Islam is NOT one of the many religions

S

Sufi

Registered Senior Member
If we consider the oneness of Allah as explained in the Koran (that can be read at www.ahmedbaki.com) that ALLAH is AHAD (the ONE without limits), the SAMAD, (the Whole), LAMYALEED (UNDIVIDED from something else), LAMYULAD (UNBROKEN, UNFRAGMENTED), then we come to understand that:

There is only one single SYSTEM operating in the universe that is organized by the basic wholeness and that we all are subject to, which was tried to be explained to mankind by its perceivers, the prophets and the spiritual masters...

All the prophets confirmed each other and tried to explain mankind this single Universal System, which we call as religion. Finally, Mohammed (peace be upon him) said 'I have perfected the religion for you' by confirming all the scriptures before him and named this single religion (the system) as ISLAM beacuse of its quality that all things have already SURRENDERED to this basic ONE at the essence. If only we could understand that...

In the sight of Oneness, there are not many religions, there is only one System of life. ISLAM is the name given to this only religion in the sight of ALLAH.

We do not need to be in conflict with eachother, but we need to UNDERSTAND that single Universal System, --no matter from which religious(!) background we come-- in which each of us fullfils the reason for which we existed and get only the result of our deeds --as a basic principle of that System.
 
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Dude, can't you understand arabic??

"Ahad" means "One".
"Samad" means "Absolute", with no needs.
"lam yalid" means hasn't begotten, hasn't take childeren, hasn't given birth.
"lam Yulad" means was never begotten, was never born.

This is basic Arabic. :(
 
In Arabic, 'Vahid' means 'one' --that can be multiplied to two, three, five--; yet 'Ahad' means 'unique one without limits' that cannot be multiplied, and is absolute.

The Koran does not speak about a god that thinks and lives like a human being who begets or begets not, etc. Koran often notifies facts with parables.

Therefore, not the literal words but the meanings behind its signs as to what might have been indicated by using these terms, must be reflected upon in order to reach out its messages.

Sufi said:
If we consider the oneness of Allah as explained in the Koran (that can be read at www.ahmedbaki.com) that ALLAH is AHAD (the ONE without limits), the SAMAD, (the Whole), LAMYALEED (UNDIVIDED from something else), LAMYULAD (UNBROKEN, UNFRAGMENTED), then we come to understand that:
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Wow! take it easy... this is no shouting contest.

I may grant you Unique One. Especially because I should have written before: The One. But "without limits" has nothing do with Ahad, nothing.

The second sentence is rebundant as it is evident and as I have not said anything to contradict it. But! You seem to imply that since God is not human like than the translation I gave is rebundant. And that, sufi, is wrong. God makes it clear that He is not like humans. And he does that in the verses that you are abusing. Here follow three "official" translations:

In the name of Allah, the Compassionate, the Merciful.

112.001
YUSUFALI: Say: He is Allah, the One and Only;
PICKTHAL: Say: He is Allah, the One!
SHAKIR: Say: He, Allah, is One.

112.002
YUSUFALI: Allah, the Eternal, Absolute;
PICKTHAL: Allah, the eternally Besought of all!
SHAKIR: Allah is He on Whom all depend.

112.003
YUSUFALI: He begetteth not, nor is He begotten;
PICKTHAL: He begetteth not nor was begotten.
SHAKIR: He begets not, nor is He begotten.

112.004
YUSUFALI: And there is none like unto Him.
PICKTHAL: And there is none comparable unto Him.
SHAKIR: And none is like Him.

The part with "no limits" is a figment of the imaginations of "Holy men" that highjacked the term sufi. It is inexistant in Arabic. It serves them by saying that We are all gods. And that some of us are more god than god, in order for them to be the authority. That is how sects work.

I will reply to Randolfo soon in the "Ask me any question about Islam thread". I hope you read that.
 
'had' means 'limit' in Arabic, therefore 'ahad' means 'unlimited' or 'without limits'... But this is not the point of this thread.

We should make best use of any study that we think may enable us to understand the Koran better, but we do not need to be the follower of any "official" whatever...

It may be difficult to get rid of our preconception of god, but if it is a misconception or an imagination, one should always keep in mind that there is no place for any excuse in the System. :)
 
Let us ask it to ourselves and think about it in modesty and calmly in stride. What kind of a One do we believe? The One is either limited or is limitless?

Do we believe in a limited One --then it is no more the only one--, or a limitless One?
 
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Sufi said:
'had' means 'limit' in Arabic,
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Correct.

Sufi said:
therefore 'ahad' means 'unlimited' or 'without limits'...
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Wrong. Alif before a word doesn't negate its meaning. It strengthens it. As in "Akbar", the greatest. Here "Ahad" means "The one/unique".

Their notion of Ahad as limitless and the way you have explained it, means that everything is Allah. By that logic, everything between you, Hitler, satan, the anti-christ... etc, etc is God.

Az-Zumar (The Groups) 39: verse 67:

No just estimate have they made of Allah, such as is due to Him: On the Day of Judgment the whole of the earth will be but His handful, and the heavens will be rolled up in His right hand: Glory to Him! High is He above the Partners they attribute to Him!


Subhaana LLah.

Sufi said:
We should make best use of any study that we think may enable us to understand the Koran better,
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We should, indeed.

