence that it might be legit, just misunderstood. I am not saying that people can fly and teleport or see through time, but that there is evidence that hints at the possibility of psychic potential and manifestation.

Now...your walking along all is normal. Then you experience something odd. You can feel your mind merging to with tree. What the shit??? It catches you off guard. You can brush it off, explain it rationally to yourself. And then it happens again and again, and with it comes sudden new awareness. Do you...continue to go with the evidence that says it is not real or do you tend to then believe the real experience as reoccurs over time?
Would you go lock yourself up?

Here's one very strange story. A friend of mine and I were sparring when he saw through the window a light ball hovering and jumping randomly in
someone's backyard. I didn't believe it. Then half a minute later it came back and I saw it standing next to him as he saw it. It hovered outside our window until I ran off scared, setting a trigger hysteria that caused my friend to run off too.

My dad is extremely logical and rational, very scientific. He doesn't believe in ghost, esp, or anything psychic. He told me it was ball-lightning, something that rarely happens that causes electro-magnetic energy to form a ball and behave strangely for a few seconds before evaporating.

My friend isn't psychic. He could care less. I didn't give a damn about psychic stuff either back then. But we both remarked that the light behaved as though it was aware of us. You have to be there yourself, description fails.
Did we both share the same hullicination? I doubt it and if we did then it would only proof esp. Thinking back, I can't forget that feeling of life it pervaded.

When something like that occurs you begin to have doubts about definitions that do not match your direct experience. Ball-lightning is the best answer science has got from its perspective, but I felt that is was alive. So did my friend. It behaved and moved slowly at us as if it know damn well we were alive too. Ball-lightning?
 
Jozen-Bo said:
I have no nothing against psychoticepisode. I didn't mean what I said, I said it without any emotion attached to it at all. I can get emotional, this wasn't it.
Click to expand...

I know, you made that quite clear in the original post.

Jozen-Bo said:
Aside,
people who claim to have psychic powers despite gathered evidence often do so because that gathered evidence does not provide them with ample reasoning. The evidence says can't be done and they experience doing it.
Click to expand...

In cases of odd experiences, alot of time people simply don't know what they are experiencing... so they fill that void with whatever their imagination can rationalize rather than leaving it as an open question.


Jozen-Bo said:
Plus, there is a lot of considerable evidence that it might be legit, just misunderstood. I am not saying that people can fly and teleport or see through time, but that there is evidence that hints at the possibility of psychic potential and manifestation.

Now...your walking along all is normal. Then you experience something odd. You can feel your mind merging to with tree. What the shit??? It catches you off guard. You can brush it off, explain it rationally to yourself. And then it happens again and again, and with it comes sudden new awareness. Do you...continue to go with the evidence that says it is not real or do you tend to then believe the real experience as reoccurs over time?
Would you go lock yourself up?
Click to expand...

I would first ask, what does "feeling your mind merge with a tree" mean? Let's clearly define the knowns.

Jozen-Bo said:
Here's one very strange story. A friend of mine and I were sparring when he saw through the window a light ball hovering and jumping randomly in
someone's backyard. I didn't believe it. Then half a minute later it came back and I saw it standing next to him as he saw it. It hovered outside our window until I ran off scared, setting a trigger hysteria that caused my friend to run off too.

My dad is extremely logical and rational, very scientific. He doesn't believe in ghost, esp, or anything psychic. He told me it was ball-lightning, something that rarely happens that causes electro-magnetic energy to form a ball and behave strangely for a few seconds before evaporating.

My friend isn't psychic. He could care less. I didn't give a damn about psychic stuff either back then. But we both remarked that the light behaved as though it was aware of us. You have to be there yourself, description fails.
Did we both share the same hullicination? I doubt it and if we did then it would only proof esp. Thinking back, I can't forget that feeling of life it pervaded.

When something like that occurs you begin to have doubts about definitions that do not match your direct experience. Ball-lightning is the best answer science has got from its perspective, but I felt that is was alive. So did my friend. It behaved and moved slowly at us as if it know damn well we were alive too. Ball-lightning?
Click to expand...

I would start by asking you to draw a realistic picuture using photosop superimposed with a picture of the environment you saw the light in. I would ask for details of how all your senses perceived the light as well as what behaviors the light displayed that made you think it was aware of you.

This is again a question of 'what was that'. If you've concluded ghosts, aliens, pyrokenesis, ... whatever then you have actively given into your imagination.

On a sidenote, I found this rather interesting article:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/livescience/20080125/sc_livescience/lonelinessbreedsbeliefinsupernatural
 
I am? Photons are not matter (they have no mass), and yet I know they exist. Dimensions are not matter (length, width, height, time, etc.) and yet I know they exist. That seems to go against the definition of a materialist. Personally I am hoping that m-theory pan's out as being valid and it predicts quite a robust reality of which our universe is only a small part of. Again that goes up against the definition of a materialist.
 
