How people usually bitch about others because they are better off? Human psychology?
Islam vs. the Western World: off-topic posts from a Religion thread
- Thread starter kks
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How people usually bitch about others because they are better off? Human psychology?
Like...when?
Perhaps in a society such as the US this is valid between the haves and the have nots.
I don`t think this is a reasonable assumption to apply to diverse cultures, such between the West and Islam. For starters, Islam is horrified and appalled by the moral laxity of Western society.
Are you familiar with a little something called Saudi Arabia, the recipient of the largest transfer of wealth in the history of the world?
So - let Israel be overrun and its people extirpated, and ignore the fact that the "alleged" enemy combatants are returning to terrorism.
Let's just be open, shall we?
Many places do. Are they on trial also? Is that permissable?
Largely in degree, but the principle is the same: DH wants all non-muslims to leave islamic territory, whereas Sam thinks that arranging one's laws according to any arbitrary religious law is acceptable if the majority approves it, which many probably would. The application of these laws would no doubt result in the oppression of religious minorities, who would protest - well, they would be disgruntled, anyway, leading to the application of Sam's "love it or leave it" rule. She's very vocal about the rights of minorities, except where they conflict with islamist legality.
Best,
Geoff
And wrongfully so, they have no right to attacks for moral lax.
Oil costs money.
How about... Let Israel unblock Gaza, abide by ceasefires, initiate dialogue and refrain from stealing more territory.
Lets just be open shall we?
Of course. But we are discussing the US here.
Precisely. As the West has no right to attack to establish "democracy".
And of course, thus, they do not want anything the West has to offer.
Please back up any claims of SAM said so and so with a link to my actual quote, if you please.
See above response
Precisely. As the West has no right to attack to establish "democracy".
two wrongs make a right?
Of course they don't, that why they are going to give us back all the trillions of dollars they take for oil, all the technology, all those skyscrapers, all the foreign investment, all those liberal Western laws like leting women vote, tolerating different apparel and other religions, etc, oooh I can see Qutar or Bahrain doing that!
DiamondHearts
Registered Senior Member
Well, StrawDog, now you know how it feels to be Muslim. Not very pretty how posters treat you when you stand up for normal, everyday Muslims is it.
Anyway G-d bless you brother. You have my praise.
Anyway G-d bless you brother. You have my praise.
Or maybe they will just stop the petrodollar hegemony by accepting other currencies for oil, no need for other countries to provide goods and services in exchange for paper.
DiamondHearts
Registered Senior Member
I never stated that all Non-Muslims should leave Muslim territory. That's news to me.
Mainly I refer to those Westerners, propaganda journalists from pro-Western military [i.e. Fox news], IMF and World Bank officials, Blackwater and mercenaries, oil company personell, oppressive foreign multi-national corporations, money lenders, soldiers, politicians of countries which have at any time in the near future occupied a sovereign nation or supported such an occupation.
I stated that except those who are harmless, i.e. tourist, peaceful investors, restaurant chains, unbiased media stations, basically those unattached to the oppressive Western power centers, this si why I added the line "except those approved by the democratically elected governments of our sovereign countries".
As Malcolm X once stated, "We must first prove ourselves acceptable to ourselves, before we can prove ourselves acceptable to others"
Please ask me for a clarification next time.
Another note, Westerners doesn't equal all Non-Muslims. Those Non-Muslims present in our lands are intrinsic to our civilization, and we would never exile our brothers and sisters. They are a part of us, and it is our right to both protect them and help them. Those who are not part of the conflict should not be involved in the measures against our oppressors, the Western power centers.
Me said:
Mainly I refer to those Westerners, propaganda journalists from pro-Western military [i.e. Fox news], IMF and World Bank officials, Blackwater and mercenaries, oil company personell, oppressive foreign multi-national corporations, money lenders, soldiers, politicians of countries which have at any time in the near future occupied a sovereign nation or supported such an occupation.
I stated that except those who are harmless, i.e. tourist, peaceful investors, restaurant chains, unbiased media stations, basically those unattached to the oppressive Western power centers, this si why I added the line "except those approved by the democratically elected governments of our sovereign countries".
As Malcolm X once stated, "We must first prove ourselves acceptable to ourselves, before we can prove ourselves acceptable to others"
Please ask me for a clarification next time.
Another note, Westerners doesn't equal all Non-Muslims. Those Non-Muslims present in our lands are intrinsic to our civilization, and we would never exile our brothers and sisters. They are a part of us, and it is our right to both protect them and help them. Those who are not part of the conflict should not be involved in the measures against our oppressors, the Western power centers.
DiamondHearts
Registered Senior Member
Agreed SAM.
It seems that when we discuss Western occupying armies in Muslim lands (forces of US, EU, UK, and NATO), many of the people here take it to mean that we are criticizing all Westerners.
