I Can't Say Gay!

[CounslerCoffee]

At work we were told today that we can't say gay! I can't say:

"Hey. That's gay."
"We can have a gay ol' time."
"That's freakin gay man."
"Homosexuals are gay."

Apparently someone from another belt (work station) heard someone on my belt say something along the lines of what was mentioned above. Also, my friend Joe has been known to use the word "Fag".

So we were all told:

1. No more cussing.
2. No more saying "gay".
3. No more sex or drug related discussions.

I asked my supervisor if I could talk about politics. Sure she said. Of course I could. So Im in the break room and I start talking about Trent Lott and Senator Santrum. Just to piss the people off at the next table in the break room (Because it was someone from another belt, not from mine.) I said that Santrum was right. Gay marriages should not be allowed.

I then get approached by my full time supervisor (Not my supervisor, THE supervisor. She can fire me). She said that I was way out of line. I told her that I was merely stating an opinion and told her that it was my belief that homosexuality is wrong and immoral. Just to piss off the people around me I through in a bunch of Jesus crap.

I was told that Im not allowed to state opinions like that. I then told her that that gay guy over there told me all sorts of stuff about gay marriages and how they should be legal and such.

So it came down to this:

It's okay for that gay guy to debate gay politics. But Im not allowed to. I tried to point this out to the full time supervisor, she didn't get it.

Is it okay for me to debate gay politics without being gay? Or is that taboo? Im not allowed to talk about gays because Im not gay. Riiight. But those gay guys can talk about straight people and gay politics. It really doesn't make any sense.

 

[Cowboy]

Originally posted by CounslerCoffee
Is it okay for me to debate gay politics without being gay?

The communities and nations are made up of various groups, so there is no reason why we all shouldn't be able to discuss issues facing these groups or even the groups themselves.

Originally posted by CounslerCoffee
It really doesn't make any sense.

Political correctness rarely does.

 

[Mystech]

Well at one time I have to just smirk about your employer making rules against it's employees talking like foul mouthed Jr. High kids "Oh mah gawd, dat's so Gay, yo!" but despite that, when it comes down to it I can't really say I support an employer telling it's employees what they can and can not talk about.

Personally I feel a bit of distress and anger every time I hear someone using my sexual orientation as a curse word. Hets are far too gung ho about that, and I realize that in most cases it isn't even meant as a slight to homosexuals, but still it pisses me the hell off. Take any factor of your personal identity and urge others to use it as a curse word if you want to understand what I'm talking about, it doesn't inspire healthy emotions.

Anyway, aside from personally being offended by such talk, I still think that you should have every right to talk about whatever you want in the break room, or in the process of doing your job, if you aren't someone who's working with customers, that is (I could understand banning such talk where customers may overhear).

As for the gay guy being able to talk about political matters involving gays, whereas you are not. . . I'll have to support him there. All straight people, just shut your fucking mouths about gay marriages, talk about it amongst yourselves if you must, but get it through your heads that your opinion doesn't matter worth a damn, and seeing how as it doesn't involve you, keep your fucking nose out of other peoples business

No, honestly though, if he can talk about it you should be able to, as well, but in the context of the issue your opinion shouldn't matter with a damn, and his should, seeing how as it involves him and yours doesn't. . . but then laws aren't being made in the backrooms of whatever labor site you are working at, so neither of your opinions in that setting really matter worth a damn anyway, so you're on equal ground and should as such be treated as such.

That being said, I have just one question left for you, why exactly do you think that homosexuals shouldn't be allowed to marry, or were you just saying that in order to piss people off?

 

[CounslerCoffee]

We do not work around custromers. Also, about the people around me talking like a bunch of 15 year olds, I agree. I have never used the word gay as slang, or other words. Including that F word.

That being said, I have just one question left for you, why exactly do you think that homosexuals shouldn't be allowed to marry, or were you just saying that in order to piss people off?

I was using it to merely porve a point. Why can he talk about it, but I can't? If he can state his opinion that he believes gays should be married, then why can't I say opposite? Or agree? Or disagree? Had I agreed with the gay people Im sure that I wouldn't of gotten in trouble.

I should be able to state my opinion no matter what it is. So tomarrow Im going to work with a bible and Im going to start preaching about homosexuality being wrong. (Not really)

(Note: Management doesn't want insults thrown around. Since when has an opinion become an insult?)

