I used to be an atheist

audible

un de plusieurs autres
Registered Senior Member
I often come across religious people, who say they used to be atheists.

my querie is, if your an atheist, how could you possiblely turn to a religion, it defies all common sense.

I could understand it a little more if they said they were agnostic, I know there are different types, of atheists but I cant see any of them losing there senses.

so do you, like me feel that they are liers, or could they be just saying that to justify themselves, or do you have another theory.

this in no way, means I dislike religious people, I just feel I'm being lied too.
 
everneo: this does not help audible, he needs you to tell him why your ar'nt now.

it bugs me also audible, but I usually let it go, to save, calling someone a lier, as you say it makes no sense.
so I cant help as I feel the same.
 
audible said:
I often come across religious people, who say they used to be atheists.

my querie is, if your an atheist, how could you possiblely turn to a religion, it defies all common sense.

I could understand it a little more if they said they were agnostic, I know there are different types, of atheists but I cant see any of them losing there senses.

so do you, like me feel that they are liers, or could they be just saying that to justify themselves, or do you have another theory.

this in no way, means I dislike religious people, I just feel I'm being lied too.

Let me tell you a story ...

Once there was a man who owned a shop. He made shoes. Day in day out people would come and ask him for shoes and he would measure their feet and make the shoes to fit. His customers were very happy and always recommended him to their friends. The man's business grew and grew and soon he owned many shops and became very rich.
Without warning a terrible drought befell the land where the man lived and all the livestock in the land perished.
Leather to make shoes was not to be had and soon the man's business fell away to nothing. The peoples of that land were not interested in new shoes anymore, in fact they struggled just to find enough water to drink. If it wasnt for the underground resevoirs all would have perished.
Now the shoemaker had accumulated much wealth and so decided to move to another country. He thought and thought about which country to set his empire up in and was faced with a curious dilemma. Should he set up in a country where the poeples there wear no shoes or should he set up in a country where everyone wore shoes?
The man pondered that if he set up where they all wore shoes then he would have to penetrate the market forces already in existence, whereas if he set up in a country where no one wore shoes he ran the risk of never being able to create a market at all.
The man went to visit a wise friend whom he was sure would be able to help him in his dilemma.
The wise friend asked the shoemaker why he thought that some people wore shoes and some didn't. The shoemaker replied "Well I know why people wear shoes but I cannot tell you why people do not wear shoes?"
Well said the wise friend, perhaps you should ask them?
So the shoemaker set off for the land where no one wore shoes. When he arrived he went off to the market place their to see what they did sell. He found fruit and meat and clothes but he found no shoes or anything that even resembled shoes. Now even though the shoemaker knew this was the case, he couldnt really visualise such a place until he actually arrived there and saw all the people with bare feet. The shoemaker decided to ask one of the locals why there were no shoes anywhere but the shoemaker did not speak the language of the country and the native just looked at him blankly. The shoemaker pointed to his own shoes and then to the bare feet of the native. The native looked puzzled and just shrugged his shoulders. The shoemaker became increasingly frustrated and decided to take his own shoes off and give them to the native to try.
The native watched with amusement as the shoemaker struggled to untie the strings that seemed to secure the leather to his feet but was pleased when the shoemaker handed him the leather foot garments. The shoemaker beckoned to the bare feet of the native and made gestures to the native encouraging him to try them on. The native tried to slip the shoes on his own feet but they were far too small. The native struggled and struggled but no matter how hard he tried he could not get them on his huge calloused feet. Other natives had gathered around this scene and were starting to laugh at their native friend who was hopping all over the place with strange leather garments hanging off of his feet. The native turned on his friends and said in a language known to them "Well you try them on then. See if they fit you!"
Each native took a turn but none of them could secure the shoes to their large calloused feet. Eventually the shoes were handed back to the shoemaker by the first native who just shook his head.
The shoemaker was at the end of his tether and in desparation he purchased some raw leather from a nearby market stall. He returned to the native and began to wrap the leather around the foot of the man. All the natives said "Ahhh" as they saw what the shoemaker was doing and all went to purchase leather for the shoemaker to wrap around their feet.
Before long the shoemaker was making shoes for all the natives, well all the natives but one.
The native that wouldn't wear the shoes was scornful of his brothers. He said to them "Look at your feet now, see how soft they have become!, These shoes are the devil's business. How will you be able to hunt in the woods now that your feet have become so soft? Look at the skin of my foot, it is hard and calloused and it has always served me well. You fools, you have been tricked here by some enemy."
The first native turned to his brother and said "Brother, you do not believe that these shoes were sent by God? I tell you this, the skin of my own foot may now be soft but these shoes protect my skin underneath. When I run through the forest now, my feet do not have to endure the rough ground that brings forth thorns and weeds for these leather shoes take the suffering where I now take none. Often I have had to forgoe a hunt because of the damage done to my feet and you have suffered too therefore. If you do not wear these shoes you are putting us all at risk. You are a mighty hunter and your feet are the strongest but you are not infallible. You should thank God for these shoes that will enable you to hunt all season without fear of injury."
The undecided native considered what his brother had said but could not see the logic in it and so went to visit their father for advice.
"Father. Our brothers are all wearing leather garments on their feet and their skin has been made soft. We have always needed the hard skin of our feet to hunt. Only the women have soft feet! I believe these shoes are the devil's curse on us men!"
The father replied "My son, whether you have shoes or not, you will find a way to hunt. If your brothers wish to wear these shoes to protect their feet what is that to you? You do not have to wear these leather garments do you?"
The son replied "No I do not but my brother said that he thought it would benefit us."
"Is your brother against you then?" asked the father.
"No" replied the son.
"Then how can you say that these shoes are the devil's work then?"
The son thanked his father for his wise words and went to see the shoemaker.
"Shoemaker", said the native, "I want you to make for me the very best shoes you can. They must be the strongest most beautiful shoes that you have made."
The shoemaker measured the man and set about his work. He sourced the finest materials and made for the man the very nicest shoes that you had ever seen. The native was very pleased with his new shoes. They fitted him perfectly.
The natives brothers were all jealous when they saw their brothers shoes and they mocked him accordingly "Hey!", they said, "I thought these shoes were the devil's work, but here you are sporting the very nicest shoes we have ever seen. They make ours look poor in comparison!"
"Go and see the shoemaker and take your complaint to him then" retorted their brother. I am sure he can make you a pair just the very same."

