is it true that the quran says jesus didnt really die on the cross?

thats good if injustices are being done in the name of god, but what about just people stating that they believe in god on a forum, are they doing injustice to anyone?
It depends why they believe. Irrational faith is harmful, even if innocent.

if you are harassing someone because of their beliefs how are you any different from religious zealots who harass people for non belief?
I don't consider having a conversation to be harassment, but for the most part, evangelizing isn't my problem with religion. I expect people who believe certain things to care that other people don't believe those things, when the consequences to non-belief are the worst one can imagine. I just happen to think they are wrong. I'm just as evangelical about my atheism as religious people are about their religion (maybe a little less, I'm not going door-to-door, or standing on a street corner shouting, or going to foreign countries to convince them I'm right).
 
i don't consider having a conversation to be harassment either so i guess we agree on that. extremists start out by being angry at people who believe in something different. i don't go door to door or grab everyone i see and tell them my beliefs are right. i only try to act honestly according to my beliefs.
 
i don't consider having a conversation to be harassment either so i guess we agree on that. extremists start out by being angry at people who believe in something different. i don't go door to door or grab everyone i see and tell them my beliefs are right. i only try to act honestly according to my beliefs.
I honestly don't care what people believe, but beliefs have consequences in this life. Those consequences that are the reason I get angry about certain beliefs being proliferated. For instance, that women are lesser beings because they came from Adam and are responsible for original sin. Such a belief would be merely curious but for the fact that it's used to justify sexism.
 
the bible doesn't state that eve is responsible for original sin, it tells us what her actions were, and the concept of original sin is not stated in the bible either, its merely interpreted that way by certain people. i believe in just the teachings of jesus, not paul, or the old testament.
 
The greatest faith is passive. Both non-resistance in the bible, and ascension into paradise from earth in the Quran are passive acts. Ultimately the outcome is the same, Jesus went to Heaven.​
 
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Note that the Quran was written around 610 CE, so is far removed from being any form of direct evidence observed by the authors. It is of course claimed to be divinely inspired, so the issue of Jesus death is allegedly being told here by Allah.

The historicity of Jesus is highly disputed, and Wiki should not be assumed to be authoritative on this. The range is from; he never existed, to was only a man and not divine, a special prophet but not divine, to fully divine. There is no definitive independent evidence he existed, and what people choose to believe is more about their subjective assessments of probability based on time massaged tales from the myth makers of those early times.

Every religion has its own agenda and claims. The older religion, Judaism, likely has the more accurate and "independent" assessment on Jesus - just another (of many) false messiah claimant, and is thus appropriately ignored.

The creators of Islam, some 600 years later, introduce the semi-divine variant for Jesus - the idea of him as a prophet, a special messenger of Allah, being more than just a man.

Whether Jesus was crucified or not does not seem to be important - it is only a form of death. The issue is whether he was resurrected, a central and critical aspect for Christianity. Islam, must necessarily deny that Jesus was resurrected since that would promote Christianity to the one true religion when everyone must know that Islam is the one true religion.

It is interesting how the creators of Islam were trying not to dis Christianity completely but appeared to be trying to give Jesus a special place, even though not divine. Perhaps an attempt at compromise so as not to upset Christians completely. They failed of course since the Christians tried to exterminate them - re the Crusades.

Christians see Jesus as the savior of ALL mankind. Muslims see Jesus as an important prophet for just a special group of people, but it is Mohammed that brings the true message of mercy to ALL mankind. When the religions are reduced to their basic claims they appear like the counter claims of children - mine is best, no mine is best, etc.


As one comedian put it about warring religions "Like tantrum school kids chanting 'My invisible god is better than your invisible god'"
 
if you are harassing someone because of their beliefs how are you any different from religious zealots who harass people for non belief?

Dr_Toad was not harassing anyone that I could tell. He merely stated an opinion that "Gods are a product of fears and stupidity".
 
It seems the crucifixion is one of the few things about the life of Jesus that is regarded as historically pretty certain.

I don't think there is anything about the reported life of the man Jesus that can be asserted with any kind of certainty.
 
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