 

[wesmorris]

Originally posted by Mystech
Personally I feel a bit of distress and anger every time I hear someone using my sexual orientation as a curse word.

That is so totally gay. I am SO sure.

Hehe.. dude, lighten up. Why so sanctimonious about your sexual orientation? If you allow it, you can be hurt by words. I'd suggest that you do not allow it... EVER. Don't take them so seriously... it's what's behind the words that should matter no?

OH, and coffee: OMFG dude.. your situation sickens me. Speech nazis must die. Oh wait. I'm sensing irony. Yeah, hey wait. YOU are a fucking speech nazi. Hehe.. I like you kid but damn this punishment seems to fit the crime. The implication as to free speech and freedom in general however does NOT look good. *shivers*

This is what happens when prejudice is allowed to be mandated. Seems like the constitution desperately needs an overhaul. The lawyers have picked all the meat off of the original.

I'm not sure where to draw the line on laws regarding people being offended about something. I'm tempted to say NOWHERE.

How can "offending" someone be a criminal act? That is simply shameful that a government of good leaders would allow that to happen. Disgusting really. Eh, maybe I'm not thinking of some detail that makes my point dissipate?

What a bunch of crap dude. Ack. I'd be finding a new freakin job since it seem you're now working for a bunch of commie assholes. Sad thing is they're probably just 'protecting their ass' to avoid lawsuits, etc. Seems pretty damned weak to me.

 

[one_raven]

Originally posted by wesmorris
it's what's behind the words that should matter no?

What is behind those words?

What I think is behind them:
It is a common consensus that it is a negative thing to be homosexual.
It is a belief that homosexuals are "sissies" and either don't deserve respect, or don't require respectful treatment because what are the sissies goping to do about it anyway.
It is a belief that a homosexual is less of a man than a heterosexual.
It is at the root of all sexual discrimination.

 

[Mystech]

Originally posted by CounslerCoffee
Why can he talk about it, but I can't? If he can state his opinion that he believes gays should be married, then why can't I say opposite? Or agree? Or disagree? Had I agreed with the gay people Im sure that I wouldn't of gotten in trouble.

And rightly, this just shouln't be, if you're going to let people talk about an issue, then EVERYONE should be able to talk about the issue, setting the rules any other way just really isn't helping the situation.

As for now, though, it seems you're just going to have to bend to the will of your homosexual friendly employer. . . um, just don't bend TOO far if you know what I mean

Originally posted by CounslerCoffee
So tomarrow Im going to work with a bible and Im going to start preaching about homosexuality being wrong. (Not really)

Hehe, there's a way to endear yourself to management

Originally posted by CounslerCoffee
(Note: Management doesn't want insults thrown around. Since when has an opinion become an insult?)

Well, some opinions are inherently insulting. I can hold an opinion that you and all your kind are a bunch of jackass doodieheads, and that's my opinion, and yes it is insulting and derogatory.

 

[Mystech]

Originally posted by wesmorris
That is so totally gay. I am SO sure.

Hehe.. dude, lighten up. Why so sanctimonious about your sexual orientation? If you allow it, you can be hurt by words. I'd suggest that you do not allow it... EVER. Don't take them so seriously... it's what's behind the words that should matter no?

My God, that's such a white-male thing to say.

 

[wesmorris]

Originally posted by Mystech
My God, that's such a white-male thing to say.

If you say so. Please though, I'm no stereotypical guy man, you should know that. Fact is: You're being weak. Stop being weak and be fucking strong. You are very bright and capable and I think that if you feel a tinge when you hear some moron saying "gay" in a stupid manner that doesn't involve you, but your "sexuality"... you are not as strong as you should be.

Bulk up if you're in it for the long haul, you'll be SO much better off for it. You see what I mean? I'm not criticizing you for being gay, I'm criticizing you for caring if people use the word "gay" in some manner you dissaprove of. I don't like to think of you being hurt by it. You deserve better. Your quickest route to an emotionally healthy solution is to detach yourself from pointless bullshit. Worrying about a stupid fucking workd is pointless bullshit. Sorry if I'm annoying you, but I'm trying to give you the benefit of a lot of experience dealing with a lot of different fuckards in the world.

 

[CounslerCoffee]

Well, some opinions are inherently insulting. I can hold an opinion that you and all your kind are a bunch of jackass doodieheads, and that's my opinion, and yes it is insulting and derogatory.