Crunchy Cat said:
I am? Photons are not matter (they have no mass), and yet I know they exist. Dimensions are not matter (length, width, height, time, etc.) and yet I know they exist. That seems to go against the definition of a materialist. Personally I am hoping that m-theory pan's out as being valid and it predicts quite a robust reality of which our universe is only a small part of. Again that goes up against the definition of a materialist.
Click to expand...

no, all that is material.
 
”In cases of odd experiences, alot of time people simply don't know what they are experiencing... so they fill that void with whatever their imagination can rationalize rather than leaving it as an open question.“

A lot of the time they don't know but not always. But isn't that what science does to describe a general experience of reality? It uses the imagination to rationalize then tries to proof if the logic is right or wrong; to fill the void rather than leaving an open question? And yes they will seek some explanation, and there are thousands of sources providing them. Usually their final definition is based on the sources most prevalent and conforming to their own predisposition of reality.

”I would first ask, what does "feeling your mind merge with a tree" mean? Let's clearly define the knowns.“

How would I know? I don't recall merging with a tree myself. I do recall reading about someone describe the experience. I guess you would never know what it really means unless it happened to you.

”I would start by asking you to draw a realistic picture using photoshop superimposed with a picture of the environment you saw the light in. I would ask for details of how all your senses perceived the light as well as what behaviors the light displayed that made you think it was aware of you."

I now live on the other side of the planet. How do I get into the apartment when no one I know lives there any longer? We where on the second floor and the sun had just set. Heres the behavior, it hovered in one spot, 2 or 3 feet outside and above the window. It then moved down, not straight, but on a curved slope. You could describe it as peering...best fit. My fucking eyes were blinded!!! It lit up even brighter as it got closer to the window. My heart
was jumping and my hairs were raising. It was putting on a good act for being just a light.


"This is again a question of 'what was that'. If you've concluded ghosts, aliens, pyrokenesis, ... whatever then you have actively given into your imagination."

I never said ghost, aliens, pyrokenesis???? I said it felt like it was alive...period. It moved like something not dead...It responded to our looking at it...moving towards the window as if to see us in the apartment. Then it got ultra blinding bright...like fuck...what shit is it doing!!!! If I could only of stayed to find out, but I was young, scared, and shocked.
 
Jozen-Bo said:
”In cases of odd experiences, alot of time people simply don't know what they are experiencing... so they fill that void with whatever their imagination can rationalize rather than leaving it as an open question.“

A lot of the time they don't know but not always. But isn't that what science does to describe a general experience of reality? It uses the imagination to rationalize then tries to proof if the logic is right or wrong; to fill the void rather than leaving an open question? And yes they will seek some explanation, and there are thousands of sources providing them. Usually their final definition is based on the sources most prevalent and conforming to their own predisposition of reality.
Click to expand...

Science is just a process that people can use to ask reality questions and it doesn't fill gaps... people fill them. Those people may use science or fanatasy to fill them; however, those whom don't use fantasy as a filler will usually acknowledge a gap and put it on the backburner if there is no objective knowledge available to fill it.


Jozen-Bo said:
”I would first ask, what does "feeling your mind merge with a tree" mean? Let's clearly define the knowns.“

How would I know? I don't recall merging with a tree myself. I do recall reading about someone describe the experience. I guess you would never know what it really means unless it happened to you.
Click to expand...

Well, then the person describing the experience would be the one to answer my question.


Jozen-Bo said:
I now live on the other side of the planet. How do I get into the apartment when no one I know lives there any longer? We where on the second floor and the sun had just set. Heres the behavior, it hovered in one spot, 2 or 3 feet outside and above the window. It then moved down, not straight, but on a curved slope. You could describe it as peering...best fit. My fucking eyes were blinded!!! It lit up even brighter as it got closer to the window. My heart
was jumping and my hairs were raising. It was putting on a good act for being just a light.
Click to expand...

Take a photo of an approximate building in your area and do the photoshop image. The behavior you described is movement from point A to point B downwards along a slope. There is no evidence that it was a sentient life form of any kind capable of 'peering'... but I think you naturally anthropomorphized the light; thus, giving its behavior in human terms. That is a biological defense mechanism that helps people better identify threats and opportunities.


Jozen-Bo said:
I never said ghost, aliens, pyrokenesis???? I said it felt like it was alive...period. It moved like something not dead...It responded to our looking at it...moving towards the window as if to see us in the apartment. Then it got ultra blinding bright...like fuck...what shit is it doing!!!! If I could only of stayed to find out, but I was young, scared, and shocked.
Click to expand...

