Well look at the words you have used and the context they were used in and be more considerate and honest in future.
Greatest I am said:
If that was some sort of dig at me when you say "our friend here", you have totally underestimated me.
The history of sexism...where did it begin? Why? Can we rid our world of it?
- Thread starter wegs
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If that was some sort of dig at me when you say "our friend here", you have totally underestimated me.
Each species would have evolved its own characteristics regarding this. I would say this (what you have suggested) is NOT true for all species. It is certainly describes the cat family where the dominant males will kill off defenseless male kittens. (You can see it is easier to remove competition at this age rather than after they have grown up.)
With humans who descended from Ape like ancestors, do apes behave like this? Don't they have a more inclusive society keeping the younger males there in the group in case of "war" with rival clans.
It would depend on the needs of the species and what produces the best survival value.
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I don't think he meant any ill will towards you. There was a guy posting in here, making sexist comments and such...think that's who he might have meant.
I don't imagine anyone here thinks of you as a sexist.
I don't think he meant any ill will towards you. There was a guy posting in here, making sexist comments and such...think that's who he might have meant.
I don't imagine anyone here thinks of you as a sexist.
At least I think Robittybob is a nice Australian gentleman
From New Zealand actually, but Australia is close. Thanks.
For the last two years I have tended to stay on threads discussing gravity and the Universe (as examples) and stayed away from the ones dealing with sociology. I hope I'm not a sexist, that is why I delayed before joining the thread.I don't think he meant any ill will towards you. There was a guy posting in here, making sexist comments and such...think that's who he might have meant.
I don't imagine anyone here thinks of you as a sexist.
There was an interesting news clip on CNN about the "Red Brigade", a women's movement in India claiming equality. Look into it.
"Indian Women 'Worst Time For a Girl To Be Born' Fight Back"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WtCkWsyR1OA
"India's rebels in red take on sexual predators"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GIrpDEl2Qt4
sculptor
Valued Senior Member
how true
however
let us examine the practices of the forest people(pigmys) of central africa.
at puberty, the young males are forced out of the tribe to a "young men's tribe" where they live away from parents and relatives until
they are invited to become adults, and go through some rather painful rituals. Once done, they are invited to rejoin the tribe, find a mate, and live as a member of the tribe. (some do the ritual thing first, then the young men's tribe) The young women do not leave their families until wed.
This has the advantage of creating a very stable society. When young men have reached the age wherein they need to rebel, they do not rebel against society, they rebel back into society.
Lion males do not kill their own offspring. But it is common for them to kill the cubs of the previous male head of the pride.
Still, as the young males grow, they are encouraged to leave the pride, and roam alone or in the company of another young male until they can join a different pride. Females ain't treated this way.
While this behaviour does not hold true for all species, nor for all the time, it is well rooted in certain societal behaviours for our species as well as for others.
Knowing that there is a tendency toward sexism, however does not mean that we, as humans, can do no different.
(anecdote)
When I was in grade school, I was terrible at ball sports. There was a girl(Terri) in my class who was far and away superior to me and most of the guys when playing baseball. We had a system wherein the "team captains" had to chose teem mates in rotation. Some of the guys were already sexist, and when I had to choose opposed to one of them, I would have the freedom to choose the better guys first,(knowing that he would not chose terri till all the guys were chosen) then when we were down to one guy left, I'd chose Terri.
Whenever anyone choses team mates, collegues, or employees based on sex, they have earned the right to lose.
I'm endlessly confused when it comes to spelling choose and chose, and loose and lose. - sorry
What human societies impose on their subjects isn't really genetic. From my studies instincts are genetically passed on. So what the cats do could be more genetically based. What the true human instinct is, gosh how would you ever know?
Could it be simply there is none but we just learn from our parents/society? So is it forever changing as society develops?
sculptor
Valued Senior Member
yeh, my spelling sux on a good day, but as long as the reader can guess well as to my meaning................
I suspect that the "true human instinct" is for a matriarchal society. Maybe that's why some guys behave with offensive posturing to overcome their natural sense of inferiority?