No, that's an insult. If you hold the opinion that Im a jerk ass, then that's an insult (Unless you keep it to yourself). If I hold the opinion that gay marriage is wrong, then that's not an insult. It's an opinion. A valid one at that.

As Wesmorris said; stop worrying about a fucking word. It doesn't matter. Sticks and stones may break your bones but in the end you'll still be gay.

 

[one_raven]

Originally posted by wesmorris
That is simply shameful that a government of good leaders would allow that to happen. Disgusting really. Eh, maybe I'm not thinking of some detail that makes my point dissipate?

Oh, sorry.

I thought you were talking about the US government.
Apparently I was mistaken.

I am against Political Correctness on the whole.
Especially when mandated by the governemnt.
I am all for irreverent humor (I LOVE Monty Python and old Saturday Night Live), but at the same time, just the other day I corrected my nephew's cousin for saying something is "gay".

I see that as no different than when a white kid steals a car and other white kids tell him that he is acting like a nigger.

I wouldn't want there to be laws against it, but I would speak up against it if I hear it.

 

[wesmorris]

Originally posted by one_raven
What is behind those words?

What I think is behind them:

(which words are you referring to, the general case? if so, wouldn't it be appropriate to evalutate the use of the word on a case per case basis rather than a sweeping judgment of them prior to their use?)

Originally posted by one_raven

It is a common consensus that it is a negative thing to be homosexual.

That doesn't mean it's the ONLY consensus. Most people that I know don't give too much of a shit but are semi-threatened because they're not equipped to be quickly socially adaptable.

Originally posted by one_raven

It is a belief that homosexuals are "sissies" and either don't deserve respect, or don't require respectful treatment because what are the sissies goping to do about it anyway.

Oh PLEASE! If guy acts feminine he's gonna get treated that way. NEVER STAY WHERE YOU ARE NOT APPRECIATED. Avoid pricks like the plague (kind ironic since if you're a gay guy that's really what you're AFTER). You know it's a tough road going in, but you still stay gay. I respect that, but NO FUCKING WHINING. You'll be treated as an outcast by the stupiderest or socially stunted members of society. That's the downside of being gay. I don't make the rules. I personally do what I can to make gay people comfortable. I consider myself a leison (spell?) to the community since I one of my closest friends is a gay chick, that and I'm socially adaptive. Regardless, expectations of special treatment in any way shape or form will reap you dissapoinment for the most part. Grow up and accept the fact that people are dumb and in a way that puts the fuck on you. Figure out a way to make it your strength (art of war) and quit fucking whining.

Originally posted by one_raven

It is a belief that a homosexual is less of a man than a heterosexual.

If he's feminine, HE IS less of a man. The problem is that some people think that makes him less of a person... that's fucking WRONG.

Originally posted by one_raven

It is at the root of all sexual discrimination.

Sexual discrimination? Oh man. Yeah well you know what, you can't expect people not to be people. People are freaking incapable of adapting to the infinite crap they are exposed to. MOst heteros are threatened by homos because it simply doesn't compute to them and that scares them. If you weren't so fucking self-involved with your goddamn gayness you might see that. YOU are the one who is different, therefore you end up in the position of having to make people comfortable with you. That's just the way it IS.. (for ANYTHING that makes you different)

Like everyone else.. you shouldn't be screwed over but you are. You can whine about it or figure out how to use it to your advantage or integrate it in such a manner that it becomes non-existent (at least minimized). It is not anyone else's responsibility than your own. Everyone has their cross to bear.

Please, I'm not saying gay bashing is good and I'm not saying that efforts to educate people should stop... I'm just saying I'd hate to see you live your life dissapointed by the fact that a bunch of people don't understand you.. because goddamnit EVERYONE has that problem in some way or another. YOU PEOPLE are freaking BRIGHT so you have no excuse for not overcoming this crap.

I'd say attempting to mandate behavior is a piss poor approach to solving the problem of your acceptance..

Eh... maybe I'm just a stupid white male.

 

[CounslerCoffee]

I love it when people take my threads and turn them completely into something that it's not. I can only wonder what Asguard will think when he sees this thread.

Look, my point was a simple one: Why can't I debate gay marriages or homosexuality as a whole? Why can the gay guys do this? But I can't? It doesn't make any sense.

If calling someone gay is an insult to gay people then the following should be classified as under that as well:

"Joe, your a cocksucker."
"You suck dick."
"You suck."
"You suck major dick."
"You should get down on your knees and give head to fifty guys you gosh darn moron."

