Free Will in Heaven

M

Mickmeister

Registered Senior Member
It seems to me that if a person goes to heaven, their unconditional free will is taken away and is a form of brain washing from God? From the way I understand it is, what you do in the afterlife is what the father, son, and holy ghost would do.
 
the free will we have in this world is not unconditional (if you don't believe me, eat 4 kg of deep fried potato) so its not clear exactly what you are proposing we have to lose by going to heaven.
 
But we do have free will. We can do anything we want, and pay the consequences, of course. It seems that if you go to heaven though, you are highly influenced (forced) on what you can and cannot do.
 
Mickmeister said:
But we do have free will. We can do anything we want, and pay the consequences, of course. It seems that if you go to heaven though, you are highly influenced (forced) on what you can and cannot do.
Click to expand...
on the contrary we are highly forced what we can and cannot do in this world since it is the very medium of limitations and conditions
 
How do you even know what we will do in heaven? Maybe heaven is our natural state of being. And being here is like taking us out of that natural state and adding a shell (our bodies) to it. And this shell with its needs and desires deludes how we truly are?
 
In Heaven you will cleansed of sin and made whole. Your life will be so blissful you won't want to sin, even if you are able.

All downpayments strictly non-returnable. Please do not ask for credit as this usually offends. Your home is at risk if you do not keep up the repayments on any mortgage or loan secured on it.
 
there's no free will in heaven because if there was we would eat the apple again so we wouldn't be in heaven anymore.
--
alternative answer: when we go to heaven, we become good (god), so we can only do good things, but good things are the only things we want to do, so we do what we want, so we have free will.
 
Yorda said:
there's no free will in heaven because if there was we would eat the apple again so we wouldn't be in heaven anymore.
--
alternative answer: when we go to heaven, we become good (god), so we can only do good things, but good things are the only things we want to do, so we do what we want, so we have free will.
Click to expand...

Your alternative doesn't give free will because we are then forced to be good.
 
Being in heaven does imply perfection and hence only good is possible.

This means you are fundamentally altered so it is not possible for you to even consider bad things.

It could be argued that you still have freewill but that it simply cannot approach the options of choosing bad.
 
we don't have free will on earth either because we are always forced to follow our will.

for example when i wrote this. i wrote it because my will forced me to do it.

Enmos said:
Your alternative doesn't give free will because we are then forced to be good.
Click to expand...

free will means to do "what we want", and if we only want to do good things, it is free will. we do "what we want".
---
but i don't believe in the christian heaven... my picture of heaven is the same as the buddhist/hindu heaven, which is the lack of existence. none of these heavens exist though. well... at least not forever.
 
I'm amused at how seriously some of you take the notion of heaven. No proof needed; trust me I'm religious !
 
Yorda said:
Is there free will in Hell?
Click to expand...
sure
as the joke goes, you can choose to either stand in a pool of excrement up to your waist or you can choose to stand in a pool of excrement up to your knees while drinking coffee.
If you choose the later one, a big demon comes out with a whip and yells "OK - coffee break is over! Everyone get back to standing on their heads!"
:D
 
Yorda said:
we don't have free will on earth either because we are always forced to follow our will.

for example when i wrote this. i wrote it because my will forced me to do it.



free will means to do "what we want", and if we only want to do good things, it is free will. we do "what we want".
---
but i don't believe in the christian heaven... my picture of heaven is the same as the buddhist/hindu heaven, which is the lack of existence. none of these heavens exist though. well... at least not forever.
Click to expand...

LOL Not if God defines what you are able to want.
 
Mickmeister said:
It seems to me that if a person goes to heaven, their unconditional free will is taken away and is a form of brain washing from God? From the way I understand it is, what you do in the afterlife is what the father, son, and holy ghost would do.
Click to expand...
Then where's the freedom?
 
Enmos said:
LOL Not if God defines what you are able to want.
Click to expand...

nature/mind (a.k.a. god) has defined what we want in this life. it's not our will to have sex, we just want it because we're programmed that way. just like i'm programmed to want to write this. and you're programmed to be an atheist.

but true free will is when we can choose what we want... for example, when i'm truly free, i could choose to believe in a specific religion. i could choose to be an atheist. i could choose to like football.

free will is when we can reprogram our programs. feelings and beliefs are programs. because we follow them. when we are free we don't need to follow what our subconscious mind has implanted in us.
 
Frankly, I'll take the risk.

I don't see the 'loss of free will' argument as particularly convincing. Since the fall, mankind has had a distorted image of self and of 'things to be desired'. For instance, most of us like chocolate. A perfect comprehension of the matter would not have us eating chocolate to our own detriment; yet many of us do.

I am not particularly attracted to staying out all night in bars listening to loud music and drinking myself insensate to awake with a nasty taste in my mouth, a dry throat and a headache registering on the Richter Scale. Some see this as a loss of free will. I see it as being free to choose better.

In heaven I will have fellowship and understanding of God. I'm willing to decide now to do that and risk the possibility I will miss being confused, lonely and full of self-doubt.
 
Archie said:
I don't see the 'loss of free will' argument as particularly convincing. Since the fall, mankind has had a distorted image of self and of 'things to be desired'. For instance, most of us like chocolate. A perfect comprehension of the matter would not have us eating chocolate to our own detriment; yet many of us do.

I am not particularly attracted to staying out all night in bars listening to loud music and drinking myself insensate to awake with a nasty taste in my mouth, a dry throat and a headache registering on the Richter Scale. Some see this as a loss of free will. I see it as being free to choose better.

In heaven I will have fellowship and understanding of God. I'm willing to decide now to do that and risk the possibility I will miss being confused, lonely and full of self-doubt.
Click to expand...

The fall ? Is that when our ancestors fell out of the trees and began to walk upright ?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top