peace

c20
 
audible said:
I often come across religious people, who say they used to be atheists.

my querie is, if your an atheist, how could you possiblely turn to a religion, it defies all common sense.

I could understand it a little more if they said they were agnostic, I know there are different types, of atheists but I cant see any of them losing there senses.

so do you, like me feel that they are liers, or could they be just saying that to justify themselves, or do you have another theory.

this in no way, means I dislike religious people, I just feel I'm being lied too.
they were probably not religious/worshiping at some time in their lifes,
or not even thinking about religion at all,
and then figured just in case theres God,
(Pascals wager) ;) they started believing.
so they could say they were atheists then I suppose.
 
is'nt that just not knowing.
I would not say it was atheism, however you make a good point.
as you know, you become atheist by reasoning out the pros and cons of religion.
and realising there is no god.
you cant be atheist( active rejection of belief in the existence of God) without having knowledge of religion.
 
Medicine Woman said:
c20H25N3o: Let me tell you a story ...
*************
M*W: And your point ... ?

Well the poster did not believe that someone who had no faith and did not believe that something could be 'good', might turn around in the total other direction and have faith and call it 'good'.
The story served to point out that we all lean to our own understanding on matters, in the case of the atheist there must be no 'God' and according to the poster it must be impossible for that atheist to see the light. The story highlighted the brother who was proud of his own achievments represented by his hard skinned feet and was afraid to adopt new ideas such as wearing shoes in case all he achieved was taken away.
His brothers on the other hand were willing to see the benefits in the shoes because of the persistence of the shoemaker. The shoemaker was persistent even willing to give up his own shoes that the natives might have understanding and new shoes but the resistant brother was anti the shoemaker from the moment he gave his brothers something he perceived as bad and evil.
Fortunately that resistant brother was not entirely arrogant and sought council from his father. The father gently pointed out that his son's brother was not acting against him by wearing these shoes. The brother considered his fathers words and saw the light. How can this thing be against him if his brother is for him. That resistant brother then turned around completely and suddenly wanted the best pair of shoes in the house.
The point of the story is that when we know something is bad, we do not really know at all and it is best to seek objective opinion from those who love you unconditionally because they too will encourage you to be objective. Stubbornly holding onto your own understanding of a matter could really just mean that you miss out. I see the converted atheist much the same as that once resistant brother. The other brothers who were not resistant initially were jealous of their brother's new shoes because they were better than even theirs. This is how it is sometimes when a new believer comes into the midst of the old. God gives them extra special shiny gifts that makes his existing followers get jealous for more. God wants his follower's to keep asking for the good things that he provides. It is God's great pleasure to give you good things. In the end all the brothers had the same wonderful shoes.

hope that helps make sense of the parable to you.

peace

c20
 
audible said:
I often come across religious people, who say they used to be atheists.

my querie is, if your an atheist, how could you possiblely turn to a religion, it defies all common sense.
I’d say a slow growing form of brain cancer, probably all sorts of hallucinogenic chemicals pouring into the poor saps brain.
 
Michael said:
I’d say a slow growing form of brain cancer, probably all sorts of hallucinogenic chemicals pouring into the poor saps brain.

