Did Nothing Create Everything?

SetiAlpha6 said:
I guess we should all go home, we are done here!
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True. I'll just be here a little while longer. I have proof that Santa is real, Big Foot (I can provide pictures of trees he was seen walking among) and several other "mysteries" that need some conclusive proof.
 
Here's a little thought experiment I always found interesting.

Start with a clean (mental) slate. Picture a world in which it was a fact that God exists. Imagine how you would think such a world would be.

Now picture a world in which is was a fact that God doesn't exist and imagine how you would think such a world would be.

Which picture most closely matches our real world?
 
SetiAlpha6 said:
Until I can post more information later, if you want to, just for fun, launch Google Earth, and paste in the coordinates provided below and just take a look around. Turn on the “3D buildings” and “Terrain” Layers in the left side menu of Google Earth, almost forgot!

This is Rephidim as described in the Bible, there is a shadow of a great monolithic stone, called the Split Rock here.

It is on a hill, is about 60’ high, about 40’ wide, and about 20’ thick, and is cracked or split right down the middle. The shadow and Split Rock can be seen slightly better or worse because of differences in lighting as the satellites were going over at any particular time. So it is fun to step through the historical satellite images which can sometimes show different aspects of the area better. There is a button to access the history bar in the menu. I work in Civil Engineering and I use it fairly often for my project work.

Just copy and paste the coordinates, not including the description text, into the search box in Google Earth and hit enter. Hopefully that will work well for you.

SPLIT ROCK AT REPHIDIM
JESUS – THE SPRING OF SALVATION (LIVING WATER FROM THE ROCK)
28°43'36.92"N 35°14'10.07"E

SPLIT ROCK AT REPHIDIM – THE ALTAR MOSES BUILT
(ADONI NISSI, ADONI IS MY BANNER)
28°43'32.63"N 35°14'8.28"E

SPLIT ROCK AT REPHIDIM – WATER EROSION STILL VISIBLE
28°43'41.95"N 35°14'4.92"E

So take a look around if you wish, or don’t if you wish.

The Split Rock Site is located at Horeb, the Mountain of God.

Go ahead and laugh, and enjoy and look around if you want to. The Red Sea Crossing Site is approximately 30 miles to the West.

I will try and post some on the ground photos and other info later when I can.

You may want to try and debunk each piece of the puzzle individually, so you never have to look at or really consider the entire enchilada all at once.

And you are, of course, welcome to do that.

Back with more later, take care for now!
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I understand that because you have been doing your research for many years you may feel what you have posted is evidence, and let us assume for a moment it is evidence, the problem is you are not presenting a point and linking it to your claim. That is why folk are not taking you seriously.
The best way I can point out how it comes over is say if you stood by a pile of construction materials and pointed and proclaimed "house".
You may be able to visualise all the pieces coming together to build a house but if you wish to convey a house you need to step by step build it.
So to say look big rock Bible true will never work.
I suggest something like.
In para X such and such an author's said "rock" and described it thus.
In the bible the rock is described as big brown with a split. The rock I present is big and brown with a split. Present all the similarities. Then realise you have established that you have the very rock in the bible but all you have proved is the rock aspect of the story and that the only thing you have proved is its the same rock and that does not prove anything else. That is the point.
I will to move things along agree this is the very same rock but want to know how we get from there to it proving god... That is the issue. As people point out many fictional characters are set in very real locations but establishing the location does not make the fictional character real.
Please stop and try to understand this ...it is very easy to do yet your wish for it all to be true corrupts your ability to rationalise anything.
All you can conclude is some references to places in the bible are references to actual places but you have not addressed if God exists.
And stop wondering why what you see is not obvious to others and realise it is because you really are not proving god only references in the bible are actual places.
Anyways I compliment you on your start but now you need to show how your observations prove god.
Alex
 
My exercise...

Who could explain the universe better.

Someone living in the bronze Age who does not know where the at Sun goes at night and that disease is caused by demons (together with many other miscinceptions ) or a team of well educated men reviewing data from the Hubble Space Telescope.

