Islam vs. the Western World: off-topic posts from a Religion thread

... Most of the people of the West have forgotten this, but we have never forgotten it. Our lands are littered with the blood of our people, how can we overlook our oppression, especially in the eyes of Neo-Colonial wars in Muslim lands?

So Muslims are seeking revenge for those injustices? Revenge in the form of killing any and all westerners, and cutting off their heads?

Is that how Muslims think to right all the past injustices??? More and more blood feuds against the children of the past oppressors?

And why do Muslims kill other Muslims ...even as Muslims of the world defend that killing? And you expect westerners to accept that as normal? I ain't got that figured out yet.

Baron Max
 
And why do Muslims kill other Muslims ...even as Muslims of the world defend that killing? And you expect westerners to accept that as normal? I ain't got that figured out yet.

Think "patriots" and "loyalists"
 
And you defend those Muslims for taking the law into their own hands? For seeking personal revenge without any due processes of the law?

Baron Max

Don't you?

When fighting broke out, civilians were often the first victims in both wars. The Tories formed terrorist units and plundered and raided the territories under patriot control. The southwestern frontier areas of the colonies, like the southwestern border of Palestine, were scenes of particularly bloody terrorism. In South Carolina, the Tory leader Major William Cunningham (known as "Bloody Bill") became the Sheikh Yassin of the struggle, conducting massacres of patriot civilians. Tory and anti-Tory mob violence became common. General Sir Henry Clinton organized many guerrilla raids upon patriot territory. Loyalists also launched assassination plots, including an attempt to murder George Washington in New York in 1776. (Among the terrorists participating in that plot was the mayor of New York City.)

There were loyalist insurrections against the patriots in every colony. Tory military activity was particularly severe in the Chesapeake, on Long Island, in Delaware and Maryland, and along the Virginia coast. As violence escalated and spread, the forces of the revolution took countermeasures. Tories were tarred and feathered. Indiscriminate expulsions sometimes took place. Tory areas could be placed under martial rule, with all civil rights, habeas corpus, and due process suspended. Queens County, New York — a loyalist stronghold — was put under military administration by Continental troops, and the entire population was prohibited from traveling without special documents. General Wooster engaged in wholesale incarceration and expulsion of New York Tories. The Continental Congress called for disarming all loyalists, and for locking up the "dangerous ones" without trial. New York loyalists were exiled to Connecticut and other places; some were used in forced labor.

Loyalists were kidnapped and held hostage. In some colonies, expressing opposition to the Revolution was grounds for imprisonment. Loyalists could be excluded from certain professions, such as law; frequently, they were stripped of all property rights and had their lands confiscated. In colony after colony, Acts of Banishment forced masses of loyalists to leave their homes and emigrate. The most common destiny was the Canadian Maritimes, with others going to the British West Indies, to England, and to Australia.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/912807/posts
 
Don't need the history, we can see how Muslims are killing other Muslims in Muslim lands ....it happens every single day!! More Muslims are killed by other Muslims than all of those killed by westerners.

You mean in Iraq. Who is arming the warring factions? Why was there no sectarian violence before the US invaded? Why was there no sectarian violence in Iraq for hundreds of years before that? The answer is simple.

Sectarian_war_in_Iraq_by_Latuff2.jpg


Yet you and SAM defend those killers ....just because they're Muslims.

SAM and I are not the same individual, nor do we agree on everything. Why is there a campaign to refer to us together in every post?

We most definitely denounce any inter-Muslim strife, what would we gain from it. We encourage the Iraqis to stop killing each other and join together to kick out the source of their oppression, the US army, from their lands.

Look at Pakistan today ....Muslims rioting, smashing cars, smashing shops, burning buildings, ...., all because they don't like something!

That something is like usurping power. Noted that I don't know the extent of damage, but I know for a fact it was isolated to Karachi, and based more on resentment of Western backed MQM terrorist group than anyhting else. Zardari is nothing but a civilian dictator, but it is no use explaining Pakistani politics to you. As if you even care what happens, I'm sure you are happy just to see us suffer.

The Muslims are great at taking the law into their own hands ...disregarding not only the laws of their own society, but disregarding the laws of the Quran by killing their own people.

I don't remember anyone killing someone in the protests. Can you provide the source?

And you and SAM defend those people ...people who use violence as a way of dealing with things they don't like. And worse, you expect westerners to understand that, to accept that, as normal Muslim traditions.

Baron Max

Violence directed against occupying armies, not civilians. Why do I have to keep stating this. Can't you grasp this just once. Islam forbids killing of civilians in war. It is not only illegal in Islam, it tarnishes the legitimate resistance. This is why we believe that these attacks are orchestrated against with the dual goal of weakening the populace and maligning the resistance, many of the bombers have been traced to Karzai's thugs in Afghanistan, who incidentally are also funded by and propped up by the US.

If you scratch a problem in this region far enough, you will find America's hand in it. It is from my experience. It is also the widespread perception of not only the common people of the Muslim world, but its intelligentsia as well
 
Geez, SAM, you're at it again ....even after I tried to explain it. Others would just exchange the dollars for that other currency and buy it anyway. Don't you have even the slightest grasp of currency exchange?

