Yeah but there's still nothing that they can do to make a significant difference. Is anything really going to be better if everyone's more depressed?
I don't care if it does not affect me...
- Thread starter S.A.M.
- Start date
Yeah but there's still nothing that they can do to make a significant difference. Is anything really going to be better if everyone's more depressed?
Oh I think watching a child starving on television and watching him starve in front of you is very different. Same for hearing about a man being tortured and hearing his screams. I doubt you'd be able to turn off real life as easily and pretend there was nothing you could do about it.
And what about when there's actually nothing you can do about it?
There are very few things you can do nothing about, but even in those few cases, you can prevent it from happening again. Or at least try. Change is always brought about by the few who attempt it.
Simon Anders
Valued Senior Member
Depression is not the only possible emotional reaction. The fact is that emotions, including not so pleasant ones are the motivators for change. If you look at the Civil Rights movement in the US, it was when Northern Whites and some Southern Whites saw on TV how the Southern racists and police were treating non-violent protesting blacks that real change began taking place. People who had not been directly affected before by racism - that they were aware of - now were affected. And then began to act.
Simon Anders
Valued Senior Member
Who is the 'we' and who compels them?
Why are you optimistic about intra-national compulsion but extremely skeptical about inter-national compulsion? Aren't both at root inter-cultural and dominance programs?
I think the compulsion should be at the level of family and school.
When we were young community service was a given. A part of your income every month HAD to be set aside for things like feeding people, giving people clothes, finding employment for widows and orphans, teaching people, giving chores to young people to teach them a skill. Community service was compulsory in both family and school.
Why don't we encourage things like that?
I would still prefer a voluntary service as opposed to one that is forced. Why do you have to be forced to provide such services?
We pay taxes, don't we? So why not give so many hours a year to community service?
Would it be such a burden?
It may be a sad statement on the human behaviour, but we have to be taught how to apply sacrifice, generosity and caring. How many of us assuage our consciences by providing money rather than services?
We teach our children to brush their teeth, to eat healthy food, to exercise, to dance, to bicycle, why can't we teach them to devote a portion of their lives to caring about people?
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I have no idea what you're talking about. I simply asked why you need to be forced to provide voluntary services? Very weak morals and ethics, it would seem.
See the OP.
So, you have no answer. You simply force people because your ethics and morals are geared towards serving a sky daddy instead of your fellow man.
Simon Anders
Valued Senior Member
This is an oblique answer. Some tradional activities were definitely good. Like the ones you mention above. On the other hand so much guilt and control was involved in being a good person, being a good child, that the patterns had the seeds of their destruction in them. Sooner or later individuals and societies will want to know if they really need to feel guilty and do things (entirely or partially) out of guilt.
There has also been a trend towards individualism. I saved myself. You save yourself. Nobody makes me feel bad for what I do or don't do unless I directly hurt someone. The problem with this is that we have modeled this one on the people who will never give a shit about anyone else or notice the ways success in one person or place has often been dependent on suffering somewhere else.
We need to resolve this issue as a species without returning to the two old tried and false methods
1)guilt and compulsion to be good (religious messages that tell us that we are basically bad, will become bad if we are not vigilant, have evil inside us that must be controlled and so on. Scientists, actually, have rather remarkably similar judgements about people and themselves, but do not think of these things in religious terms)
1) hallucinations of disconnectedness reinforced by denial (Ayn Rand and the modern crop of neo-conservative fundamentalists are great examples of this one)
The first begs the question and DEMANDS challenges and failure.
The second is demanding that we focus on only a very small portion of our internal experience and real reactions to things around us.
Well you clearly care about other people and provide a variety of services, so you're excluded.
Another non-answer. Waste of space.
Do you feel guilty if you don't brush your teeth? I'm wondering why habituation is criminal. If you were walking on the street and you saw an unescorted child alone, would you do something about it or would you walk past? What factors would influence either course of action? What makes you care or not care?
People who are forced to volunteer would care less as their paychecks are tapped, hence would leave an unescorted child alone and would simply state in passing, "I gave at the office."