"True human instinct" isn't that complex. It doesn't have a clear organizational goal, like a matriarchal society, democracy or a justice system. The only goal for evolution of instincts is survival. Since we have a big brain that has been developing for a while we have a lot of those instincts; these give rise to complex emergent behaviors like societies, militaries etc. However, these are not due to an inherent desire for these things, but rather the interplay of our various instincts. (Example - killing people of different religions is not an instinct; but combine our instinctive dislike of "other" and our instinct to look to a pack leader when threatened and you have a combination that is fertile ground for religious wars.)
Compare it to the behavior of ants. Ants exhibit some very complex behavior (farms, trash piles, cemeteries) but that's not because any ants plan for farms. They have very simple instincts which, in combination with other ants and the environment, give rise to some pretty complex behaviors.
Thus early societies were based on the fairly complex interaction of all these simple instincts. Later on, as we developed more intelligence, we started to make more deterministic decisions; we wanted a society in which X was true so we passed laws and then obeyed them even when our instincts told us not to - because we were finally able to override those early instincts. Thus increases in human rights, more freedom for people throughout the world etc.
Peacocks do the same thing and I don't think they have a "natural sense of inferiority!" Mating displays are common in mammals; we're not that different.
That has thrown me back to that genetically wired question again.Well, that could be...genetics loads the gun, but our experiences and upbringing pull the trigger.
"Are we biologically wired to a degree, to want different things from the opposite sex?" For by "biologically wired" one would think we are talking about instinct.
Can you show me an example of this behaviour?
Greatest I am
Valued Senior Member
What tribes are you speaking of?
There is often male and female barracks in tribes but not usually any ostracism of males.
Please be specific.
Regards
DL
Greatest I am
Valued Senior Member
@ robittybob...I REALLY like that ..,thanks for posting it. Yeah, that's quite true. I will write more later when I'm not using this stupid phone. Never again will I buy an apple product. :/
@ sculptor...I know u
I will disagree because that would be like saying racism is something we're born with too, and I'm of the opinion, sexism like racism is a learned behavior or attitude towards one group of ppl.
But, you are saying maybe our gender roles are somehow encoded? That's interesting.
Our gender roles are encoded. It has to be in an animal that needs another of it's kind to breed and reproduce.
Like it or not, some are born gay. I do not discriminate against gays as they cannot help being what they are anymore than heterosexuals, but they are defects as far as a reproducing species is concerned.
Their encoding has somehow been damaged to anti-survival in terms of reproduction.
Regards
DL
Greatest I am
Valued Senior Member
@ Greatest I am
Guilty is like being wrong. My concern was being wronged. So if you didn't have me "particularly in mind", who then were you referring to when you said, "like our friend here" in that particular post? And explain why as well please?
http://www.sciforums.com/showthread...-world-of-it&p=3097595&viewfull=1#post3097595
When a person says he is a gnostic Christian, I would expect a high level of honesty. Lie to the Holy Spirit and you could be on your way. I think occasionally of the story of Ananias and Sapphira Acts 5:1-11, and you should too.
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Acts+5:1-11&version=NIV
Been reading and re-reading this thread the last 3 or 4 days.
Seem to have noticed a couple of quirky things.
Would or could a misogynist or lothario be said to be exhibiting sexism, or be a sexist ?
Would a person of either sex (male or female), that was afraid of the opposite sex, be exhibiting sexism ?
Seem to have noticed a couple of quirky things.
Would or could a misogynist or lothario be said to be exhibiting sexism, or be a sexist ?
Would a person of either sex (male or female), that was afraid of the opposite sex, be exhibiting sexism ?
I think since these conditions have their own definitions, they are their own condition and would NOT be directly classed as sexism.
Also if you were "afraid of the opposite sex" that could be one of the phobias.
Have you picked up on anything within the thread?
To refresh my memory I looked up "lothario" - lothario (plural lotharios)
A man whose chief interest is seducing, usually women. (from Wiktionary)
Hey;
A misogynist loathes women; he has a deep disdain for them. Goes without saying that such a person would be sexist. But a person who is sexist, isn't necessarily a misogynist. Misogynists usually have serious mother issues and thus take their rage out on other women. They are often good looking "players," who like to surround themselves by the very thing they hate...women.
Some can be introverts too.
To your second question, ppl that are afraid of the opposite sex ...like maybe feel inferior, may have sexist tendencies to over compensate for their insecure feelings around the opposite sex. Sexism is a put down so whoever does it, it's because he/she has resentment of some type with the opposite sex.