To illustrate this point, we are proud of those Westerners who protests against the invasions of Afghanistan, Iraq, Lebanon, and Gaza. Recently George Galloway drove a hundred car convoy of supplies to Gaza's starving population. The example of this man puts the rest of us, who call ourselves Muslims, to complete shame. We lack this courage, our psychological degradation and shame has consumed us.
To understand the thinking of Muslims today, you must research the history of how we got here. After almost a thousand years of independence and pride, we were at one point completely overwhelmed by the Western imperialist powers. Not only did they just invade our lands, they made sure that we would not be a threat for centuries. They butchered our people, killed our leaders, destroyed our traditional institutions of law and learning, and completely replaced our school systems with Western based ones. Once they trained our children in their schools, they made them copies of themselves, and then entrusted these people with pacifying our unruly populations. These children then went on to become the strongmen and dictators of the Middle East. Saddam Hussein, Hosni Mubarak were both educated in such schools. They also propped us traitors among our people to secure our rule, those same people who paved the way for European domination of Muslim lands, these include the monarchies of Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Iraq [before Saddam]. Kuwait, and numerous others, all established with Western backing.
Once we grasp the history of the Muslim world, we will realize what great injustices have been permitted to continue. In British occupied India and Pakistan, Muslims were banned from universities for decades, and often they were discriminated in employment with some positions forbidden for Muslims. Millions of our innocent people were slaughtered after the 1857 failed revolution (by Muslims and Hindus), Muslims were hunted down, men, women, and children, and mutilated. Most of the people of the West have forgotten this, but we have never forgotten it. Our lands are littered with the blood of our people, how can we overlook our oppression, especially in the eyes of Neo-Colonial wars in Muslim lands?
It seems that when we discuss Western occupying armies in Muslim lands (forces of US, EU, UK, and NATO), many of the people here take it to mean that we are criticizing all Westerners.
To illustrate this point, we are proud of those Westerners who protests against the invasions of Afghanistan, Iraq, Lebanon, and Gaza. Recently George Galloway drove a hundred car convoy of supplies to Gaza's starving population. The example of this man puts the rest of us, who call ourselves Muslims, to complete shame. We lack this courage, our psychological degradation and shame has consumed us.
To understand the thinking of Muslims today, you must research the history of how we got here. After almost a thousand years of independence and pride, we were at one point completely overwhelmed by the Western imperialist powers. Not only did they just invade our lands, they made sure that we would not be a threat for centuries. They butchered our people, killed our leaders, destroyed our traditional institutions of law and learning, and completely replaced our school systems with Western based ones. Once they trained our children in their schools, they made them copies of themselves, and then entrusted these people with pacifying our unruly populations. These children then went on to become the strongmen and dictators of the Middle East. Saddam Hussein, Hosni Mubarak were both educated in such schools. They also propped us traitors among our people to secure our rule, those same people who paved the way for European domination of Muslim lands, these include the monarchies of Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Iraq [before Saddam]. Kuwait, and numerous others, all established with Western backing.
Once we grasp the history of the Muslim world, we will realize what great injustices have been permitted to continue. In British occupied India and Pakistan, Muslims were banned from universities for decades, and often they were discriminated in employment with some positions forbidden for Muslims. Millions of our innocent people were slaughtered after the 1857 failed revolution (by Muslims and Hindus), Muslims were hunted down, men, women, and children, and mutilated. Most of the people of the West have forgotten this, but we have never forgotten it. Our lands are littered with the blood of our people, how can we overlook our oppression, especially in the eyes of Neo-Colonial wars in Muslim lands?
no need at all, I would gladly accept the day.
Oh the internet posters oppress you, the horror!
But you're not standing up for "normal, everyday Muslims", you're trying to defend Muslim killers and suicide bombers and Muslims who kill other Muslims!!
Praise?? For defending radical Muslim murderers and suicide bombers??!!!
Baron Max
Geez, SAM, you're at it again ....even after I tried to explain it. Others would just exchange the dollars for that other currency and buy it anyway. Don't you have even the slightest grasp of currency exchange?
Baron Max
Don't need the history, we can see how Muslims are killing other Muslims in Muslim lands ....it happens every single day!! More Muslims are killed by other Muslims than all of those killed by westerners. Yet you and SAM defend those killers ....just because they're Muslims.
Look at Pakistan today ....Muslims rioting, smashing cars, smashing shops, burning buildings, ...., all because they don't like something! The Muslims are great at taking the law into their own hands ...disregarding not only the laws of their own society, but disregarding the laws of the Quran by killing their own people.
And you and SAM defend those people ...people who use violence as a way of dealing with things they don't like. And worse, you expect westerners to understand that, to accept that, as normal Muslim traditions.
Baron Max