Ethics of the Iraq occupation

[Challenger78]

Nope. No country will be willing to sacrifice anything for the UN, because politicians always think of themselves.

 

[madanthonywayne]

Well, who was it that recently tricked women with Down's Syndrome into blowing up themselves and a bunch of civilians? Was that "militants"?

Probably US troops. Wouldn't be the first time.

Is there any point to that kind of comment? Or are you just trying to piss people off? Do you have a single bit of evidence that even suggests that US soldiers are recruiting suicide bombers to attack Iraqi civilians? Or that they have ever recruited suicide bombers to attack Iraqi civilians?

 

[S.A.M.]

Is there any point to that kind of comment? Or are you just trying to piss people off? Do you have a single bit of evidence that even suggests that US soldiers are recruiting suicide bombers to attack Iraqi civilians? Or that they have ever recruited suicide bombers to attack Iraqi civilians?

They are paying Sunni Extremists and arming them.

Why don't you try that in your neghborhood? Collect a few gangs and give them money and guns.

What do you think will happen?

 

[James R]

Kadark:

My point is that if Israel is recognized by the U.N. (despite its history and formation), then that tells me the U.N. is not something I'll take seriously.

Then you're not living in the real world.

The vast majority of nations (from memory about 190 or so) are member states of the United Nations. That includes Israel and Syria and Iraq and Iran. None of them have ever considered withdrawing from the UN, as far as I am aware. You might like to consider why that might be.

It sounds like you believe that no Kurd could ever govern Iraq fairly or without bias. Is that what you think?

That's exactly what I think. It's almost as ridiculous as having Bin Laden run for President in the U.S. and become elected. You'd have to know the history behind this to understand, James.

Ok. Then what's your solution? Do you think Iraq should be split into two or three separate states? Should Kurdistan be allowed to seceed from Iraq and become independent? Would that be a preferred outcome for you?

Did you approve of Saddam's regime then?

More than I do this occupation.

I'm not sure how I can reply to this. Are you aware that Saddam ran a brutal regime of torture and oppression of all political opponents? Are you aware that he aggressively attacked Kuwait? Are you aware that he deliberately set out to commit genocide against the Kurds?

Do you approve of all those things?

 

[James R]

SAM:

Please provide some evidence that the US is paying and arming Sunni extremists.

 

[iceaura]

The Iraqi people have the opportunity to elect a government that will ask the US to leave Iraq, if they wish.

That's delusional.

The lack of legitimacy of the current Baghdad government, including high positions in it occupied by men with no real Iraqi support and obviously installed by the US, is clear. The Kurds are flying their own flag, and fielding their own army.

The US stays or goes on its own whim, and the coming US presidential elections will have more influence on that than anything in Iraqi politics.

Please provide some evidence that the US is paying and arming Sunni extremists.

? The Bush government has been bragging about it for months now, in all the headlines - it's a major component of Petraeus's new strategy.

They're not called "extremists" any more, of course.

 

[Avatar]

I'm not sure how I can reply to this. Are you aware that Saddam ran a brutal regime of torture and oppression of all political opponents? Are you aware that he aggressively attacked Kuwait? Are you aware that he deliberately set out to commit genocide against the Kurds?

Do you approve of all those things?

No, but it's better than what is now.
Then all you have to do was to support Saddam, or even take no stand. And you would be sure that your family is safe and nobody will rape or kill your kids on their way to school or blow of your wife in the marketplace.
You could plan and lead a normal life as long as you didn't get into Saddam's way.

Now you can't plan your future and there is no future there, only chaos and death.

So I'd like to see Saddam back in power too, he was a person that can hold that culture together - a sultan.
They don't understand democracy, they never have had it in 7000 years, it's not fit for their mentality. They need a king or a ruling priestly cast, not a parliament. And the US by not understanding this has made a grave mistake due to its ignorance.

 

[Crunchy Cat]

So, is the current occupation of Iraq by the United States right or wrong?

Neither. Bush attacked for the wrong reason and destroyed the Baath government (which was a good thing). The mistake was not bailing after that and trying to help them rebuild... but I guess a good thing that came out of it was that it created a terrorist magnet where muslims are offing muslims by the nushel.

 

[ashura]

As soon as it's clear that we can withdrawl without igniting a firestorm, then we should. That's what's so stupid about the "militants". If they want us out, all they have to do is quit raising hell.

But they're raising hell because no one on behalf of the US, except for a few, has promised a complete withdrawal. The US wants some form of American presence to stay in Iraq for good, which is the exact opposite of what the militants/terrorists/insurgents/whatever want. Everyday people like you and I would prefer an eventual complete withdrawal from Iraq, but that's not the plan at Washington.

 

[ashura]

I'm not sure how I can reply to this. Are you aware that Saddam ran a brutal regime of torture and oppression of all political opponents? Are you aware that he aggressively attacked Kuwait? Are you aware that he deliberately set out to commit genocide against the Kurds?

Do you approve of all those things?

Approval of those things isn't necessary to prefer Saddam's rule over what we have now. As I mentioned before, a few had it really bad under Saddam, but that's nothing compared to what life is like for the majority of Iraqis now. That's not even considering the Iraqis that have fled since the war began, I don't have any idea what happened to them.