Native American Spirituality
- Thread starter Thoreau
- Start date
I know Medicine Woman will be in on this.
I try to think how this country was before the white population came here and really committed genocide among the indigenous peoples who had lived here for at least 20,000 years. To see their cultures smashed and they themselves called "heathens" disturbs me quite a bit. That's one of many reasons that Christianity doesn't do anything for me for those who came here were Christians and they were the ones who did the killing. I cannot bring back the past but only hope that we can learn the ways of living more in harmony with nature rather than destroying it through our greed and ignorance.
I try to think how this country was before the white population came here and really committed genocide among the indigenous peoples who had lived here for at least 20,000 years. To see their cultures smashed and they themselves called "heathens" disturbs me quite a bit. That's one of many reasons that Christianity doesn't do anything for me for those who came here were Christians and they were the ones who did the killing. I cannot bring back the past but only hope that we can learn the ways of living more in harmony with nature rather than destroying it through our greed and ignorance.
Which particular beliefs are you asking about? There were thousands of different tribes, many of whom had differing believes and rituals.
I would also caution you that "native american" also refers to South America and Cental America, as well as North America. So again, which belief?
Baron Max
It seemed to work for them, but I think it's as silly as most religions.
But isn't that part of why they were so easy to conquer. They were 'one' with the planet and didn't own it. The invaders didn't see it that way and took it.
Also, didn't the natives religion work against then when the Spanish came because it was foretold?
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M*W: This has always been a bone to pick with me, especially since my Cherokee ancestors came from deep in Appalachia where their archeological finds go back 35,000 years. When the Europeans came over to run them off their land (or convert them to christianity), many of my own ancestors hid out in caves to avoid the horrors of the Trail of Tears. Unfortunately, what happened then, was that my ancestors denied their heritage out of fear. Even when I was a little girl, my grandmother told me to never tell anyone that we had Cherokee blood. By this time the Cherokee intermarried with settlers to blend into society.
When the christian missionaries came to "salvage" the Cherokee, they educated them in schools, taught them religion (christianity) and imbedded them into a European ethic. The word "salvage" was a more proper way of saying "savage." Hollywood didn't know this fact when making all the old westerns, and we've come to know the Native Americans as "savages," which is incorrect. They were "salvaged" from their own culture.
Of course, the Native Americans lived and loved the land as it was sacred to them. They worshipped Grandmother Earth who provided everything for their sustenance, and they worshipped Grandfather Sky for spiritual matters. How close that is to how the ancient nomads came to worship their skies.
Although the intentions from the missionaries might have been a positive thing for providing the indiginous people education and other valuable skills, their whole purpose was to 'recruit' new members into Catholicism. There was no real need to take away their own NA spirituality. Bottom-line, the origins come from the same myth.
You've heard the term "Indian Giver." That's also a misnomer. People think that an Indian Giver is an Indian who gave something to the Wasichu (White man) but then took it back. The true "Indian Giver" was Wasichu, who promised the NAs land and other great American things, and then took them back or didn't deliver them at all. That's why the NAs say Wasichu speaks with "forked tongue." Half the tongue tells the truth, but the other half lies. It makes me wonder if "our grandfather's house" (the US Government) isn't still speaking with forked tongue today!
They did fight for their territory, among themselves and outsiders. I guess their lack of Christianity didn't help the Europeans relate to them. However, some tribes had a religion that was surprisingly similar to Christianity, and took to the new religion with zeal.
Alot of people aren't aware of it, but Native Americans had a hard time following treaties (as did we, but for other reasons), because they had no king. Any warrior could act independently, thus enforcing an edict accross a territory was difficult if not impossible.
Alot of people aren't aware of it, but Native Americans had a hard time following treaties (as did we, but for other reasons), because they had no king. Any warrior could act independently, thus enforcing an edict accross a territory was difficult if not impossible.
Bullshit! The Native Americans were only here about 12,000 to 15,000 years ago at best! Where did you get your facts?
Baron Max
Ahh, don't you mean "Ain't the veneer of civilization wonderful?"
Or better still, perhaps, "Ain't it wonderful that a few powerful people have beaten us all into a somewhat peaceful existence?"
I think the apes and gorillas enjoy a higher form of "civilization".
Baron Max
I think the vast majority of people are engaged in peaceful existence or would prefer to be.
Its like they say, there are two kinds of people in the world, those who adjust to the world and those who adjust the world to them. Its the latter that creates all the change in the world, its also the latter that creates all the conflict. I doubt they constitute the majority.
Sorry, I couldn't see the pictographs that well. Thank you for explaining that. Still the Mayans did not live in North America as I recall. They lived in Central America I thought.
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M*W: I visited an ancient ruin deep in Appalachia (Southern WV) where archeologists had found relics that were dated back 33,000-35,000 years. I admit I was shocked to find a ruin this old sort of right in my own backyard, but who am I to question the archeologists? There was a small museum adjacent to the ruins displaying the findings. I had never read about this place before I saw it with my own eyes. So, I'm not suprised that it's relatively an unknown place. I can't even remember the name of the location. It was deep in the middle of nowhere in the lush mountains of Appalachia. Also, I can't say specifically if they were the ancestors of the Cherokee or some unknown indiginous tribe. They were alleged to be peaceful hunters and fisherman and lived in thatched huts along the banks of New River, the oldest river in the Appalachians. I never heard about this place when I was growing up. It was certainly way off the tourist route. Since this is a very isolated area where no cars can reach, we had to walk up the mountain to get to it (not unusual in Appalachia).
Do you have another name for those pictographs other than "art" .
As an archaeologist, I can tell you this evidence is spurious.
It matter little as how many thousands of years native Americans lived here before the whites comitted genocide upon them. They were the first here but they were killed because they were "different" than the whites that killed them off.
Right, because it might go against what you were "taught". Which we know is always 100% accurate.
I don't know why you would be willing to accept that what is "taught" is "100%" accurate. Such a paradigm isn't part of modern archaeological education. Indeed, archaeologists are taught early on that what is known in the archaeological record is subject to revision and frequently ends up being so.
However, none of the evidence frequently referred to in order to support exaggerated antiquity of man in North America actually pans out. If you're aware of some that does, please cite it.