*yawn*

Please take some time Michael to actually read some of my posts. I think you will find them thought provoking if you can just lay yourself aside briefly. I take your belittling of me as a compliment however such as I am want to do.

Thanks

c20
 
c20H25N3o said:
Well the poster did not believe that someone who had no faith and did not believe that something could be 'good', might turn around in the total other direction and have faith and call it 'good'.
The story served to point out that we all lean to our own understanding on matters, in the case of the atheist there must be no 'God' and according to the poster it must be impossible for that atheist to see the light.
c20
I think you must be reading a different thread, the whole point that audible is saying when you become an atheist, you become enlightened, ( see the light) everything becomes clear.
your no longer blinded, no more blinkers on.
so with that clarity of thought, you could not possibly take a step backwards to delusional.
so your point was lost and still is.
 
the preacher said:
I think you must be reading a different thread, the whole point that audible is saying when you become an atheist, you become enlightened, ( see the light) everything becomes clear.
your no longer blinded, no more blinkers on.
so with that clarity of thought, you could not possibly take a step backwards to delusional.
so your point was lost and still is.

audible said:
my querie is, if your an atheist, how could you possiblely turn to a religion, it defies all common sense.

I demonstrated how one could possibly turn to something that they previously scorned as being useless. I effectively answered the poster's query with a parable and then explained the parable.

thanks

c20
 
a parable is just a story, and it did not answer audibles question, else you would not have recieved I quote " and your point is" would you.
even if you explained yourself.
because you are completely wrong in your ideas on atheism.
and as I said you dont take a step backwards.
 
the preacher said:
a parable is just a story, and it did not answer audibles question, else you would not have recieved I quote " and your point is" would you.
even if you explained yourself.
because you are completely wrong in your ideas on atheism.
and as I said you dont take a step backwards.

"So also no one comprehends the thoughts of God except the Spirit of God. Now we have received not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit which is from God, that we might understand the gifts bestowed on us by God. And we impart this in words not taught by human wisdom but taught by the Spirit, interpreting spiritual truths to those who possess the Spirit. The unspiritual man does not receive the gifts of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned." (1 Corinthians 2:11-14 RSV)
 
To put it simply: It's the end of the line.

The one constant thing with those who have been 'born again', is that they were at the bottom of the barrel.

"I was doing drugs, my wife left me, I almost died, I had a serious illness" are but a small choice of what you'll hear from a born again.

It's a last ditch effort by the brain to move their attention away from them realising their life sucks.

In general it works, but then it isn't a solution, just a delusion. It's no different to alcohol or any form by which focus is diverted from our sorry state of being.

You said; "it defies all common sense", to which I say; of course it does, and that's the point. Once people have reached this stage, common sense has gone the way of the dodo, and all that's left is a burnt out wreck that needs "saving", and hence the religious "salvation".

Some people find salvation in a glass, some in drugs, some with shrinks and some in jumping off a tall building. god belief is exactly the same, just another method.


Perhaps a better question though, is why people who were once religious, and adamantly stated they had a relationship with god/jesus etc, end up becoming atheist. If someone knows god, and knows the existence of a being - they wouldn't just wake up one day and not believe in it anymore.

In this instance it's like an alcoholic turning sober. The problems have somewhat been resolved, leaving the salvation method no longer needed.

It just goes to show how fake the belief is. There is no god, and there never was - these people just needed there to be one, and so the brain created it for them.
 
Salavation is only possible through Jesus Christ. Not through any other means.

And personally, I think that God's wisdom is so perfect in choosing the suffering lambs to inherit His Kingdom. Who has made those lambs suffer? And what end shall be theres? As Jesus said "I come not to bring peace but a sword of division"

Let he who hath ears to hear ...
 
Salavation is only possible through Jesus Christ. Not through any other means.

You're not in any valid position to say such a thing, and as such it is inherently worthless.

I see people day in - day out who have found "salvation" through varying methods, and can assure you there is no difference between them. Maybe if you were in my position you could say such a thing, but then you wouldn't. Remember, the only reason you do say such a thing is because you are currently stuck within that method of salvation. It is no different to an alcoholic telling you that whisky is wonderful.
 
Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ so that your sins may
be forgiven. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
Acts 2:38 (NIV)

The Word of God tells me I am in every such position.

Thanks

c20
 
Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ so that your sins may
be forgiven. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
Acts 2:38 (NIV)

The Word of God tells me I am in every such position.

Your preaching is sweet, but what you're quoting are merely the words of ancient shepherds. People you don't know, never knew, and will never know.

So again, you're not in a position.. and the only reason you see the bible as the word of god is because you're currently stuck within that method of salvation. You require it to keep you going, just like an alcoholic requires a bottle.

I can guarantee you that a good shrink will do you a lot more good than your current method.
 
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