Sufi said:
but we do not need to be the follower of any "official" whatever...
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I wrote it "official" because it is not official, yet they are trusted translations of the meanings of the Qur'an. They are trusted as such by the many english speaking Muslims. As to official per se, you don't have to follow it. But, you have to be worthy of the explaning of the Qur'an. And to do that, you need to be able of way more than basic Arabic.

I ask you again, do you understand arabic?

:m:
 
Sufi said:
Let us ask it to ourselves and think about it in modesty and calmly in stread. What kind of a One do we believe? The One is either limited or is limitless?

Do we believe in a limited One --then it is no more the only one--, or a limitless One?
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Oh, let me guess... If I say that God is limited I am bad, right?? :)

First of all, Allah has never said that he is limitless. And as He that knows Himself hasn't told be, I am not willing to guess or make up fantasies just because it sounds good to me

My advice for you. Since it is very important learn arabic, dedicate yourself to the mastering of that language and then start studying the Qur'an by yourself (don't depend on any official holy man) and start understanding it (it serves not to be prejudiced in the process).



:m:
 
Bruce Wayne said:
Their notion of Ahad as limitless and the way you have explained it, means that everything is Allah. By that logic, everything between you, Hitler, satan, the anti-christ... etc, etc is God.

:m:
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You do not have to fear of learning further, dear! Yes, everything between you, Hitler, satan, the anti-christ... etc, etc may be God! Yet, Allah is not a god... Got it?

To understand some facts, we need to think without an image of god in our minds --no matter if we accept or deny it-- but without it!

I wish, by the grace of Allah it would be possible for you to read the book Mohammed's Allah and learn from there that by "Allah is ahad", IT DOES NOT MEAN EVERYTHING IS ALLAH.

One's conflict with this point will end as soon as one purifies his mind of any precconception of god --no matter how you name him--. Everything is not Allah, but to understand what this means, there is only one chance that is to spare more time to READ and learn.

Dear! let us not beat about the bush.. Read my messages over again if you like to discuss about my point in this thread. :)
 
spidergoat said:
So, why do you think Islam is not one of the many religions?
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Because, there are NOT many religions at all. There is only one religion explained by all prophets, which was finally named as Islam by Mohammed (pbuh).

Religion is not some orders sent by a god from above to make fun of people. It is the System that operates in the universe which we are subjected to. We need to understand this system and be aligned with it in order to know our true selves and avoid from the losses of ignorance.

There are not many religions, becasue there are no gods, nor a God; but there is only 'Allah'. Read more about it at www ahmedbaki.com if you like.
 
Bruce Wayne said:
Oh, let me guess... If I say that God is limited I am bad, right?? :)

:m:
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No, you are not bad. You are just fulfilling the reason for which you are there. :)
 
To understand some facts, we need to think without an image of god in our minds --no matter if we accept or deny it-- but without it!
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I applaud this notion and there are some common themes between all religions, but how do you explain all the differences? How do you reconcile a religion, for instance, that encourages prayer with another that says it's silly. Between eastern and western religions, there are enormous differences.
 
Sufi,

We do not need to be in conflict with eachother, but we need to UNDERSTAND that single Universal System,
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That would only work if everyone else agreed with your assertions. But since Islam is primitive and barbaric and many can see this then conflict is inevitable until Islam is destroyed, loses all its followers, or brings itself up to date with reality.

Kat
 
Perhaps you are implying that Islam is not just one religion among many, but the one religion that gathers up all religious ideas into a single perfect package?
 
spidergoat said:
Perhaps you are implying that Islam is not just one religion among many, but the one religion that gathers up all religious ideas into a single perfect package?
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No. I mean there is only one religion, because there is only ONE SINGLE UNIVERSAL SYSTEM that operates, that we all are subjected to and that we all need to understand and live in accordance for our own benefit.

If we can get rid of the idea of god, it will easily open up to us that we do not need to follow any religions, which are all a result of people's preconceptions, but we need to understand the universal system and order for our own benefit.
 
Katazia said:
Sufi,

That would only work if everyone else agreed with your assertions. But since Islam is primitive and barbaric and many can see this then conflict is inevitable until Islam is destroyed, loses all its followers, or brings itself up to date with reality.

Kat
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Let us first tell apart Islam from people's Muslimism. Islam is the origin and the teachings of Mohammed (pbuh), Muslimism is what people understands of Islam. Ther are many Muslimism, but tere is only one Islam.

Second, we need to understand the UNIVERSAL SYSTEM and ORDER that operates, that we all are subject to, for 'ourselves'. We do not need the others' understandings. Each one of us will get the result of our own understanding and deeds.
 
spidergoat said:
I applaud this notion and there are some common themes between all religions, but how do you explain all the differences? How do you reconcile a religion, for instance, that encourages prayer with another that says it's silly. Between eastern and western religions, there are enormous differences.
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The Religion in the sense I use is the one single universal system and order that operates everywhere, which is 'one religion'.

But people's religions in the sense you mention, are their personal understandings of this basic Religion --the universal system and order--, which was tried to be explained by all prophets confirming each other.

Again, we should tell apart 'the Religion' from peoples' Muslimism, Christianity, Judaism, and etc... There may be many Muslimisms that differs from place to place and from time to time. Same is for Christianity or Judaism. But there is only one Religion, that was named as Islam. From this point of view, people's Muslimism, Christianity or Judaism, etc, is what they understand of Islam (not Muslimism) --the only and one religion.
 
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