Destroy organised religion?

[seekeroftheway]

Since you mentioned Jimi Hendrix, I will go easy on you. Although, I don't share my birthday with him, yet I am a musician also. Fancy that...



Not sure what your mean here... I'm just talking about religion. A theist always tries to make a big deal out of the word 'belief' and apply it to non-believers with equal meaning which isn't valid.

No, and, not to brag, but a lot of people say I'm really good at both of them. PERHAPS there's a connection.


That they do, and it isn't valid, but that isn't the purpose of their faith, it's simply a tendency akin to it. Can you imagine what would happen to all the Christians in the world if they suddenly realized for a fact and without a doubt that God did not exist? That everything they've ever believed in is a lie? Can you imagine the chaos that would ensue from that?

 

[KennyJC]

That they do, and it isn't valid, but that isn't the purpose of their faith, it's simply a tendency akin to it. Can you imagine what would happen to all the Christians in the world if they suddenly realized for a fact and without a doubt that God did not exist? That everything they've ever believed in is a lie? Can you imagine the chaos that would ensue from that?

Well again, I'm not sure what your point is. If your point is, does all fanatical believers losing faith mean that there will be chaos? Well probably. Those people were unstable to start with, which significantly explains the social dysfunction of all countries with deep religious values.

Or do you mean if we progressed to a secular world? I think secular democracies are already setting the bar for that potential, and they are showing we would have nothing to worry about. Although it's a bit hard for secularism to flourish when you have peoples of all religious groups in conflict in one way or another. Catholics, Prodestants, Christians, Jews, Muslims.

 

[seekeroftheway]

My point is that you seem to think that all believers in a higher power are fanatic, well, that's incorrect. You seem to have fallen prey to the few fanatics that stand out above the rest and give their faith a bad name.

And I disagree, your point of view on secular government is entirely materialistic. Religion behind rule is what orients our society to be something unique. Sure secular cultures would be more prosperous, but frankly, they'd be kind of robotic. Without something to believe in, what do these societies strive for?

 

[geeser]

Can you imagine what would happen to all the Christians in the world if they suddenly realized for a fact and without a doubt that God did not exist? That everything they've ever believed in is a lie? Can you imagine the chaos that would ensue from that?

theres been chaos before, once the chaos is over common sense will prevail.

My point is that you seem to think that all believers in a higher power are fanatic, well, that's incorrect.

why?, if the minds are clouded by thoughts of fantasy, they are extremly dangerous, has as been proven since the begining of aledged civilisation. the most good and sensible leaders, we've had, have been non-believers or agnostics/atheist.

And I disagree, your point of view on secular government is entirely materialistic. Religion behind rule is what orients our society to be something unique.

rubbish, religion is the direct cause of the problems, take it away and the problem is solved.

Sure secular cultures would be more prosperous, but frankly, they'd be kind of robotic. Without something to believe in, what do these societies strive for?

without the wish to kill each other, and to have a common goal, to do what is in our nature to do explore, advance without being held back by religion.
and to be humans for humanity, not for some non-existent imaginary comfort blanket.
if it's to be robotic then, bring on the robotic world.
I'm all for it, rather that than stupidity.

 

[Lerxst]

religion is the direct cause of the problems, take it away and the problem is solved.

If only it were that simple.

Blaming religion for the existence of social evils is like blaming gasoline for the existence of arson.

Like gasoline, religion is volatile and dangerous. We all agree on that. But it doesn't cause the problem in and of itself. And without the gasoline, the arsonist will still find a way to do his work.

The invention of organized religion x thousand years ago didn't suddenly cause a peaceful species to become warlike and murderous. It is simply part of our evolutionary makeup.

 

[iam]

If only it were that simple.

Blaming religion for the existence of social evils is like blaming gasoline for the existence of arson.

Like gasoline, religion is volatile and dangerous. We all agree on that. But it doesn't cause the problem in and of itself. And without the gasoline, the arsonist will still find a way to do his work.

The invention of organized religion x thousand years ago didn't suddenly cause a peaceful species to become warlike and murderous. It is simply part of our evolutionary makeup.

But it would help. The reasons and excuses would be more in the open.

 

[seekeroftheway]

theres been chaos before, once the chaos is over common sense will prevail.why?, if the minds are clouded by thoughts of fantasy, they are extremly dangerous, has as been proven since the begining of aledged civilisation. the most good and sensible leaders, we've had, have been non-believers or agnostics/atheist. rubbish, religion is the direct cause of the problems, take it away and the problem is solved.
without the wish to kill each other, and to have a common goal, to do what is in our nature to do explore, advance without being held back by religion.
and to be humans for humanity, not for some non-existent imaginary comfort blanket.
if it's to be robotic then, bring on the robotic world.
I'm all for it, rather that than stupidity.

No, religion is simply a motivator. If you take away religion and form a MORE prosperous culture, then the government will be even more corrupted by power. Just now they won't have some prerogative to follow, they can do whatever they want with it. In my opinion, taking away religion all together would be a detriment, not a boon.

 

[seekeroftheway]

But it would help. The reasons and excuses would be more in the open.

And what would that accomplish? Oh, we know WHY he's corrupt and WHY he's abusing his power, now what do we do? He still has all the power. With religion, whether or not it be true that God or Allah or whoever watches over us, they set a guideline to follow. When a leader abuses power, the people can stand and say this goes against whatever deity we worship and he'll strike you down or make your life horrible or your going to hell or something, and because that leader is of the same culture, it should inspire fear or something in him. If it doesn't, he's REALLY fanatic and doomed to fall of his own accord.

 

[iam]

And what would that accomplish? Oh, we know WHY he's corrupt and WHY he's abusing his power, now what do we do? He still has all the power. With religion, whether or not it be true that God or Allah or whoever watches over us, they set a guideline to follow. When a leader abuses power, the people can stand and say this goes against whatever deity we worship and he'll strike you down or make your life horrible or your going to hell or something, and because that leader is of the same culture, it should inspire fear or something in him. If it doesn't, he's REALLY fanatic and doomed to fall of his own accord.

Yes, I see what you mean. But leaders need the support of their followers or they will fall no matter what is believed or not. If they don't like the guideline, they can take it down and will and forge a new one. In the same token, if a leader does not believe in diety but sees himself as a deity, which is usually the case, then they are screwed just the same. Believe me, people use god for their benefit and will adjust themselves accordingly. Even christians do this, most are not real altruists. In the end, religion is not the only guideline to run a society or even control it. Look at atheistic nations. Politically, fundamental religiosity is just an excuse to not face your fellow man on an equal playing field. Through their ego they are purposely equating themselves with a god and actions justified. Why should we help them along with something so inane as religion? Why support the circus act?