Silas said:Oh, and by the way, Robert, you let your nasafiles site die. Not enough of us on the forums, I guess.
Yeah, well there are allready too many of these damn forums
Silas said:Oh, and by the way, Robert, you let your nasafiles site die. Not enough of us on the forums, I guess.
Silas said:Might as well say the same for past life regression. Both these simply cast doubt on the capabilities of hypnosis as a way of really getting at real memories.
Innocent people have been convicted of child abuse based on unsupported evidence of "suppressed memories" supposedly retrieved by hynosis.
phlogistician said:Angels carrying lamps is a less complicated version than mere gravity holding the planets in position? Please, that's absurd, and so is Vallee.
Gustav said:lets look at a famous media skeptic... micheal shermer
history
*Much of his writing concerns the personal experiences that shaped his worldview. He once tried to enhance his athletic abilities with various New Age techniques, such as iridology, rolfing, and mega-vitamins. He even kept a pyramid in his living room to increase energy. His skepticism developed in reaction to his earlier credulity.
tactics
*For example, in his "Skeptic" column in Scientific American in March, 2003, he cited a research study published in the Lancet, a leading medical journal, by Pim van Lommel and colleagues. He asserted this study "delivered a blow" to the idea that the mind and the brain could separate. Yet the researchers argued the exact opposite, and showed that conscious experience outside the body took place during a period of clinical death when the brain was flatlined. As Jay Ingram, of the Canadian Discovery Channel, commented: "His use of this study to bolster his point is bogus… He could have said, 'The authors think there's a mystery, but I choose to interpret their findings differently'. But he didn't. I find that very disappointing" (Toronto Star, March 16, 2003).
look at how the pseudos conduct themselves
pathetic, ja?
Giambattista said:After noting that Sylvia Brown-a huckster psychic who appears often on CNN’s Larry King Live-is known as “claws” among JREF staff because of her long fingernails, Randi expressed the hope that while scratching herself, she would tear an artery and die, a prospect which evoked hearty laughter from the audience.
The tone of the conference was geared more toward ridiculing the enemy than engaging in thoughtful scientific discussion.
Needless to say, the siege mentality and the spirit of scientific inquiry have never exactly been bedfellows.
No wonder I have to take these people with a grain of salt. They can be extremely vicious!
In his bestselling handbook on logical and not-so-logical thinking, Why People Believe Weird Things, Shermer describes a great many “weird” ideas harbored by ordinary people. What he fails to mention is that the chief source for weird ideas in the modern world is none other than science itself, starting with Copernicus’ assertion that the earth is in motion around the sun, an observation that flies in the face of common sense. After all, as anyone can plainly see, the sun rises in the east and crosses the sky to set in the west. But Copernicus’ weird idea prevailed, and it’s been like that for 400 years now, with gravitational and electromagnetic fields, the divisibility and vacuity of the atom, the convertibility of energy and mass, warped space-time, wave-particle duality, quantum complementarity and uncertainty, nonlocality, a ten dimensional universe, and on and on. The history of science can be summarized as the story of weird ideas displacing “common sense.” As long as skeptics view the world in terms of science versus weirdness, they are guaranteed to remain parochial in their outlook.
As long as skeptic's view the world in terms of science versus weirdness, they are guaranteed to remain parochial in their outlook.
Gustav said:nice.
now what about future tech? do you see us getting close to light speeds? what would it take?
Mr Anonymous said:A very great deal and it wouldn't make the slightest bit of difference if we did - light speed isn't anywhere near fast enough to accomplish interstellar travel on a viable basis, the distances between stellar masses is simply that ludicrously great.
The speed of light itself forms a fundamental physical impediment to the whole proposition to begin with - when it comes to pure energy, light is it. There's virtually bugger all else to it - all other forms of energy either travel at a speed equal too or less than light.
When it comes to moving a thing like a ship it needs to expend energy in order to move - the problem is the speed of light physically is as fast as energy itself is capable of travelling. Consequently, after a point of about half light speed the ration between energy expenditure and acceleration bottoms out and it becomes increasingly harder to accelerate further.