Next and it is absolutely critical that you address this because this is real evidence to suggest strongly Jesus is a fictional character.

Why are there many "human gods" through out history earlier than Jesus who have the same characteristics, 12 followers death and resurrection after three days.
To avoid any attempt at an answer means you are the one who fails to address real evidence.
Do you know about all the other human gods?
Try a Google along the lines of Jesus similar characters maybe.
But to ignore the fact Jesus was just more of the same means you are lieing to yourself.
I don't lie and I am so proud of that ...and in this world it is something to be proud of...and ignoring clear facts is the worst lie of all...lieing to yourself is as wrong as it gets.
So imagine ..you tell the kid there is no Santa, you explain how you put the presents under the tree, you explain how you drank milk and ate the cookies, you explain how it is physically impossible for Santa to deliver millions of presents and you explain that raindeer can not fly...and after all this the kid says..no I know Santa is real...it is then you realise the Santa story has caused great harm as the kid is incapable of rational thought and creates a fantasy world rather than face reality.
Alex
 
Seattle said:
True. I'll just be here a little while longer. I have proof that Santa is real, Big Foot (I can provide pictures of trees he was seen walking among) and several other "mysteries" that need some conclusive proof.
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Ha Ha! Bigfoot saw me but nobody believes him!
 
Xelasnave.1947 said:
My exercise...

Who could explain the universe better.

Someone living in the bronze Age who does not know where the at Sun goes at night and that disease is caused by demons (together with many other miscinceptions ) or a team of well educated men reviewing data from the Hubble Space Telescope.

Next and it is absolutely critical that you address this because this is real evidence to suggest strongly Jesus is a fictional character.

Why are there many "human gods" through out history earlier than Jesus who have the same characteristics, 12 followers death and resurrection after three days.
To avoid any attempt at an answer means you are the one who fails to address real evidence.
Do you know about all the other human gods?
Try a Google along the lines of Jesus similar characters maybe.
But to ignore the fact Jesus was just more of the same means you are lieing to yourself.
I don't lie and I am so proud of that ...and in this world it is something to be proud of...and ignoring clear facts is the worst lie of all...lieing to yourself is as wrong as it gets.
So imagine ..you tell the kid there is no Santa, you explain how you put the presents under the tree, you explain how you drank milk and ate the cookies, you explain how it is physically impossible for Santa to deliver millions of presents and you explain that raindeer can not fly...and after all this the kid says..no I know Santa is real...it is then you realise the Santa story has caused great harm as the kid is incapable of rational thought and creates a fantasy world rather than face reality.
Alex
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Amen, I never lied to my kids, never taught them Santa was real, only that God was.

My Dad was healed by God. But that is supposed to be impossible, of course. Not impossible at all.

I have to resize photos and get everything together before I post any more info for your review.

We have to get ready for a Halloween Party we are having tomorrow night, so my time is limited at the moment. Just put some decorations up outside.

You are certainly welcome to reject anything I post later, if you wish to.
 
SetiAlpha6 said:
Amen, I never lied to my kids, never taught them Santa was real, only that God was.

My Dad was healed by God. But that is supposed to be impossible, of course. Not impossible at all.

I have to resize photos and get everything together before I post any more info for your review.

We have to get ready for a Halloween Party we are having tomorrow night, so my time is limited at the moment. Just put some decorations up outside.

You are certainly welcome to reject anything I post later, if you wish to.
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You do know that anything that can be explained by "God did it" can be explained in other ways as well.
 
SetiAlpha6 said:
My Dad was healed by God.
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Well that should be easy to prove as most people only get healed by doctors who rely upon years of training in the science of medicine.
SetiAlpha6 said:
You are certainly welcome to reject anything I post later, if you wish to.
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So far you have not presented anything that needs rejecting because it has all been only your belief with nothing in support that can be rejected.
So I guess you are too busy to make enquiries about the fact there have been (over ten maybe fifteen) many human gods before Jesus with the same attributes like 12 followers and death and resurrection after three days..why three days? . I thought you may care to look and marvel at ten coincidences.
Alex
 
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I really don't like the Halloween thing...only conditions kids to believe in BS and perhaps gives some night mares.
What does it celebrate..do you know.
Alex
 
I really don't like the Halloween thing...only conditions kids to believe in BS and perhaps gives some night mares.
What does it celebrate..do you know.
Alex
SetiAlpha6 said:
I have to resize photos and get everything together before I post any more info for your review.
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Get an app and do it on your phone. Play store, search, photo resize, free, download, done.