Baron Max

Yeah, but they would not need to provide goods and services for paper money thats worth something only because its being held up as the currency for oil. IOW, let Americans work for their own living rather than make money off someone else's national resource by insisting their currency is the only one that can be used to purchase it. Imagine needing Chinese currency to buy gas at the pump.
 
I demand the same from Islam/Muslims, complete none interfearence in the Western World.

Eat your oil.

You ready to ride your pushbike everywhere are you? You see, if they stop selling you oil, if they stop giving it to you, well, your country is screwed. Then you'd start bawling like a little girl about their not giving you or allowing you to have any oil.

But the whole irony of that comment is that you are currently occupying their countries and you're telling them to not interfere in the "Western World"?


I demand the same from Islam/Muslims, all Muslims should return to Islamic countries, and it if they do not, they should be seized and escorted back to their rightful Ialamic Theocracy. No Muslims will be tolerated in the Western world.
There's a bright spark of intolerance there.

Not all Muslims come from Muslim countries. What of those who are white and US citizens and who are descendant from US citizens.. ie.. they are not migrants but white Americans, who are Muslims. Going to expel them as well? And what of whites in other "Western countries" who are Muslims. Where exactly will be be sent in your perfect little world where it's only right if all your neighbours are white and think just like you do and believe just as you do?


I demand the same from Islam/Muslims, REPARATIONS: For all the wealth seized from our land, all the destruction of our indigenous institutions, and payment in the form of monetary sums to replace the destroyed or stolen resources and institutions of our lands.
The correct response to that little gem is "after you dear". You already paid the Native Americans for all that you stole from them? Yes? No? And what, pray tell, have the Muslims stolen from your lands? I'm sorry, they destroyed your indigenous institutions? Are you joking? Your ancestors destroyed all of that when they migrated to the US. So yeah, when are you going to start forking over the cash to compensate those indigenous tribes you not only helped destroy, but also stole from and shoved off into reservations?

African nations should be paid reparations for slavery due to the theft of millions of its free citizens by Muslims Powers and sold into to Slavery in Muslim World, and across the oceans to the rest of the world for profit.
Again, after you dear.

I'm sure all the blacks whose ancestors were shipped to your shores, suffered horrendous treatment and even death at the hands of your ancestors deserve and expect the same reparations from your Government.



Islam cannot let the West alone, Islam cannot let the World alone, it cannot let any state outside of Islam alone, any thing not Islam is a anathema to Allah, and Islam so therefore must be converted, or conqured and destroyed.

Just a quick reminder because it seems you are residing in the land of stupid again, it is you who have invaded them and are currently occupying them. So it would be a fairly accurate estimation to say that it is you who cannot leave them alone. You're either trying to lick their arses as you beg for more oil or you're bombing others into kingdom come in a bid to get that oil. So yeah, you're more obsessed with them than they are with you.
 
Yeah, but they would not need to provide goods and services for paper money thats worth something only because its being held up as the currency for oil. IOW, let Americans work for their own living rather than make money off someone else's national resource by insisting their currency is the only one that can be used to purchase it. Imagine needing Chinese currency to buy gas at the pump.

Although I agree your not grasping the concept of currency exchange, I also agree it's about fucking time American live within their means and not the way they want to regardless the rest of the world or the future.
 
I demand the same from Islam/Muslims, complete none interfearence in the Western World.

Eat your oil.



I demand the same from Islam/Muslims, all Muslims should return to Islamic countries, and it if they do not, they should be seized and escorted back to their rightful Ialamic Theocracy. No Muslims will be tolerated in the Western world.



I demand the same from Islam/Muslims, REPARATIONS: For all the wealth seized from our land, all the destruction of our indigenous institutions, and payment in the form of monetary sums to replace the destroyed or stolen resources and institutions of our lands.


Maybe we should ask the native Americans what they want. After all, you're occupying their land and using their resources, duh! Shouldn't you be in some European country of origin?

Islam cannot let the West alone, Islam cannot let the World alone, it cannot let any state outside of Islam alone, any thing not Islam is a anathema to Allah, and Islam so therefore must be converted, or conqured and destroyed.

Ironic.
 
Don't you? (posted article of the American revolution) ...

Perhaps you're right, SAM ......Muslims are about 300 years behind westerners! I'd say that's about right, wouldn't you?

So, let's defend the Muslims of the world who kill other Muslims in the 21st Century!! Yea, Muslims, go, fight, kill! Yea, Muslims!

Neat little cheering section you have here, SAM. :D

Baron Max
 
Perhaps you're right, SAM ......Muslims are about 300 years behind westerners!
Baron Max

Yeah, what scenario do you perceive when we "catch up" to your occupational hegemonies?

Beware of what you want, they say, for you may get it.
 
Although I agree your not grasping the concept of currency exchange, I also agree it's about fucking time American live within their means and not the way they want to regardless the rest of the world or the future.

I recommend you look at the system of "currency exchange" and why post Iraq invasion Iraq was first and foremost reverted to selling oil for dollars. "Mission Accomplished" was not entirely a joke.

