Religious Tolerance

[PsychoticEpisode]

I take it religious tolerance isn't big in your books

My tolerance wanes when confronted with religious philosophy, passages, parables and/or amusing anecdotes. I admit it.

As for your cutesy little proverb, I find it totally bogus and meaningless when we don't know who said it. I suppose if someone who is considered of high moral, spiritual or religious importance were to have first shouted it out that it would have more bearing than if for instance Joe the plumber had said it.

 

[lightgigantic]

My tolerance wanes when confronted with religious philosophy, passages, parables and/or amusing anecdotes. I admit it.

well that will be your achilles heel in all such discussions
Philosophy is the front door to all meaningful discussions, regardless of which topic is at hand

As for your cutesy little proverb, I find it totally bogus and meaningless when we don't know who said it. I suppose if someone who is considered of high moral, spiritual or religious importance were to have first shouted it out that it would have more bearing than if for instance Joe the plumber had said it.

with a little inquiry you can determine the context

 

[PsychoticEpisode]

well that will be your achilles heel in all such discussions

Philosophically speaking?

Philosophy is the front door to all meaningful discussions

I guess that eliminates religion.

with a little inquiry you can determine the context

The ultimate philosophical question....Why?

 

[GeoffP]

The key phrase - DO UNTO OTHERS.. It imposes a need for action. It is not passive and it inherently assumes you know what is good for others based on your own perception. I.e. it is not tolerant of what others think might be best for them.

Respects, but I think you're misreading this quote. The full quote is "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you." In other words, treat others as you would wish to be treated. I don't think it could be construed in a prosetylizing way, since it would mean that you yourself (as a Christian) would want other religions prosetylizing to you.

If we wanted to take a contrary point to your argument, it also implies that you should actively help others instead of ignoring them.

Geoff

 

[lightgigantic]

Philosophically speaking?

of course too much philosophy can be an insanity in itself, but if you transgress it, ALL discussion becomes impossible

I guess that eliminates religion.

given that it is practcially impossible to separate issues of philosophy from issues of religion, I don't see how

The ultimate philosophical question....Why?

to which there is the ultimate philosophical replu .... Why what?

 

[OilIsMastery]

Jesus hung out with whores and scum. I call that religious tolerance.

 

[iceaura]

Jesus hung out with whores and scum. I call that religious tolerance.

Which illustrates a general point - whores and scum have more religious tolerance than most pious believers.

I don't think it could be construed in a prosetylizing way, since it would mean that you yourself (as a Christian) would want other religions prosetylizing to you.

In practice, it means you would want others proselytizing as Christians to you. After all, you are proselytizing as a Christian - not at all the same thing as proselytizing as a benighted heathen. You aren't doing that, and you don't want others to do that either.

"I'm from the Inquisition, and I'm here to help you " - the Golden Rule in common action.

 

[GeoffP]

No it wouldn't, ice. It means "be nice to people as you would like them to be nice to you". You might make an argument for the Inquisition as a tool to 'help' others (although to be doubly fair the Inquisition was never so heinous as usually made out) but that very, very far from the actual intent.

Best,

Geoff

 

[OilIsMastery]

Which illustrates a general point - whores and scum have more religious tolerance than most pious believers.

Maybe most "pious" believers should convert to Christianity.

 

[Buffalo Roam]

“ Originally Posted by iceaura
Which illustrates a general point - whores and scum have more religious tolerance than most pious believers.

”

Maybe most "pious" believers should convert to Christianity.

Sounds like the Moslems need to take a lesson, they seem to have no tolerance for the social scum, Whores are Stoned, and Gays are Hung, and Converts to Christianity are under sentence of Death.

 

[PsychoticEpisode]

of course too much philosophy can be an insanity in itself, but if you transgress it, ALL discussion becomes impossible

Granted. My philosophy is about 180 Degrees from most.

given that it is practcially impossible to separate issues of philosophy from issues of religion, I don't see how

I have gained little or no practical knowledge or wisdom from religious script. No religious philosophy has ever opened my eyes, except the bizarre and absurd. I don't think I'll experience an epiphany of sorts from religious philosophy.

to which there is the ultimate philosophical reply .... Why what?

That answer is science's stimulant with religion merely being jungle science, a very common variety.

 

[iceaura]

No it wouldn't, ice. It means "be nice to people as you would like them to be nice to you". You might make an argument for the Inquisition as a tool to 'help' others (although to be doubly fair the Inquisition was never so heinous as usually made out) but that very, very far from the actual intent.

The Inquisition was every bit as heinous, and more, as it is ever presented. And its justifications were the best of intentions, Golden Rule and all.

Who would not want their soul cleansed by fire, and free to ascend to heaven ? Who would not want the blessings of forgiveness that can only come from confession of sins?

