religion and atheism from a psychological perspective

A

Asguard

Kiss my dark side
Valued Senior Member
well this will offend everyone equally but nither senario has any evidence behind it. In fact from a psychological perspective they are exactly the same.

Basically there are 3 possable senarios we know about (all others are just combinations of these)

1) there is nothing after death
2) there is something good after death
3) there is something bad after death

Now as we are all afraid of death we are atracted to the choice which best alays our fears. For athiests its the first, not many people pick door number 3 so most thiests pick door number 2 (for themselves anyway)

So in reality none of you who post here are doing anything other than making up fantasies to quite your fears of what hapens next

The only people who move past this are the apathetic agnostics who just dont give a shit what happens next and concentrate on what happens NOW.
 
No, from a psychological perspective, the death of the brain is the end of the thing that makes you distinctly you. This can be tested empirically. There is also another choice: there is no such thing as death.
 
spidergoat

actually no, science doesnt answer the question AT ALL. all it will state as FACT is that your body goes strangly quite and you have a tendancy to get very smelly

And the psychology i was refering to was a debate between a behavioral psychologist and a chirstan as to why people hold belifes be them of something behond or NOTHING behond
 
Asguard said:
well this will offend everyone equally but nither senario has any evidence behind it. In fact from a psychological perspective they are exactly the same.

Basically there are 3 possable senarios we know about (all others are just combinations of these)

1) there is nothing after death
2) there is something good after death
3) there is something bad after death

Now as we are all afraid of death we are atracted to the choice which best alays our fears. For athiests its the first, not many people pick door number 3 so most thiests pick door number 2 (for themselves anyway)

So in reality none of you who post here are doing anything other than making up fantasies to quite your fears of what hapens next

The only people who move past this are the apathetic agnostics who just dont give a shit what happens next and concentrate on what happens NOW.
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Interesting approach. Sorry to add a quibble.

Reincarnation can offer merely more of the same: IOW neither good nor bad.

I think you are going to have to work hard to show that atheists choice of door number one is psychologically appealing to them. How so?
 
What about alpha waves? The brain's activity is detectable, and is certainly the center of personality and consciousness. Even people who's bodies are kept alive may be considered already dead if their brains are not functioning.
 
SA, im trying to find the actual artical. It was quite an interesting debate and was mainly focused at the "belivers crowd". Its ovious to someone who spends time around here that the same can easerly be aplied to the anti-belivers (like Q) as oposed to someone like myself who "just doesnt give a shit".

The most facinating thing about it was that it was from a psychological perspective rather than a theological or dawkins one
 
Asguard said:
SA, im trying to find the actual artical. It was quite an interesting debate and was mainly focused at the "belivers crowd". Its ovious to someone who spends time around here that the same can easerly be aplied to the anti-belivers (like Q) as oposed to someone like myself who "just doesnt give a shit".

The most facinating thing about it was that it was from a psychological perspective rather than a theological or dawkins one
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sounds interesting. I hope you find it. I do think there are psychological reasons why we choose beliefs and these can also be involved in atheism. The trick is to show why a belief that includes a final end is preferable. Or perhaps why it might be psychologically appealing to limit knowledge and ways of gaining knowledge to empiricism. Could be done, but to convince atheists you would probably need more than theory: you would need some sort of empirical study of atheists.

And after that you are bound to hear the phrase....

soft science.

But if you get a link, let us know.
 
Asguard said:
well this will offend everyone equally but nither senario has any evidence behind it. In fact from a psychological perspective they are exactly the same.

Basically there are 3 possable senarios we know about (all others are just combinations of these)

1) there is nothing after death
2) there is something good after death
3) there is something bad after death

Now as we are all afraid of death we are atracted to the choice which best alays our fears. For athiests its the first, not many people pick door number 3 so most thiests pick door number 2 (for themselves anyway)
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Just a few points:
The first problem with this idea is that it's a chicken and egg scenario. Do people get attracted to the choice which best fits their religious beliefs, or does their religion partly depend upon which choice they believe in?

The second problem would be proving that a belief in nothing after death would make everyone fearful. If there is nothing after death then what is there to fear?

The third problem would be those who WANT to believe in something good after death but don't. That displays they are not 'attracted' to a belief on the basis that it dispels their fears.

I'd be interested in reading the article though if you find it.
 
Anti-Flag

why would it depend on proving that a belife in nothing after death causes everyone fear?

I LOVE spiders, doesnt mean arachaphobia isnt real, just means i dont suffer from it (i would have used snakes in that example but i dont know what a phobia of snakes is caused)

Your right that it could me more complex than that and there could be people who want there to be nothing but who belive there is something or vise versa but it doesnt invalidate the psychological argument

for people who want to try to find this artical (because im having zero luck) i BELIVE one of the people involved in the debate was Patricia Row. The other was something or other Atkins (god only knows if thats spelled right, at the time i was driving and trying to scribble there names down from what i briefly herd)
 
Death is bad for an atheist. Two reasons....the first is that it is all over, oblivion, nothing more, done, finished. Secondly what if the theists are right, it's off to hell we go.