Nope you never did say that of course. I was merely exemplifying the act of conclusion (not necessarily the one you chose). I don't think you collected enough behavioral information to demonstrate it actually responded to you looking at it. It got closer to the window and brighter a single time.


I want to show you a thread which stirred the imagination of one of our members as it is similar in context. Ultimately I think we found 'what' the mysterious entity really was but I want to show you how imagination and anthropomorphism can really act as a truth block. I'll see if I can dig it up.
 
Jozen-Bo said:
I felt that is was alive. So did my friend. It behaved and moved slowly at us as if it know damn well we were alive too. Ball-lightning?
Click to expand...

Not sure what is paranormal about this experience. The evidence, a personal eyewitness account, for paranormal activity was that it seemed to follow you around, enough so that you concluded the light was alive and sentient.

Speaking of following you around, I half expected MedWoman to enter the picture here and espouse on the ancient belief of a Sun god or Moon goddess.

Anyway, it appears that a general belief in the paranormal is required before one witnesses a paranormal event. If I saw something seemingly unworldly, I might pause and admire it before trying to rationalize or establish just exactly what type of natural phenomenon it was that I had just witnessed.

Is a favorable predisposition to paranormal activity required before it manifests itself? IOW, if I am predisposed to not believing in anything paranormal, am I less likely to see any activity?
 
PsychoticEpisode said:
People who claim they have some type of paranormal ability. Are they disturbed or do they need to feel special? Are they unwitting or genuine frauds? Are they suffering from some deep neurosis or revelling in the belief they have been given a gift from whatever or whomever? Are they influenced by the many forms of media? Are their imaginations out of control? Are they experiencing some kind of narcotic effect from chemical imbalances in the brain?

To prove a point, when I was a bit younger I slept in haunted houses, cemeteries, and even pitched a tent on a battlefield and never experienced any spookiness. Sure I heard noises but nothing unusual. I was hoping but nothing showed up. Tried everything from Ouija to ESP testing, had a few coincidences along the way but again, nothing major.

Hallucinatory drugs were excellent for a vision or two. You'd swear they were real. Hell, I even had a conversation with Christ, flew around with God and levitated above my bed all in one night after a bad pizza with magic mushrooms. Most kids experiment with a drug or two and I wonder if at some point people accept hallucinations or don't recognize a vision as a product of a stimulated imagination. Are the Para People somewhat schizo, in another reality all to themselves? Hearing voices & seeing apparitions that are real for them but not to a skeptic like myself.
Click to expand...


I've had a paranormal experiences. It's how to destinguish the statistics i think from something definately ''out there,'' than to something created ''in here.''
 
Well I'll say this for prophesy, prophesy is the ablity of forsight: to see things before they or it happens.
To be able to prosphesy a human must be able to calculate at the speed of light, enabling the the person to witness the forces that bring about human preformance, the events that cause a human or group of humans to respond.
The human brain is made up of atoms, and atoms generate light and velocities greater than the speed of light given this as a condition of atoms that are in the brains of humans, humans who have a brain can interpert events that will happen in the future.

For example some people have the abltiy to predict earthquakes, they are able to predict earth quakes because they get very high pitched sounds in their ears and so they know when one will occur, or has occured silently. The high pitch that they hear is caused by the senstivity of the calcium crystals in their ears, which produce electrical waves to the brain that we as humans call sound. much simular to this are people that hear radio music due to the calcium crystals within the ears. These calcium crystals not only transmit sound to the brain but are also used by the brain to determine human balance, such as when you walk or ride a bike, the calcium crystals are sensitive to gravity and so alert the brain to keep the human body upright.
As said earlier these crystals are also known to cause people to hear radio stations broadcasted by radio station( and no a audio speaker is not used) many people hear radios all or you hear radiowaves that are broad casted through the are or the static of them, and that is why radio stations are monitored by a regulation agency of your goverment. some radio waves produce a subliminal effect that you are not concious of and so they are subliminal messages.
Try some time to go to a very quite place that is surround by concrete, or a place that blocks radio transmission you will find a difference in you response behavior.
Humans as well emitt radio wave, and microwaves and so humans can actually achieve partial telepathy. being able to receieve than to transmit. so it appears that it would be easier to prophesy than to preform telekensis.

I seem to have some vague mathmatic memory where in order to prophesy the abllty increase as the individivual slows down, don't take me for grant on that, but it goes I think something along those lines.


DwayneD.L.Rabon
 
People who faithfully trust in the truth of a prophesy may have a propensity for making sure it comes true, either deliberately or unknowingly.
 
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