Candidly stated, ‘Operation Iraqi Freedom’ was a war designed to install a pro-U.S. government in Iraq, establish multiple U.S military bases before the onset of global Peak Oil, and to reconvert Iraq back to petrodollars while hoping to thwart further OPEC momentum towards the euro as an alternative oil transaction currency (i.e. “petroeuro”).[3] However, subsequent geopolitical events have exposed neoconservative strategy as fundamentally flawed, with Iran moving towards a petroeuro system for international oil trades, while Russia evaluates this option with the European Union.

http://www.energybulletin.net/node/7707
 
You mean in Iraq. Who is arming the warring factions? Why was there no sectarian violence before the US invaded? Why was there no sectarian violence in Iraq for hundreds of years before that? The answer is simple.

Bullshit bullshit bullshit. There was sectarian violence prior to US invasion, and there was also violence towards the Kurds.

The reason why violence between Sunni and Shitte was far less under Saddam's rule was because Saddam and his Sunni cronies stifled any Shiite dissent. Since the U.S invasion broke the existing pre-existing hierarchy and dethroned the elitist Sunni caste, there is now a struggle for predominance amongst the two sects. Ergo. The U.S led invasion created a power vacuum, the Sunnis and Shiites squabbling amongst each other over who should fill it.

Naturally you'll bitch about the U.S creating a power vacuum. But let me make two observations:

1. It's not necessarily a bad thing to oust a highly elitist government which favours nepotism, castism, and the oppression of particular religious denominations.

2. The U.S does not force the various sects to employ violence to resolve their disputes. The Sunnis, Shiites, Kurds, and various other factions could choose to resolve the problem of how to divide up power peacefully, but they don't.

I re-iterate, quit blaming America for behaviour exhibited by Iraqis. A doesn't necessarily equal B, nobody forced a violent responsible from the various denominations in Iraq.

And in regards to your demand for an apology for slavery. May I point out that the Western World did *not* steal free human beings from Africa. Quite the contrary, they *purchased* slaves from African slave dealers. The Africans were quite willing to become rich off the slave trade. Too bad they didn't realise what disaster consequences depopulating the centre of Africa would have in the long term. But to be fair, the Europeans didn't expect it either.
 
You mean in Iraq. Who is arming the warring factions? Why was there no sectarian violence before the US invaded?

Because Sadman Hussy killed anyone and everyone who tried anything that he didn't like. Iraq was littered with bodies of Muslims that Sadman murdered! Or don't you believe any of the Iraqi people's word?

Why was there no sectarian violence in Iraq for hundreds of years before that?

You mean none that was reported in the news??

The answer is simple.

Yep, simple ....the west made the Muslims start killing other Muslims! Good one, DH, just blame everything on the west and you're in safe waters!

If you scratch a problem in this region far enough, you will find America's hand in it.

Pretty powerful people, those Americans, huh? We can make people start killing their own people whenever we want. We can make Muslims kill other Muslims just by being Americans ....and asking politely.

If Americans keep it up, pretty soon, with Muslims killing so many Muslims, there won't be any more Muslims in the world to kill other Muslims.

Baron Max
 
We could invade Texas, and after alienating the Americans, arm the Mexicans to fight them. Let those two kill each other off while we steal their oil. But before we do that, we would need to bomb a state to make a scapegoat for our war against radical Capitalists. We can attack New Jersey, no one likes them anyway, then we can blame New York for all the problems we cause in Jersey. It's the perfect plan.

LOL
 
The correct response to that little gem is "after you dear". You already paid the Native Americans for all that you stole from them? Yes? No? And what, pray tell, have the Muslims stolen from your lands? I'm sorry, they destroyed your indigenous institutions? Are you joking? Your ancestors destroyed all of that when they migrated to the US. So yeah, when are you going to start forking over the cash to compensate those indigenous tribes you not only helped destroy, but also stole from and shoved off into reservations?

Buffalo's post makes more sense if you put it in context. He was responding to Diamond's demands that the West make reparations for all the bullshit is has ever done (slavery, occupation, murder, waa waa waa boo hoo hoo). It's fucking ridiculous for Diamond to demand that the West make reparations from slavery, in light of the fact that Muslims were the major culprits when it came to slavery.
 
I recommend you look at the system of "currency exchange" ...

You still don't get it, do you, SAM? I think it's funny how you continue to use that old line of bullshit ....even after I've explained it to you. Are you really that thick-headed? Oh, wait, yes, you are!!

Baron Max
 
I recommend you look at the system of "currency exchange" and why post Iraq invasion Iraq was first and foremost reverted to selling oil for dollars. "Mission Accomplished" was not entirely a joke.

Ooooh that makes total sense, they invade iraq to prevent it from switching currency makes so much more sense than war profiteering or just plane stupidity! I bet it was a plan orchestrated by the 5 Jewish bankers that secretly control the world from outer space!
 
It will be interesting to see what happens when Hispanics become a majority in the US.
 
Pretty powerful people, those Americans, huh? We can make people start killing their own people whenever we want. We can make Muslims kill other Muslims just by being Americans ....and asking politely.

Man, Diamond makes it sound like Americans are able to control the minds of men. Brrr, scary stuff.
 
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