Alex
 
Regarding "God" healing. People get sick and with certain conditions a high percentage of them die but the body is a complicated thing and not all do.

In our everyday life, we get sick and the body usually heals itself. Doctors may make us more comfortable but our bodies generally do the healing on their own.

When doctors say that someone will likely die in 2 months and then they don't...that's not God healing them. That's one of the small percentage of cases when the disease simply doesn't result in death.

I hit a patch of dry ice on a road once and my car did a 360 while going 45 mph. The black ice happened to end when my car was pointed straight ahead and the car didn't roll and I was able to continue driving without harm.

I know someone who had a similar experience yet he is convinced that God was looking out for him that day because "I know I'm not that good a driver".

You can stick "God did it" into any scenario as an explanation. It doesn't mean that it's factual.
 
Seattle said:
I know someone who had a similar experience yet he is convinced that God was looking out for him that day because "I know I'm not that good a driver".
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And these folk if they are saved on the operating table never thank the doctors but oh yes god.
And miracles...god saved this child falling off a building they never ask why doesn't god save the thousand who die daily..
And what is worse they just don't see their problem.
I liked your comparison of worlds.
Alex
 
Xelasnave.1947 said:
And these folk if they are saved on the operating table never thank the doctors but oh yes god.
And miracles...god saved this child falling off a building they never ask why doesn't god save the thousand who die daily..
And what is worse they just don't see their problem.
I liked your comparison of worlds.
Alex
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Here, after a boxing match, the winner often won't talk to the reporter until thanking God for giving him the talents to beat a man half to death. Thanks God. Praise be to Allah.
 
I watch international soccer games. The players on both sides may very often fall to their knees, cross themselves, gaze beseechingly at heaven and so forth. Yet, only one team wins. Wonder whether that's more a function of the relative skill of their goalkeepers than of their relative piety.
 
Jeeves said:
I watch international soccer games. The players on both sides may very often fall to their knees, cross themselves, gaze beseechingly at heaven and so forth. Yet, only one team wins. Wonder whether that's more a function of the relative skill of their goalkeepers than of their relative piety.
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God plays favorites. I hear he is a betting man and never loses. It's a good gig if you can get it.
 
SetiAlpha6 said:
Do you believe that Nothing created Everything?
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I don't like the way the question is worded. First off, I'm not comfortable with the word 'created' since the word seems to me to suggest intention, agency and purpose. And second, I don't think of 'nothing' (even capitalized) as if it is a particularly dark or blank kind of something.

So I think that I'd reword your question to something like this: 'Does 'nothing', understood as the absence and lack of everything including explanatory principles, provide us with explanatory principles sufficient to explain reality?

Pretty obviously the answer is 'no'.

That's my basic objection to the 'something from nothing' theorists. There have been several previous threads about that.
 
SetiAlpha6 said:
Yes, or we could just go with “if the shoe fits?”

Regarding probabilities, what is the probability that life arose by chance and natural processes. And why do people still believe in that anyway?
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Nothing else to believe in. Some people simply don't have faith. Not there fault or problem?
 
Yazata said:
I don't like the way the question is worded. First off, I'm not comfortable with the word 'created' since the word seems to me to suggest intention, agency and purpose. And second, I don't think of 'nothing' (even capitalized) as if it is a particularly dark or blank kind of something.

So I think that I'd reword your question to something like this: 'Does 'nothing', understood as the absence and lack of everything including explanatory principles, provide us with explanatory principles sufficient to explain reality?

Pretty obviously the answer is 'no'.

That's my basic objection to the 'something from nothing' theorists. There have been several previous threads about that.
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Do you have an opinion on your based on your reformed post standards?
 
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