Think of it like rolling a rock along an endless smooth plane that gradually curves ever upwards until vertical. At first it takes a fair amount of energy to get the rock moving, but once underway a relatively small increase in energy expenditure increases forward momentum and so on and so forth until about the mythical point of halfway when the ground begins to curve upwards. From that point on further increase in acceleration becomes ex potentially harder to achieve and, in achieving it, as you travel further, you're essentially making it even harder for yourself because the incline your on grows ever steeper with further progress until eventually you reach a point where you're chucking everything you have into the thing and not actually travelling any faster.
Chucking more energy into it doesn't make any difference - there isn't enough of the stuff in the entire universe because energy itself has a physical top speed - and that speed is the speed of light.
So even close to light speed travel in itself represents a profound physical problem in order to over come however, even in attaining light speed travel itself it still isn't anywhere near enough to make interstellar travel a viable thing to do.
Viable interstellar travel requires faster than light speed travel, and that in itself, given that the speed of light is as fast as energy itself is capable of travelling, gives your average ET a very singular problem about what they're supposed to be using for fuel, because whatever it is, it has to be able to propel a starship faster than energy itself is capable of traveling...
Whatever else that solution may be, I doubt it's unleaded.
Gustav said:heh
thanks for the excellent exposition
now i am absolutely depressed
Light said:Well explained!
Light said:Well explained!
And I'll add something on top of that. The closest star to us is Proxima Centauri and it's 4.22 light-years away. Even if you assume we could eventually acheive light-speed somehow, a round trip there would take 8.44 years!!! And that's traveling at max velocity every inch of the way and doesn't even allow time to visit their local Dunkin' Doughnuts before you have to start back again.
btimsah said:
Woowoos are often underachievers, and poorly educated, but have an ego they need to polish, so self aggrandize by involving themselves in some large scale conspiracy that only they know the 'truth' about.
I was seated near the front of the passenger cabin of an all-metal airliner (Eastern Airlines Flight EA 539) on a late night flight from New York to Washington. The aircraft encountered an electrical storm during which it was enveloped in a sudden bright and loud electrical discharge (0005h EST, March 19, 1963). Some seconds after this, a glowing sphere a little more than 20 centimeters in diameter emerged from the pilot's cabin and passed down the aisle of the aircraft approximately 50 centimeters from me, maintaining the same height and course for the whole distance over which it could be observed.
glenn239 said:However, for UFO sightings, I think you’ll find that using demographic and statistical analysis to ‘weed’ sighting cases will actually reinforce the credibility of certain sightings. In this respect I would draw a sharp distinction between abduction reports and UFO sightings.
phlogistician said:Yep, and imagine travelling at or very near C, and the damage that a speck of dust would do to your ship. Now, here's a question, is it possible to deflect such a piece of dust if you are on a ship travellling at C? Electric and Magnetic fields deform around objects moving at such speeds, so trying to ionise and move a dust particle wouldn't be possible, would it? Even using a powerful beam of laser light to push dust away wouldn't work, as the light wouldn't actually leave the laser, if the laser was already travelling at C, ... so, how to remove dust/debris from your path?
At light speed, how much friction would the inter stellar medium provide, and how much would this heat up a ship also?
Anybody?
Mr Anonymous said:Doubt very seriously anyone is ever actually going to build a genuine light speed engine - the fuel resources necessary alone remain almost literally astronomical and its a vacuous waste of fuel. besides, there's potentially a way around it.
One thing that does occur though. If indeed high velocity travel through the medium of space would be sufficient to generate some degree of surface friction for the ship - that would rather dictate you were setting up a bow wave of some sort through the medium you were travelling through forward of the ship.
Not going to put off the interstellar version of an oncoming ice berg, but hardly unlikely to have zero effect on oncoming particulate material, which, we have to bear in mind, the frequency of which diminishes rapidly outside the confines of solar systems....