God has no authority over humankind.

mountainhare said:
madan:
By logically following the premises of Christian dogma, there is no free will. Period.
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Untrue. I believe it's only the Calvinists who believe in predetermination. Anyway, I sure as hell don't.
 
Mosheh Thezion said:
IF GOD showed himself... even you.. would bow down.. out of fear.

and thats no way to treat ones own children.

-MT
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Jesus is god isn't he? and he showed up to people didn't he? lol

Haven't you read the Bible yet? The only true book for humans? Where there are no mistakes and it is written by a Holy Spirit
 
Madan, your God's existence is based on the premise that he knows everything and is completely good. Think of that... He KNOWS EVERYTHING. He CAN NEVER be surprised. He knew adam and eve would betray him. He knew the creatures he created would cause undue suffering to each other. Why did a completely good being allow this. If he is playing chess, as you say, then he's just a bastard. "Hmmmm... I'm gona make a guy who tends towards sadism and the megalomaniacal, and see how he affects the world around him. Woohoo... Whoa, that must have been painful... OOOOOOO... tood bad for those jews... Major props to Hitler and Saddam for creativity."
 
Chiraque said:
Madan, your God's existence is based on the premise that he knows everything and is completely good. Think of that... He KNOWS EVERYTHING. He CAN NEVER be surprised. He knew adam and eve would betray him. He knew the creatures he created would cause undue suffering to each other. Why did a completely good being allow this. If he is playing chess, as you say, then he's just a bastard. "Hmmmm... I'm gona make a guy who tends towards sadism and the megalomaniacal, and see how he affects the world around him. Woohoo... Whoa, that must have been painful... OOOOOOO... tood bad for those jews... Major props to Hitler and Saddam for creativity."
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I believe God built unpredictability into the universe at a fundamental level. The more we learn about physics, the more we realize the universe is a crazy, unpredictable place at the subatomic level.

It is this unpredictability which gives us free will. I do not believe God knows everything. Or rather, he knows everything that is, but doesn't know exactly what will be. But I'm sure he can make some pretty good guesses given his complete knowledge of all that exists.
 
He made universe in balance, a dynamic equilibrium system. Everything has opposites, so that makes everything has their own meanings.
Asking for all loving God that just letting only good to happen without evil, is denying of balance concept. Love has no meaning if there is no evil. He offers heaven for loving people, but will have no meaning if there is no hell.

Omniscience; He knows everything; based on the selection people choose, because he created the path for everyone to choose. He makes random system, and fills it with souls which possess will to do/choose anything one wish to do/choose. He provides the effects of any actions / causes. Is human's fate predetermined? yes and no. The selection is predetermined, but where to go is human's free choice.

He has the authority upon the system of this dynamic equilibrium. Mankind live in this system.
 
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