Do Atheists ever doubt their belief?

[SkinWalker]

I continue to feel insulted at the attempted application of science to the question of God.

A wise man once said, "there are those for whom it is one's duty to offend." I'm afraid you'll just have to accept insult as a matter of course if you want to post or read in the religion section of a science board. There are many, many religious boards out there with science sections that would quickly ban me the first time I bothered to question their beliefs or attempted to defend scientific discourse. We don't do that here at SF, by the way.

You choose your beliefs, allow me mine. As long as I don't try to ram my beliefs down your throat, what do you care if I believe that your dog and parrot are conspiring to take over the world and enslave you?

Sure. You can believe whatever you like and I'll defend your right to do so. But what Fraggle was saying with his statement that "they're the wackos here" is that this is a science board and the science-minded are the natives. Those with religious superstitions and "offended" sensibilities are the foreigners. If you want to believe nonsense about my dog and non-existent parrot, that's your business. But the first time you make the public statement that you really, honestly believe my freedom is at their mercy, I get to ridicule you or, at the very least, criticize you.

 

[SkinWalker]

bleah. Next you'll say that philosophy is useless because it can't be examined properly using the scientific method.

On the contrary, philosophy is vital to scientific methods (there really are more than one). Its from philosophy (literally, Philosophy 101) that we learn logic and critical thought. In fact, I know many philosophers and, while they have some very different beliefs, not a one is a christian and only a couple have any sort of god belief, which they only entertain on deistic or perhaps pantheistic levels.

Belief is accepting something as true regardless of evidence or lack thereof.

To you. That much is clear. But, to the rational and critically thinking world, belief is simply cognitive content held as true. It's why one holds a belief that separates the rational from the irrational.

 

[Simon Anders]

A wise man once said, "there are those for whom it is one's duty to offend." I'm afraid you'll just have to accept insult as a matter of course if you want to post or read in the religion section of a science board.

Such as Fraggle's

It's really time for the religionists to simply fuck off. They're the wackos here, regardless of how badly they outnumber us.

It is interesting how broad the definition of duty can be interpreted.

There are many, many religious boards out there with science sections that would quickly ban me the first time I bothered to question their beliefs or attempted to defend scientific discourse. We don't do that here at SF, by the way.

Perhaps banning might be more honest.

Sure. You can believe whatever you like and I'll defend your right to do so. But what Fraggle was saying with his statement that "they're the wackos here" is that this is a science board and the science-minded are the natives. Those with religious superstitions and "offended" sensibilities are the foreigners.

Wow. I didn't think you noticed that.

Again. This sounds like banning would be more honest.

If you want to believe nonsense about my dog and non-existent parrot, that's your business. But the first time you make the public statement that you really, honestly believe my freedom is at their mercy, I get to ridicule you or, at the very least, criticize you.

Telling people to fuck off and that they are wackos is not criticism.

But I am just a wacko who should fuck off so what do I know. I have taught critical thinking, but my blind faith must have confused me about some of the principles.

H. Be Polite and Respectful
Be polite and respectful of other members, even if they are not to you, do not stoop to their rule breaking level! Instead report them rather then returning fire.

2. Personal Attacks or Abusive Ad Hominems

Posts which attack a person rather than his or her views will be edited to remove the unnecessary personal remarks, or deleted in entirely

Examples of acceptable posts include:
· You are wrong to say that Islam is a violent religion, because ...
· You obviously don't understand the situation, because ...
· Saying what you said clearly displays your ignorance of ...

Examples of unacceptable posts include:
· You are a stupid liberal, because you say Bush is wrong.
· You're just another DubyaTard who doesn't know anything about foreign relations.
· Anybody who'd write what you wrote must have severe psychological problems.

I think the rules should be edited.

I think it should also be made clear that foreigners should expect different treatment.

 

[SkinWalker]

Do Atheists ever doubt their belief?

Of course they do.

You are FULL of it & it prevents you from thinking.

I think you're being unfair to John. As an atheist, I'm a skeptic first and I doubt my beliefs all the time. Indeed, the doubt of my beliefs is the reason I'm an atheist.

I generally believe that people are basically good, but doubt this often.

I generally believe that I'm a good parent, but doubt this on occasion.

