Mormons and polygamy

Socratic Spelunker said:
True, but the womanizing is more difficult to prove, especially when the witnesses clearly aren't objective. The information is clearly one-sided, biased, and incomplete because Joseph Smith ordained several African-Americans to the Priesthood. I noticed that was casually left out. In fact, the opposite was asserted
Click to expand...
Well, the story of the gold tablets and translating them from hiroglyphics is enough for most people to call BS on the story. (And that story is central to the entire religion.)

I know this wasn't addressed to me, but I just want to propose the idea again that the idea may be to TAKE AWAY these right/etc from the religious rather than giving them to the irreligious.
Click to expand...
Do you really feel that a married man should not be able to put his wife on his medical insurance - or a wife shouldn't be able to make medical decisions for her unconscious husband? Or a spouse who stayed home to raise the kids shouldn't be able to claim their dead spouse's Social Security...

I'd suggest giving the implications of this idea some serious thought before you suggest it again.
 
MrMormon said:
So we're going meta. :) What do you think science has to say (specifically) about Smith? Remember, anyone who uses "a statement outside of science cannot be true" as an argument is professing a religious belief.
Click to expand...

I don't really care though. Mormonism is like scientology, it's not even worth discussing whether it's real, it's so obvious that it's not. But if you are a Mormon, I don't have a problem with that, and you don't need my approval to believe. It's the social structure, the community cohesion that I think attracts people, and that transcends the founding mythology. I do think that it sets up people for failure, it expects too much of them.
 
gmilam said:
Well, the story of the gold tablets and translating them from hiroglyphics is enough for most people to call BS on the story. (And that story is central to the entire religion.)
Click to expand...

How so?


gmilam said:
Do you really feel that a married man should not be able to put his wife on his medical insurance - or a wife shouldn't be able to make medical decisions for her unconscious husband? Or a spouse who stayed home to raise the kids shouldn't be able to claim their dead spouse's Social Security...

I'd suggest giving the implications of this idea some serious thought before you suggest it again.
Click to expand...

I think those decisions should be available, but they should have nothing to do with marital status. How hard would it be to just have people designate one relation or individual, regardless of marriage, to have those rights? It could be a spouse, partner, sibling, etc.

Is that such a terrible change?
 
Socratic Spelunker said:
Well, there is evidence of pre-columbian trans-Atlantic travel, such as the Olmec stone heads which very clearly show african facial features, not native american.

As far as people from the middle east, mitochondrial DNA analysis shows that all native Americans are descended from only seven women, but I can't remember where that small group came from. I'm going to try to find more info on that. I haven't heard stats on it in like 4 years. Give me time.
Click to expand...

That is far from clear, those statues don't look like any African I ever saw, they come from Asia, having crossed the land bridge from the area of Russia.
 
spidergoat said:
He said Middle Easterners went to America before it was discovered by Europeans. There is no genetic or archeological evidence of this, which one would expect to find.
Click to expand...
Absence of evidence... *groans under cliche* :)

gmilam said:
Well, the story of the gold tablets and translating them from hiroglyphics is enough for most people to call BS on the story. (And that story is central to the entire religion.)
Click to expand...
It's unlikely from the viewpoint that there's no such thing as revelation, and you choose to believe (religion again...) it's impossible. And I didn't correct phlogistician earlier - the records from which the Book of Mormon came were written in something called "reformed Egyptian".

spidergoat said:
I don't really care though. Mormonism is like scientology, it's not even worth discussing whether it's real, it's so obvious that it's not. But if you are a Mormon, I don't have a problem with that, and you don't need my approval to believe. It's the social structure, the community cohesion that I think attracts people, and that transcends the founding mythology. I do think that it sets up people for failure, it expects too much of them.
Click to expand...

The history of anything usually looks like a hodge-podge (but what's obvious about anything?). The theology, on the other hand, fits together beautifully. There are many different reasons why people are attracted to and even stay in a religion - a desire to think that a comforting statement is true, the presentation or aesthetics of it, the environment of and/or good performed through an institution or its members, just doing it because one's parents do. All of those are irrelevant to a religion's truth - personal revelation is the only way to know yes or no. One problem is knowing whose 'revelation' is a lie. I say mine isn't. I have a testimony of my religion.

Your second point is that there exists a person who, if he/she genuinely tried, would fail to live up to all moral expectations. Everyone is like that. Christianity in general teaches repentance. People losing their convictions to genuinely try - that's their choice.
 
spidergoat said:
Really, that's not what I heard. You have to become as a God yourself, in order to receive the highest blessing, your own Earth.
Click to expand...

Had to run off to dinner with the wife. Here's a more complete answer.

Salvation does not require perfection. Joseph Smith taught that there are many gospel principles that we will not even become aware of until a long time after we have entered the afterlife.

Also, I believe Spencer Kimball, or maybe James E Talmage, not sure, said that it does not matter how far you have progressed. It will only matter that you are progressing.

We are only expected to do our best. We're expected to put forth some honest effort to be the best person we can be. God knows our hearts and if we are trying.

In the end, through the atonement, Christ will make up the difference.
 
Socratic Spelunker said:
Had to run off to dinner with the wife. Here's a more complete answer.

Salvation does not require perfection. Joseph Smith taught that there are many gospel principles that we will not even become aware of until a long time after we have entered the afterlife.

Also, I believe Spencer Kimball, or maybe James E Talmage, not sure, said that it does not matter how far you have progressed. It will only matter that you are progressing.

We are only expected to do our best. We're expected to put forth some honest effort to be the best person we can be. God knows our hearts and if we are trying.

In the end, through the atonement, Christ will make up the difference.
Click to expand...

You will be judged by the deeds you did unto others.
 
I find it fascinating that people believe this crap. Mormonism is a little sillier than some of the other religions, but, not by much. I mean, the giant Toad/Frog? The stupid glasses. The moronic everything. Pretty much no different than Judaism, Christianity and Islam if you stop to think about it.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top