I don't want the pious being nice to me as they have deluded themselves they would want someone to be nice to them, if they were me, which they aren't. The Golden Rule in the hands of a true believer is a threat.

 

[GeoffP]

Actually, no, it really wasn't as severe as made out. It wasn't nice in any way, but it wasn't Belzen-Belzen either.

I don't want the pious being nice to me as they have deluded themselves they would want someone to be nice to them, if they were me, which they aren't.

Care to explain that? Let's not try to warp common interpretation of doctrine here.

Geoff

 

[Buffalo Roam]

The Inquisition was every bit as heinous, and more, as it is ever presented. And its justifications were the best of intentions, Golden Rule and all.

And in the end the Protestants denounced the Catholic Church for those excess, there are more than a few antecedents of mine who died under the Catholic Inquisition, for having the temerity to tell the Church it was full of Shit, they called them Heretics, and had special executions lined up for them, everything from the Garrote, to Drawing and Quartering, to being Broken on the Wheel ,and lets not forget the special bar-b-ques, Martyrs at the Stake, flame broiled, or if you recanted they just might take pity on you and only Hang You, no drop.

Protestants, never agreed or partook in the savagery of the Catholic Church, and the Inquisition, we were the one to finally bring them to heel.

 

[Prince_James]

Buffalo Roam:

And in the end the Protestants denounced the Catholic Church for those excess, there are more than a few antecedents of mine who died under the Catholic Inquisition, for having the temerity to tell the Church it was full of Shit, they called them Heretics, and had special executions lined up for them, everything from the Garrote, to Drawing and Quartering, to being Broken on the Wheel ,and lets not forget the special bar-b-ques, Martyrs at the Stake, flame broiled, or if you recanted they just might take pity on you and only Hang You, no drop.

Protestants, never agreed or partook in the savagery of the Catholic Church, and the Inquisition, we were the one to finally bring them to heel.

You seem to forget that Protestants were just as vicious to those who they denounced. Thus burning witches at the stake in the PUritan colony of Salem, Massachusetts...

Or the 30 Years War in Germany...

Or the Protestant "Cromwelling" of Ireland.

The Protestants add to this utter doctrinal indefensibility and error. At least Catholics get Christianity correct.

 

[lightgigantic]

I have gained little or no practical knowledge or wisdom from religious script. No religious philosophy has ever opened my eyes, except the bizarre and absurd. I don't think I'll experience an epiphany of sorts from religious philosophy.

It wouldn't be at all difficult to trace whatever philosophical assertions you hold back to their theistic origins

No prizes for guessing where even science picked up these 5 foundational assumptions from

That answer is science's stimulant with religion merely being jungle science, a very common variety.

given the inherent limits of empiricism, it certainly becomes a leap of faith when it is used as an absolute vehicle for the contextualization of all phenomena .... at the very least there is no (empirical) evidence for your claims

 

[PsychoticEpisode]

It wouldn't be at all difficult to trace whatever philosophical assertions you hold back to their theistic origins

That wouldn't surprise me. I'm happy not to be swayed by religious philosophy. I find nothing profound in it. Perhaps myself and others who think like me are the vanguard of some new natural progression towards the extinction of religion. Religion has had a long run, hasn't really accomplished much, time for it to go.

given the inherent limits of empiricism, it certainly becomes a leap of faith when it is used as an absolute vehicle for the contextualization of all phenomena .... at the very least there is no (empirical) evidence for your claims

I've replaced religious philosophy with common sense because they mirror each other. Common sense is...... well.....common to all, just need to know you already have it. That's as philosophical as I can get.

 

[lightgigantic]

That wouldn't surprise me. I'm happy not to be swayed by religious philosophy.

If you think there is something profound about the universe being rational, you have already been swayed I'm afraid

I find nothing profound in it. Perhaps myself and others who think like me are the vanguard of some new natural progression towards the extinction of religion. Religion has had a long run, hasn't really accomplished much, time for it to go.

for as long as death maintains a hundred percent success rate, religion will thrive in some shape or form

I've replaced religious philosophy with common sense because they mirror each other. Common sense is...... well.....common to all, just need to know you already have it. That's as philosophical as I can get.

even philosophers can see the inherent short falls of relative moralism

 

[PsychoticEpisode]

If you think there is something profound about the universe being rational, you have already been swayed I'm afraid

Admittedly, religious philosophers are part of the universe.

for as long as death maintains a hundred percent success rate, religion will thrive in some shape or form

When did life die? Oh-bla-di oh-bla-da!

even philosophers can see the inherent short falls of relative moralism

Absolutely, they see lots of things

 

[SnakeLord]

for as long as death maintains a hundred percent success rate, religion will thrive in some shape or form

Absolutely, it is the one thing you've ever said that I agree with completely.

Beat death and your god becomes some meaningless piece of old poop not worth the paper its printed on - even for the most ardent theists.