Intelligent People 'Less Likely to Believe in God'

Cellar_Door said:
Before you tie me to the stake, let me say that this thread is but harmless speculation. Any thoughts?
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Thoughts? Yeah, one group of people essentially calling others "un-intelligent" is highly elitist and demeaning.

And you call it "harmless speculation"? I don't think so.

However, now that I've gotten that out of the way..... I'll say this about it; I'd be more inclined to do some investigation into the type of people who do the teaching in our colleges and universities, not to mention our lower-level schools. I know of no college or university that doesn't employ a VERT HIGH percentage of overly liberal, atheistic instructors. So, ...what would you expect their students to learn?

If we sent all of our kids to military school, do you think they might be more inclined to see the military point of view of things?

Baron Max
 
It's not necessarily elitist or demeaning. There are people who are more intelligent than others. There are people who are less educated than others. There are people who think more logicly than others. To be unable to state the truth or reasonable opinion on such without being called elitist & demeaning is ridiculous.
Faith is unintelligent. Accepting things as fact without reasonable evidence is illogical. Believing someone should suffer horribly for eternity for not believing the same as you is not only cruel, ugly & nasty, it is stupid. Trying to force others into a particular belief system & punishing those who stand fast is destructive & divisive.
Claiming to believe & live by a book that says to preach to animals is stupid. Same with the book calling menstruation a sickness that requires staying away from everyone for a week. Claiming the sun stood still in the sky is stupid. Saying Earth has 4 corners is stupid. Claiming man was created perfect then decided to sin is stupid. Ceremonially pretending to eat of someone's body & drink their blood is ghoulish & stupid.
The whole thing about man must be punished for sin except that it can be avoided by god making part of itself become humanoid to "die" on the cross is just plain stupid.
Our schools need much improvement but it's good we don't send all kids to church schools.
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There is an undeniable positive correlation between education and the lack of religious adherence. The more educated a person is the less likely they are to hold religious convictions.

This correlation need not be related to intelligence, however.
 
come off it Baron, you don't think people that worship Xenu aren't a bit low on the IQ scale?

Please! :p
 
SkinWalker said:
There is an undeniable positive correlation between education and the lack of religious adherence. The more educated a person is the less likely they are to hold religious convictions.
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I'm not questioning that correlation at all.

I am, however, questioning the influences of that very same "education". If that education is NOT neutral in matters of god and religion, then perhaps its the influences and NOT the intelligence or IQ of the students.

As I've said above, if all kids were taught in military schools, don't you think that they'd have a far different view of life than is now apparent in society?

The correlation is due to the TYPE of teaching and the beliefs of the instructors.

Baron Max
 
All influences are factors in the person a child grows up to be. A big 1 is suppression of critical reasoning & questioning which begins with parents & family, continues in school & is heavily reinforced by society.
My teachers, principals, counselors, etc didn't heavily promote religion in school but it was there with the clear message that it was THE way to be. I have the strong impression most US public schools are similiar.
Influences are important thus we have a religion dominant in an area continuing to dominate that area in succeeding generations.
Natural inclination toward questioning & critical reasoning in some can be influenced heavily to the negative.
My critical reasoning couldn't be repressed for long despite the bad influences of immediate family, extended family, church, school, neighborhood, friends, work environment & society.
Whether a person's intelligence potential is realized or suppressed by whatever influences or other factors, it's all yet a matter of intelligence & logic. If someone is influenced not to use their intelligence, they will be or seem to be uintelligent. If someone is influenced to believe unintelligent things they will be or seem unintelligent.
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Baron Max said:
I'm not questioning that correlation at all.

I am, however, questioning the influences of that very same "education". If that education is NOT neutral in matters of god and religion, then perhaps its the influences and NOT the intelligence or IQ of the students.

As I've said above, if all kids were taught in military schools, don't you think that they'd have a far different view of life than is now apparent in society?

The correlation is due to the TYPE of teaching and the beliefs of the instructors.

