Non-theist

[Michael]

you know, when you put it that way, really, I'm not all that sure what the hell Collective Unconscious actually is, I mean, I presumed it's different than culuture - or why the new lexicon? But it seems maybe, we can all come to a certain state of being, or state of understanding, by out collective experences, like when in a movie theator everyone laughs or cries. Maybe that sort of thing happens more than we realize. Our lives being an ongoing openened script ....

 

[Michael]

did I mention I have been drinking?

 

[one_raven]

But it seems maybe, we can all come to a certain state of being, or state of understanding, by out collective experences, like when in a movie theator everyone laughs or cries.

That's an aspect of Collective Consciousness, but that's not what I am talking about.

did I mention I have been drinking?

You didn't have to.

 

[Mr. Hamtastic]

My mind may not be ready for the mental gymnastics required, but I shall attempt to share my thoughts/questions.

My belief is that I have no proof that anything does or does not exist, and reality is based on a series of choices I am forced to make to imagine I exist within it. I have chosen a very stripped down version of christianity, which allows for God to have some competence, and man's incompetence is without limit.

Reading your experiences and philosophy suggests to me that we believe the same thing, and have just come to different conclusions based on it, much a one likes milk chocolate and one likes dark chocolate. I'll try to think of some probing questions, but my brain needs to warm up for awhile.

 

[trafficlight]

think wot u like

The biblical equivalent to Kharma is "you reap what you sow"
I too was over-fed copious quantities of religion which ultimately lead me to a life of rebellion and self-inflicted pain.

 

[one_raven]

The world reaps what you sow - and then some.

 

[trafficlight]

would that depend if sown in the physical or the spiriual ?

 

[Enmos]

One_raven, it's the same thing really (non-theist/atheist). But I understand your point of view.

 

[trafficlight]

one_raven. I think that you have all the ingredients to find the truth but you have grown tired and thrown everything into the pot at once .What you have come out with is unique but needs a bit more salt(Too much yeast)

 

[Mr. Hamtastic]

I don't understand something... are you saying that you passively worship the 'not-consciousness' of the universe?

 

[one_raven]

would that depend if sown in the physical or the spiriual ?

I don't understand the question.

one_raven. I think that you have all the ingredients to find the truth but you have grown tired and thrown everything into the pot at once .What you have come out with is unique but needs a bit more salt(Too much yeast)

This is only one small part of by belief system, and I have tried to encapsulate it all so it is not terribly long and is easier to read.
There is MUCH more to it than this.

My beliefs, for example, are Trinitarian in nature.
This is just the male aspect I am getting into.

I don't understand something... are you saying that you passively worship the 'not-consciousness' of the universe?

No.
I activey worship the synergistic force that comes about as the result of the intricate web of countless interactions of life and matter.

One_raven, it's the same thing really (non-theist/atheist). But I understand your point of view.

No it's not.
I worship this Karma Manifest in much the same way that theists worship their Gods. Pragmatically, it's really no different than a God - other than the fact that it is not cognizant.

While I do not hold any belief in the Metaphysical Truth that Gods exist, neither do I deny that theists' Gods exist as a matter of reality.

I do not have faith in the Gods, but their belief and worship manifest their Gods in reality.
While truth may be distinct and separate from us and beyond our control, we create reality.

All Gods exist.

I think most Gods came about as parable and analogy in an attempt to explain the beliefs, anyway. It's much easier to convey thoughts that way.

Speaking of analogy and parable...
All life exists in the same huge pool of water. Every move anyone makes in the water results in little eddies being formed and echoing outward away from them. These eddies interact with each other. These interactions can be constructive or destructive. If enough beings move in unison, currents are formed. Every splash on the surface creates a ripple. These ripples interact with each other. These interactions can be constructive or destructive. If enough beings move in unison, waves are formed.

Sometime in our history, we learned how to build rafts, canoes, longboats, sailboats, ocean liners and warships.

I have carved my own canoe.

I see most religions as luxury ocean liners. They offer a promise of keeping the passengers high above the water and away from all the “dangers” of life. The passengers have never been in the engine room and have no idea what is happening on the bridge – nor do they care to know. They sit beside the pool, or in the vast dining halls with faith in the captain and crew will take care of all their needs. The massive wake of the ship causes a great deal of disruption and waves in the water and many are caught in the vast and rapid currents. The massive bulk and huge propellers have claimed many lives – not to mention those lives which have been specifically targeted as threats.

Of course there are exceptions.
The Naked Ascetics swim in the water as we did when we were animals, gathering seaweed to survive.
Buddhists, as the ideals were was taught by Siddhartha, gather cast-off scrap from the other boats to lash together rafts and drift in the currents.
Buddhists, in the western traditions I have witnessed, travel in clusters of smaller, fuel efficient, ocean liners. The Captain and Navigator are drunk on the Lido deck with all the passengers. The crew are starry-eyed naives, infatuated with the passengers and crew.

My intention is not to sell a million of my patent pending, hand carved canoes. It is to remind people of the beauty of the water and convince them to try and carve their own.

 

[Mr. Hamtastic]

Your symbolism is poetic, but too much for me, man. We're all a herd of retarded ducks walking down the road. You, like many, have chosen to try out those flappy things, and others have tried water movement. You have thought your way through what religion is, and what you might find within it. Everyone should do that.

 

[one_raven]

There may be knowledge in facts, but there is meaning in poetry.

 

[S.A.M.]

Have you read any Hindu scriptures? I'm sure there is some philosophy that will overlap yours.

 

[one_raven]

I have.
Not nearly as much as Buddhist literature, but I have.
I recently convinced my boss to buy me Rosetta Stone for Hindi and I plan on learning it.

One thing that has influenced me in my search was the concept of the Prana and Akasha.

I have been looking for a specific translation of the Vedas for several years now.

 

[S.A.M.]

If you plan to read the scriptures, its Sanskrit you need to learn. There are no scriptures in Hindi.

Which translation do you need?

 

[one_raven]

I have read a good amount of the Vedas, but as I said I am looking for a specific translation that I am having difficulty locating.

I have a copy of the Gita (have not read it all yet).
I also have a full copy of the Mahabharata, but I haven't touched it yet.
I have read Ramayana - I have a stunningly beautful illustrated version of it - but I want to find the time to read it again.

I have also read a bit of Swami Vivekananda's philosophy and quite a bit of Jiddhu Krishnamurti.

What do you recommend?

 

[S.A.M.]

I prefer the Vedas, but no one I know has read them all [including me, I just read bits and pieces]. The Mahabharata and Ramayana are more theistic than philosophical, as is the Bhagwad Geeta [though they do have excellent verses that are worth perusing]

For you, I would recommend the Rig Ved, the oldest of the Vedas, but you should ideally ask someone who has a better idea.

 

[one_raven]

I know they were written in Sanskrit, but my boss would never have paid for that, and I figured it would be a decent base for when I will learn Sanskrit later - plus I get the impression they will be better translated into Hindi than English.

Which translation do you need?

I have a few pages of the Rg Veda with English and Sanskrit side by side that I was told was translated by Maharishi Mahesh Yogi.

I have combed through all of his books available online and have not found it.
I have checked several Eastern bookstores and talked to a few knowledgable people who are unsure if he has done a translation.
Where I got the few pages insisted it was him, however.
Now I can't ecen recall where I got the pages.

 

[one_raven]

I have read the Rigveda, but it has been years.