In fairness, the first reason is what an atheist expects so it should come as no surprise , and we can't even say 'I told you so'. But should death become part of the theist-atheist debate?

There is a 4th scenario. It is unknown. Actually all off us should accept this scenario for there isn't a person alive that can tell you what happens when you die, no one. God is irrelevant, atheism, theism or anything associated with religion as well. All we can do is guess. In the meantime it would be nice if the world could agree that there is nothing wrong with believing in anything as long as we don't preach it as gospel.

As long as we're talking psychology then it all comes down to human nature. All atheism is concerned with is whether there is a god or not. Life after death is more or less another belief. How atheism became associated with there being no life after death is beyond me.
 
Asguard said:
Basically there are 3 possable senarios we know about (all others are just combinations of these)

1) there is nothing after death
2) there is something good after death
3) there is something bad after death

Now as we are all afraid of death we are atracted to the choice which best alays our fears. For athiests its the first, not many people pick door number 3 so most thiests pick door number 2 (for themselves anyway)

So in reality none of you who post here are doing anything other than making up fantasies to quite your fears of what hapens next
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I disagree. Atheists believe that we cease to exist when we die, but in general that does nothing to allay fears of death. I am an atheist, and I most certainly do not want to cease to exist when I die. I would absolutely love to get to continue to exist in a supernatural paradise after I die, as described by christianity. But I realize that just because I really really want something doesn't mean that it's actually possible or real. The theist world view is definitely much more pleasant than the atheist world view. Sadly, I can't make myself believe something that seems absurd to me simply because it's pleasant.
 
Nasor said:
I disagree. Atheists believe that we cease to exist when we die, but in general that does nothing to allay fears of death. I am an atheist, and I most certainly do not want to cease to exist when I die. I would absolutely love to get to continue to exist in a supernatural paradise after I die, as described by christianity. But I realize that just because I really really want something doesn't mean that it's actually possible or real. The theist world view is definitely much more pleasant than the atheist world view. Sadly, I can't make myself believe something that seems absurd to me simply because it's pleasant.
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Seconded.
 
Asguard said:
Anti-Flag

why would it depend on proving that a belife in nothing after death causes everyone fear?
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In the case of 1) it requires proof because of the original statement:
Now as we are all afraid of death we are atracted to the choice which best alays our fears
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This implies everyone fears death(this alone requires proof), especially in terms of those with a belief in "nothing after death"; you would have to give reason as to why they are fearful.
If the statement is that nobody wants to die then it is understandable, but that doesn't mean everyone fears death.
 
Asguard said:
well this will offend everyone equally but nither senario has any evidence behind it. In fact from a psychological perspective they are exactly the same.

Basically there are 3 possable senarios we know about (all others are just combinations of these)

1) there is nothing after death
2) there is something good after death
3) there is something bad after death

Now as we are all afraid of death we are atracted to the choice which best alays our fears.
Click to expand...
there is however the suggestion that theism, properly applied, allows one to transcend what are commonly held as the limitations of corporeal existence ... IOW its not all fear driven

For athiests its the first, not many people pick door number 3 so most thiests pick door number 2 (for themselves anyway)

So in reality none of you who post here are doing anything other than making up fantasies to quite your fears of what hapens next
Click to expand...
there is however the issue "how do you know that nothing can be known about what happens after death"
:D

The only people who move past this are the apathetic agnostics who just dont give a shit what happens next and concentrate on what happens NOW.
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the problem is what happens NOW determines what happens after death ....
 
lightgigantic said:
there is however the issue "how do you know that nothing can be known about what happens after death"
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I've tried to point out this kind of thing before also. That this is a claim to knowledge.

When one claims there is a god or an afterlife, atheists will see this as a fantastic claim requiring evidence.

When one claims that if there is an afterlife, no one could no what it is like?

or if there is a God, no one could communicate with herm?

etc.

no back up necessary. It is somehow obvious what is possible.
 
PsychoticEpisode said:
Death is bad for an atheist.
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No it isn't.

Two reasons....the first is that it is all over, oblivion, nothing more, done, finished.
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And this is bad how?

Secondly what if the theists are right, it's off to hell we go.
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No, it just means that something happens after death. Being right about that doesn't mean they got anything else right and in particular, do you really think gods are as stupid, mean, petty, jealous and down right evil as the theists make them out to be?

And which theists in particular would be the right ones?

If there is anything after death the one thing you can know for sure is the theists got it dead wrong.
 
swarm said:
No, it just means that something happens after death. Being right about that doesn't mean they got anything else right and in particular, do you really think gods are as stupid, mean, petty, jealous and down right evil as the theists make them out to be?

And which theists in particular would be the right ones?

If there is anything after death the one thing you can know for sure is the theists got it dead wrong.
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I'm not really worried about death, but I wouldn't mind sticking around.

I quite sure not one theist has ever known what happens after you die. Personally I don't think I'll continue anywhere and if I do it will be a surprise.

Again, atheism is about an absence of belief in God and I can't see why afterlife is a concern.
 
wait a minute...what you're saying here doesn't make any sense. how can buying into a theory, when you know that's what you're doing, and you don't have proof, calm a fear?
 
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