Baron Max
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any higher level of education requires critical thinking.
once people start thinking critically they usually apply it to all areas of their lives (lots of people dont,there are lots of theistic scientists who are able to compartmentalize their lives)

it has little to do with atheistic liberal professors.never in my entire eductation did i have any teacher express an opinion about religion other than professing belief.

i would imgaine the same correlation would happen in the military
ie.the more technical/advanced the job is or the higher the persons rank is the less likely they are to actually believe...
tool of the powerful to control the weak yadayadayada..
 
kenworth said:
it has little to do with atheistic liberal professors.never in my entire eductation did i have any teacher express an opinion about religion other than professing belief...
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At University a single lecturer expressed disbelief in life after death, but made no comment on his views about God. At school there were regular formal expressions of belief during morning assembly, but only a single teacher routinely vocalised their Christian beliefs.

The Baron's claim of influence of atheist teachers sounds reasonable, but in my own experience it was completely irrelevant. Apart from the two examples mentioned I have no idea what the religious beliefs of any of my teachers and professors was. Oops! Forgot one - a senior geology lecturer who was a devout Baptist. I recall he wrote the chapter on geology in a book about the Holy Land.
 
Ophiolite said:
The Baron's claim of influence of atheist teachers sounds reasonable, but in my own experience it was completely irrelevant.
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No, I would suggest that you only think it was irrelevant. A person doesn't have to stand on a soapbox in order for us to perceive his stance on issues.

Ophiolite said:
Apart from the two examples mentioned I have no idea what the religious beliefs of any of my teachers and professors was.
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I'll bet you did. You might not have even known it at the time, you might not even know it now, but I'm betting that by their speech, lectures, stance on issues, etc. they "told you" of their religious beliefs.

And, again, I think it's the same in a military school ...the instructors might not actually suggest military options for all of the world's problems, but it's right there in that fuzzy cloud all around, ain't it?

Baron Max
 
Baron Max said:
I'll bet you did. You might not have even known it at the time, you might not even know it now, but I'm betting that by their speech, lectures, stance on issues, etc. they "told you" of their religious beliefs.
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I really don't think so Baron.
speech: I am at a loss to see how tone, volume, pitch variation, confidence, vocabulary, etc they could convey their religious beliefs. I know atheists who will 'not take the name of the Lord in vain'. I know devout Christians who regularily use Jesus Christ as an invective. Perhaps you can give a specific example, or three of what you mean.
lectures: they talked the subject only. Even the Baptist geologist I mentioned never once, even on extended field trips, said anything about his religion. There was a rumour among the undergraduates that he believed in a six thousand year old Earth and reconciled this with the evidence by assuming God had made it look billions of years old. But never a hint of his religious views penetrated his lectures, lab sessions, field trips, or casual chats.
stance on issues: I can't think of any issues that were prevalent in late 60's Britain that would have allowed one to disitnguish between a theist and an atheist. Can you suggest an example?
 
There's an interesting study (Massengill, 2008) that concludes "Even in light of the increased educational opportunities available to Americans born since 1940, being raised conservative Protestant still exerts a negative effect on educational attainment... conservative Protestants born since 1960 are no less likely to finish high school, but display consistently lower odds of bachelor's degree attainment when compared to mainliners."

This certainly doesn't support the OP (or, specifically, the thread title) that suggests a correlation between intelligence and religiosity, but there's a definite correlation between education and religiosity. The more fundamentally religious a person is, the less likely they are to have an education past high school.

Massengill, Rebekah Peeples (2008). Educational attainment and cohort change among conservative protestants, 1972-2004. Journal for the Scientific Study of Religion, 47(4), 545-562.
 
Agreed, it isn't an indication of intelligence, but it most certainly is an obvious indication of education.
 
There are some very intelligent people, including Einstien, who belive or in the case of the departed, belived in the existence of God and were religious. So I don't think you can make the linkage.

SkinWalker thinks you can make the linkage with education. I am not so certian that makes sense either. I am always skeptical of sociology and it's practioners especially when they dabble into statistics. It is not their strong point.

It makes more sense that there would be a linkage between religion and a belive in God that is related to personality type. I would expect to see a correlation between personality type and adherance to a religion.
 
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