I generally believe that I can lose the extra 20 pounds I put on somewhere between age 35-42, but I'm starting to doubt this as well.

These doubts are what helps me keep a realistic perspective and doubt is an important part of science and rational thought.

I think the OP was asking if we, as atheists, ever doubt our general belief that there aren't one or more gods. To date, I've yet to see a reason to entertain such a doubt, but I'm willing and ready to once I see good reason to.

 

[SkinWalker]

Wow. I didn't think you noticed that.

If you're making that statement in context of the post I left in your complaint/bitch thread in the SF Gov forum, then perhaps you should read both posts again and take note of the time stamps and the promise to read this thread. I hadn't noticed. Now I did. I found no problem with his choice of words since I understood what he meant. I suspect you did as well.

Telling people to fuck off and that they are wackos is not criticism.

It seems critical to me.

But I am just a wacko who should fuck off so what do I know.

No. You're not a "wacko." You're being deliberately obstinate, taking advantage of Fraggle's metaphor to pretend you've been offended. What you should do is get over it and past yourself. Or just fuck off. You choose.

I have taught critical thinking, but my blind faith must have confused me about some of the principles.

Good for you. Or, "too bad for you." You decide which you prefer.

I think the rules should be edited.

You're permitted whatever thoughts you'd like. You're posts are getting off topic, however. This is metadiscussion and not topical discussion. You're previous post here was deleted for that reason by the way. As I promised in your SF Gov thread.

 

[StrangerInAStrangeLand]

“ Originally Posted by StrangerInAStrangeLa

“ Originally Posted by John99
Do Atheists ever doubt their belief?

Of course they do. ”

You are FULL of it & it prevents you from thinking. ”

I think you're being unfair to John. As an atheist, I'm a skeptic first and I doubt my beliefs all the time. Indeed, the doubt of my beliefs is the reason I'm an atheist.

I generally believe that people are basically good, but doubt this often.

I generally believe that I'm a good parent, but doubt this on occasion.

I generally believe that I can lose the extra 20 pounds I put on somewhere between age 35-42, but I'm starting to doubt this as well.

These doubts are what helps me keep a realistic perspective and doubt is an important part of science and rational thought.

I think the OP was asking if we, as atheists, ever doubt our general belief that there aren't one or more gods. To date, I've yet to see a reason to entertain such a doubt, but I'm willing and ready to once I see good reason to.

I think John was being not only unfair but very ignorant & arrogant by saying OF COURSE they do. Even I didn't say no atheist has any doubt tho it wouldn't make any sense since being an atheist is simply lacking a belief.
I think the title & OP come from the ridiculous belief that atheism is a belief.
I didn't say I or other atheists don't doubt anything at all.
IF I ever see good reason to believe gods exist, I'll believe gods exist. There's no doubt involved with that.
1111

 

[Crunchy Cat]

Do atheists ever find themselves doubting their beliefs.

You bet.

 

[StrangerInAStrangeLand]

Do theists doubt their beliefs about all the other gods?
1111

 

[SkinWalker]

I think John was being not only unfair but very ignorant & arrogant by saying OF COURSE they do.
I think the title & OP come from the ridiculous belief that atheism is a belief.
I didn't say I or other atheists don't doubt anything at all.
IF I ever see good reason to believe gods exist, I'll believe gods exist. There's no doubt involved with that.
1111

I agree with all this. I think if you'll take a second look, I was replying to your post, but my content actually responds, albeit indirectly, to John and the OP. I realized that you and others understood the OP for what it probably was: an attempt at critique on atheist philosophy.

The attempt appears to have failed in its mission to provide any critique that is useful.

 

[Captain Kremmen]

Re religionists:

They're the wackos here, regardless of how badly they outnumber us.

There are a few groups who come on this site with the main purpose of peddling some belief that they have. Racists, Creationists and Gun Lobbyists are among them. Others have very definite political views, and will quickly turn a discussion about squirrels into one about the situation in Gaza.
Creationists are probably the most annoying, which is probably what gets you so riled up.

