yet the UFO believer dismisses it with simplistic justifications that include the routine rhetoric that "oil wells don't fly to altitudes of
X." This rebuttal is both un-informed and juvenile in its value, since the detailed explanation that included the oil wells at Campeche clearly gave the reason why they would seem as high as they were."[/quote
I wasnt talking about the apparent or actual height of the objects rather their movement relative the aircrafts.
The patent dismissal of such explanations comes not from objectivity but from hope and desire. The space alien hypothesis, it would seem, strokes the same place in the human mind as the god hypothesis.
Youre debating with the 'ufo believer' caricature in your head again, it makes communication near impossible at times when someone elses values and approaches are presumed to be my own. It actually blows my mind that youd be presumptious enough to assume that i belief in space aliens simply because i stated that the oil well hypthesis didnt give a good fit explaination relative to the data.
There are others. If you want another copy of the report, I have it in both pdf and Word. PM me with your email address and I'd be happy to forward it to you.
I'll pm you after ive posted this reply, thanks.
I disagree, but unless one of us is willing to amass a collection of reports and look at their characteristics, demonstrating one side of this argument or the other would be moot indeed. However, I think even you must agree that many (in my opinion, most) reports include assumptions like "it was something not of this Earth" or "the movements were not like any terrestrial craft."
Its been a year since ive read the core testimonies so id really have to read them all over again, but from what i remember more offen than not there was no suggestion to the craft being otherworldy.
With this point I strongly disagree. Perhaps its my age and the fact that I remember all too well the science fiction movies and television shows that portrayed aliens nearly exactly the way modern lore and mythology does. UFOs and aliens have been very much, perhaps even more, a part of public imagination and fiction in the 1950s and 1960s than they were during X-Files. I used the X-Files as a modern analog since this is a very recognizable form of pop-culture today, even after its cancellation years ago. But early science fiction depictions of UFOs and aliens were a craze and flooded comic books, movies, and television shows.
Fair point, sci-fi was no doubt every bit as popular back then as it is now.
Then you are dismissing this possibility? Is this objective?
Im not dismissing it, but at the same time i wouldnt use it as a sole reason to ignore an entire body of data.
Indeed these were good photos. Such that, those experienced with military maneuvers (myself included) recognized the very nature of the objects. Illumination rounds. An assertion that was confirmed by those involved in the exercise that occurred in the military range that was just beyond the mountain where the flares became obscured from view in Phoenix. Other sightings were planes, as confirmed –again- by those involved in the exercise as well as a ground-based observer (a amateur astronomer) whose observation was completely ignored by the popular media, perhaps because it de-sensationalized the event. This was discussed at length in another thread here if you're willing to search for it.
Interesting i didnt know that, i'll definitely have a good read of that thread latter.
But that still doesn't imply that the quantity or quality of UFO images has increased. In the 1970s and 1980s UFO images were far more common (again, I'm speaking from my memory of the period). Lately, the number of images has decreased considerably. But again, this is a point that someone would need to objectively quantify before it can be laid to rest. Until then, we simply disagree on the point. I haven't the time to collect UFO image data at this time, perhaps you do.
Well it seems as though more ufos are being caught on film to me, and seeing as everyone has access to a camera phone or mini cam-corder these days catching one has never been easier. Although yes this could simply be how it appears, prehaps more ufos were filmed back in the 70s and 80s, i'll try and see if i can find any data to support either view...
Your point is well taken. I have an idea on a way to demonstrate that assertion, perhaps if I get the time I'll implement it.