This is about opinions and why I can't express them.

 

[Mystech]

Originally posted by CounslerCoffee
No, that's an insult. If you hold the opinion that Im a jerk ass, then that's an insult (Unless you keep it to yourself). If I hold the opinion that gay marriage is wrong, then that's not an insult. It's an opinion. A valid one at that.

The thing is, though, heterosexism is inherently insulting to homosexuals, and those who may sympathize.

Saying that I have a right to one thing, but you do not, holds that you are above them and they below you. It is, in itself insulting.

 

[wesmorris]

Originally posted by one_raven
I see that as no different than when a white kid steals a car and other white kids tell him that he is acting like a nigger.

Then I guess my whole rant there was a bit much eh? Eh, I was inspiredish. I see your point and of course you're entitled to your opinion... I'm not sure if I'd frown at you or agree with you if I saw you do it, it would honestly depend on the use at the time. I understand your comparison with the word I almost always avoid... but honestly.. it's THAT harsh of a word? I dunnot, I get mixed up on the issue because I think society is backwards. If I incidently offend you... I think it's YOUR fault, ya know what I'm saying? It's about responsibility and what's truly good for society. Certainly letigious scumbags fishing for lawsuit related insults cannot be a sign of impending enlightenment.

 

[CounslerCoffee]

Saying that I have a right to one thing, but you do not, holds that you are above them and they below you. It is, in itself insulting.

Oh okay. But you reserve the right to say fag, gay, and queer. You also reserve the right to make me keep my own damn opinions to myself and not let me debate the issue period. I see how that's fair. Not.

 

[one_raven]

Wesmorris,

That is such cop-out bullshit and you know it.
"I didn't make the rule, but that's the way it is, so just deal with it."
Please!
Why not just say, "It's not MY fault that gays get beat up simply for being gay, they should take martial arts classes and be a real MAN!"

Just because so many people are racist, people who have crosses burned on their front lawns (it ODES still happen) should just suck it up and move on?

That is the pussy way out.
I prefer to face the problem and deal with it, and TRY (at least) to make a change.

Oh PLEASE! If guy acts feminine he's gonna get treated that way.

I said that it is a belief that homosexuals are "sissies".
I wasn't talking about any specific person acting feminine.
If you are as "socially adaptive" and open minded as you claim you would realize that not all gay men act feminie, but people STILL have that opinion.

If he's feminine, HE IS less of a man.

I see.
That's what makes a man?
I understand now.

Just for the record, I am not gay.
That seems to be your assumption.
I guess because I think sexual orientation discrimination is wrong, I MUST be a fag.

I urge you to stop hiding behing your facade "strength", and actully DO the strong thing.
Stand up against what is wrong even though, "you don't make up the rules".
You seem to agree that the rules are wrong.
Be a man, and stand face to face with those that play by them and tell them they are wrong.

 

[Asguard]

CounslerCoffee

its the first usage i HATE more than anything

oviously homosexuals are gay
and the second is a quote from the flinstones song but "this is gay" meaning bad is what kept me thinking I was bad all through high school cause i liked guys too (actully i think it might have been less of a problem if i had ONLY liked guys because then it would have been harder for me to hide it from myself)

 

[one_raven]

Originally posted by wesmorris
I dunnot, I get mixed up on the issue because I think society is backwards. If I incidently offend you... I think it's YOUR fault, ya know what I'm saying? It's about responsibility and what's truly good for society. Certainly letigious scumbags fishing for lawsuit related insults cannot be a sign of impending enlightenment.

I agree with you actually.

But that doesn't mean that we have to play along with the bullshit rules rather than try to chage behavior that obviously hurts people or knocks them down.

Political Correctness goes WAY too far constantly.

But that does not mean that we can't be at least somewhat empathetic to others.

 

[wesmorris]

Originally posted by Mystech
Saying that I have a right to one thing, but you do not, holds that you are above them and they below you. It is, in itself insulting.

Don't you think there are some exceptions to that reasoning?

As far as I can see it, marriage only have one purpose... making kids feel secure.

What purpose would you see in marriage? I don't think two hetero's should be able to get married until they have a kid now that I think about it. It's a tax cheat. Of course it's just taken as implicit that they WILL, which is a bad policy I think.

So there, I think NOBODY except couples with children should be allowed to marry. Why are you entitled? Join my fight to expose and abolish pre-offspring marriage as a sham!