When you say us, I think you mean atheists.
Most scientists are not atheists.
This is a report about a survey done in 2005.
http://www.livescience.com/strangenews/050811_scientists_god.html

Sure. You can believe whatever you like and I'll defend your right to do so. But what Fraggle was saying with his statement that "they're the wackos here" is that this is a science board and the science-minded are the natives.

Being science minded does not make you an atheist.
You may have thought a lot about the subject and consider that anyone who is properly science minded ought to become an atheist,
but that is a different matter.
Unless the people on this site are a very unusual group of scientists, half of them or more will be theists or agnostic.

 

[Simon Anders]

If you're making that statement in context of the post I left in your complaint/bitch thread

It was a sincere suggestion thread, which you may notice a couple of atheists agreed with. You obviously did not agree with the suggestion, but to now categorize as complaint bitch seems hardly moderate.

It seems critical to me.

Nah, that part is just an ad hom generalization. I am sure any literature on criticism or critical thinking will support me on this (said dryly).

No. You're not a "wacko." You're being deliberately obstinate, taking advantage of Fraggle's metaphor

Odd to think of it as a metaphor. It's a dead one in any case like nutjob. IOW literal now. I did not take 'fuck off' literally. That part I took colloquially. I can't see how I could possibly take advantage of his intentions let alone his words however artful in my hermaneutics.

to pretend you've been offended. What you should do is get over it and past yourself. Or just fuck off. You choose.

You entered a thread where I responded to Medicine Woman to point out that my 'grow up' was similar to her post. I thought that was good moderation at the time. Oddly though, as far as I can tell, you did not seem to think that she nor here Fraggle Rocker need similar reminders. In fact Fraggle should feel encouraged, that he is doing his duty, with his ad homs

You're permitted whatever thoughts you'd like. You're posts are getting off topic, however. This is metadiscussion and not topical discussion. You're previous post here was deleted for that reason by the way. As I promised in your SF Gov thread.

And your response post is here. Strange.

edit: Ah, now I understand which post you took out. In any case I will drop the subject here. You can reply in the SF gov thread if you want and take this one out too, also, if you think it is appropriate.

 

[Roman]

atheism is backed by evidence?

More like the evidence is contrary to theism.
So if you are disinclined to hold superstitions, that would make you...?

 

[Enmos]

The funeral was scary because he asked everyone in the audience to bow thier heads, then he said if anyone wishes to be touched by god and convert to be a believer all you have to do is glance up at me. Apparently some did and he said bless you or something like that and I thought it was over, then he said does anyone in this section over here and I thought holy crap he is trying to separate the believers and non-believers during the funeral service.

You shouldn't have bowed your head and instead have stared him straight in the face the entire duration of this fiasco.

 

[lightgigantic]

Actually, I would say it is now supported by evidence. There have been rigorous studies on prayer.

rigorous?

Evolution doesn't leave room for intelligent intervention.

comes with a stifling institution I guess

Physics hasn't noticed anything miraculous that would be necessary for reality as we know it to occur.

If physics wants to see a miracle it simply has to venture in the general direction of biology ...

 

[lightgigantic]

More like the evidence is contrary to theism.

once again, so atheism is backed by evidence?

 

[lightgigantic]

Do theists doubt their beliefs about all the other gods?
1111

some

others apply henology to a greater or lesser extent

 

[Blitz]

I have recently read an article that says that Mother Theresa suffered great doubts in her belief in God for many years before her death.

Do atheists ever find themselves doubting their beliefs.



Since when do Atheists believe in anything. I guess I believe in empirical evidence if that counts. Mother Theresa's story to me is a prime example of the hypocrisy of the church. Saints do not and will not ever truly exist. She was a human just like the rest of us. It was only natural for her to doubt her ways of thinking. She should have realized that we live in a godless world the first moment she witnessed the suffering of god's innocent children. The "pure" of heart are usually met with disappointment when they enter the capital of love and faith(the Vatican) only to realize it is corrupt and power hungry. Although this shouldn't be a surprise since it's a man made institution and man is flawed.

 

[John99]

How can someone go through life NOT questioning? I dont understand sooo many here. I dont.

 

[StrangerInAStrangeLand]

WHO said they go thru life not questioning???
1111

 

[Medicine*Woman]

*************
M*W: Questioning something does not always mean one is doubting it.